Idea On Lore and How We Can Help.

Friends, Avatars, New Britannians, lend me your ears! I come not to bury Shroud but to praise it! The faults that may have transpired in the past are known, but the good already done must not be forgotten. So let it be with Shroud of the Avatar.

Now that I have your attention...

I have been doing a lot of thinking over the past few weeks, since the "restructuring", and like many of you are very concerned with the future of the game. I have gnashed teeth, vented frustrations, and finally introspection...courtesy of a forum thread by @Corv. Reading through the many posts, I soon realized that most of what was being said had a number of commonalities. Outside of acting as a cathartic outlet (certainly for me anyway), it raised a number of concerns about the state of the game. Which got me thinking, "Ok, but what can I do to help Portalarium during this difficult time?"

I realized, a lot of what was being stated, I could really do nothing about. I can't fix the combat, I can't fix the quests or the story line...so what can I do to make the game better and help Portalarium? Then, after reading @HoustonDragon 's post it came to me like a bolt of lightening! In a moment much attune to what drunk's call "a moment of clarity", I had my epiphany. LORE! I can help with the lore! The other items are in Portalarium's court, but the lore is something we can all potentially assist with.

I think we can all recognize and appreciate that the game most likely won't change much moving forward. The bandwidth, time and money just isn't there currently. Portalarium's focus is where it should be and that's fixing bugs, polishing and increasing performance. Lore on the other hand, is something we the players can focus on and help create. Some of you might be thinking, "Sound's great, so what's your idea?" Well, I am so glad you asked...

My initial thoughts, would be the implementation of more books and scrolls that the player can find and/or buy at one of the NPC stores. The focus of such lore would be varied, but would touch on areas really not explained well in the game. It would also bridge the gap from what we learned in Blade of the Avatar. Some such areas might include:

1. Obsidian Empire (Who are they? What Happened to them? Where are they now? What happened to their magic? Etc.)
2. The Cataclysm (How did it happen? What was life like afterwards?)
3. Local Histories (How did Ardoris come to have two rulers? Who/What caused the ruins? Who built Ravensmoor? What is the history of Owl's Head etc.?)
4. The Titans (What happened to them during/after the Cataclysm?)
5. Heroes & Villains (stories about folks like Aren Bennis, Syenna, Karpasic etc.)

The list could go on forever, the content certainly is there to drive innovation of thought for new material and lore. Now obviously someone at Portalarium would have to review and approve the content that is submitted and I think we all know the perfect person for such a prestigious honor. The man. The myth. THE LEGEND... @Scottie being the obvious choice. Not to put more work on our favorite loremaster's shoulders, but there really isn't anyone else I could think of, who cares and enjoys LORE as much as he. I know he is busy right now getting the physical goods together, but once that is finished perhaps he might consider taking on the mantle of such a task (that and getting that darned filled bookcase in game! )

Some of you might argue that this was done before, or that much of the aforementioned areas will be in Book 2, etc., etc. etc. So what? At least it gives the game just a little taste, an extra bit of flair if you will, of what life is/was like and why WE as Outlanders and eventually Avatars should CARE about this new world we have been transported to. The Ultima games did SUCH a great job at pulling US into the world that we would read every tidbit of information that could be found. I will never forget the goosebumps I felt when discovering Iolo's ramshackle hut in U7 and reading Gwenno's note about the Serpent Isle. Stuff like that is awesome and great foreshadowing!

Finally, if @Lord British , @DarkStarr and @Scottie would agree to such an undertaking it would need to be a streamlined process that wouldn't detract from the current game development. Like submitting a writing sample for a job interview, individuals who are interested would do the same. Scottie would chose those writers predicated on their SHORT writing sample and knowledge of past and current lore. Those individuals would then be free to submit content (1-2 pieces) for approval, which would be done on a timetable convenient for Portalarium. This is just a suggestion on process, to minimize potential bottlenecks and increase efficiency, it's truly up to Portalarium.

So in closing, I would simply say to all my fellow Outlanders and Avatars, "Ask NOT what Shroud of the Avatar can do for you! But what YOU can do for Shroud of the Avatar!"

 

Your enthusiasm is always infectious man!

I hope you succeed where others have failed, and you don't end up realizing that, like the Mines of Moria, you dug too deep and released a Balrog. "Be on your guard. There are older and fouler things in the deep places of the world."

 

Thanks Vyrin!

Except you made one mistake my friend, the Balrog is already upon us! Even if we share the same fate as our beloved Gandalf, action must be taken! Never forget, that like the legendary Phoenix, rising from the ashes, so shall we!

 

A few problems I see with something like this.

• There is already a contract in place for Tracy Hickman and Richard to write two more sequels to Sword of Midras.
• Richard hasn't fully accounted for history that might be required for Episodes 3-5.
• It would require someone to oversee everything to make sure individual bits of lore do not contradict each other, or interfere with future plans. That would require the first two bullets to be fully mapped out before any additional lore could be introduced.
• Presentation of the lore is a problem. The game needs to have a consistent voice, so we can't just slap text into books and assume everything is good.
• We don't fully know Richard's vision for the game. Even once the full outline for the game exists, it doesn't tell us everything that we need to know to get to the current state of the game. Scottie has some of this thought out, and has talked about it during telethons before, but even that isn't set in stone.

So yes, I'd love to contribute. I'd do anything I can to help make this a great game. However, I don't think this is the right time for us to be trying to contribute new content. My hope is, players might be able to contribute assets again for Episode 2, but I don't see player-based lore coming online until much later.

 

Now you did it