I don't want to play alone

I can't figure out a good way to put this and would love to talk it out... I think this game sucks without a group of 4+ people that have prior experience which will not help us add new players. We need it to be good for the new people. I have things I can say are wrong but I don't feel like I can write it correctly. Hopefully another vote in the "still a long way from right" helps.

That said, the use-based system brought a lot of people back but there are a lot of complaints because it's not actually use based... the skills increase and the actual viability isn't there until you level up... for those of you who haven't figured it out yet the adventure level can be found in 'V' and until you're 10+ you can't fight 90% of the stuff solo and until you're 40+ you can't do much of the "harder" stuff... exactly how it's been since R4+

I'm extremely happy with the direction but there's still a long way to go for it to be right. I'm just making the feedback and opening myself up for the availability incase someone wants to get me in a 1-on-1 chat as to why they know I'm available.

 

If your issue is that you get dropped into the game and can't tackle anything unless you know how to play and where to go buy better armor to stand toe to toe with certain monsters I agree with you, and I think they're slowly working on that.

I have no issue with needing to increase your skills to higher levels to tackle the "harder" stuff though. If you can tackle the harder stuff at level 10 then the game's going to be without challenge. I don't want to have to group up to adventure or feel that I am gimped if I don't group up though either. I don't think solo play should be more rewarding than group play, but there needs to be a balance where it's not punishing to play solo.

 

If you'd done pre-alpha in UO you might have said the same thing. Your knowledge is advanced so you're projecting your capabilities on less experienced players, maybe. And you are a hardcore gamer. I think the game will be fun for news, don't worry.

 

I think that right now there is way too much level gating and it's all designed for group play. I don't want to be required to play in a group. I want to be able to play with my wife who is incredibly casual or my 7 year old daughter... both of them will be idling and I'll basically be doing solo player damage. If this game doesn't get to that point why is there a single player mode? Why is there a friends play mode?

I thought this release would fix that due to use based and going away from adventure levels but I can tell you right now that adventure levels are still gating people and we've tested/verified that if you level up your adventure level you do way better... the issue with level gating everything is that when you level gate for 5 players you're making it so 1 player can't win without taking 4 companions with them... that sucks. I'm the Avatar. I want to be a hero. I want to play the game as a hero. That's my opinion and I am a heavy multiplayer user but I'm also going to do a lot of play with only my family if everything works how I want. That's how I've planned it since before the Chicken Room release. That's one of the things that attracts me to this game. The ability to play through the game with my wife and daughter and then switch modes and play with my friends and new people... the same game. Then I can talk to my wife about what I did tonight in the game with my friends and she'll 100% get it and we'll have a conversational piece.

This is what I want, it might not be what I get, but that's why I'm in the feedback forum and not the bug forum.

 

My wife won't play. That's the issue. I'm still waiting to get a release that is easy enough that she'll play by herself. The system is overly complex for her before this... now that it's easier everything can't be killed easy enough for her. To be fair, I can't kill 90% of the game solo either.

I don't feel like derailing my feedback here so I'm going to stop responding to people. I want to progress things forward. My purpose wasn't to rip the game apart or tear it down. It's to offer productive feedback. If I say negative over and over that's not going to happen. I love this game and I want to see it be everything I imagine for it to be. Cheers!

 

Several people I have tried to turn onto Shroud have given up on it pretty quickly. One reason stated was that they felt cut-off from others.

 

I dunno ....... I enjoy adventuring solo and in a group. And the social aspects are quite strong and aside from the chat system you don't need to know much to participate. I do agree that it could be frustrating for new players who don't understand the mechanics yet. But aren't most games like that at first? At least games with substantial depth? Isn't the challenge of leveling an incentive to keep playing and ultimately, if stuctured well, the payoff will come?

In-game tutorials could be stronger. Starter tutorial could be more comprehensive. We could have a well publicized hand-holding program to link new players with experienced players.

 

It's called a regional chat.

 

What does that have to do with being able to solo something?

I think they really haven't done a balance pass where they scale the encounters to the group involved. Also, there is virtually no storyline elements added yet.

 

It has a lot to do with it. Like the fact that new players can feel in the dark about mechanics, finding groups, guilds, socializing etc. It can be difficult just starting out in this game and with no immediate outlet for support, it can be a turn-off. Wanting to do dungeons and bosses that require (or should require) a group, but not having a real in-game mechanic for finding one unless it's people in your guild is a hindrance. I could go on.

 

I'm not sure what is wanted here. I have always been a fan of the progressive difficulty system, to coin a phrase. As you started out in the Ultima games, the local bandits were fairly low level - although they could still kill you. As you advance, gain stats etc, you can deal with them more easily; you move on to different and more demanding territory. And at the end of the game (single player game, note) there is usually an uber-tough mob to defeat.

In a MMO like Shroud, the whole territory is theoretically available. New players will hopefully be joining constantly, so they need a "kindergarten" area where they can go and sort of survive in the initial phases. That's where I am right now, just looking for a wet paper bag to fight with!

As experience and skill grow, there are more distant and dangerous areas to explore. The sense of satisfaction obtained the first time you can actually put down an elder wolf, or a ghost, is unbelievable. And you can - eventually - do many things solo; it just takes time and patience. I have soloed many areas, including the dungeons, Spectral Mines and foothills, Nth Brightbone forest etc. But along with that comes the knowledge that these are areas that you just cannot do early in the game, unless you have a horde of friends.

I love the sense of achievement, and the feeling of progressively mastering the environment. I personally would not have it any other way.

Introductory tutorials etc can and I'm sure will be refined. And the story will come in last. If the progress so far on the game is any guide, I think the end result will be nothing short of spectacular.

 

How did you find your paper bag?

 

The problem is that leveling in a multiplayer game is designed to gate customers by default.

Boss characters. Hunting areas. These are created for a level based system. In a true open world those things don't exist. It's like we're trying to play Zelda with 10 other people that may be at different parts of the story.

The truth is that as long as we're using levels to determine player skill, this will always happen. If you think of nonlevel based games like street fighter, chess, Stargate defender, whatever. What's the common feature between all of them?

A person can play and have all the tools at their finger tips from the start. You don't gain an arbitrary advantage the more you kill things. You're either good or you're not.

 

This is what I was hoping to see when they said levels would give you breadth of skills, rather than power. Unfortunately, that is not the case at all. Even advancing in single skills just increases the damage they do.

The only way I see to level the system so casuals will play is to further flatten the levels. Instead of starting all combat skills at effectively zero (untrained, unskilled, can barely hit anything), start everyone at mild competency (around the current skill level 25-30, in my estimate). Effectively, everyone can now use any weapon without feeling like they are floundering. Then its also not a big leap to work on skilling up; 25 to 50 is not as huge a mental leap as 0 to 50, even tho it is not a LOT more work.

Crafting skills I'm fine with starting low, mostly because those who are drawn to them will want to pick and choose. But that small lower cap on combat skills is going to help get a lot more casual folks in the game.

 

Tough but doable The wolves and spiders are another matter entirely

 

Violation I've re-read this thread and came to the conclusion that this is really all about your wife not wanting to grind so she can be a leet PvP'er and monster dominator like yourself. You just need a good tummy rub, and a conversation with your better half that once she learns the mechanics she will advance quickly and the fun will only increase. Or maybe she can enjoy the social aspects of the game without having to get into leveling up.

But to me, the more intricate the game design, and the tougher the challenge, the better. Generally speaking.

 

Game has to be able to be completed solo...

 

Agree and I adventure mostly solo. I see no reason why it can't be completed solo with the current build.

 

I feel strongly that the game has to be able to be completed solo, but there are really two games here.
The main story is a solo adventure. You mastering truth, love, courage, and completing the story.
But then we have this MMO overlay, which is a group thing, and is never completed.
There will be areas of the world a solo player can't go, and perhaps monsters that will be impossible to solo.
That's fine, as long as the story can be completed solo.
We won't see the solo story until launch.

 

Yeah, no kidding...

Yeah, well, I'd like side quests to be solo and very small party achieved as well... not just the main story. That's my feeling but, again, just my feedback.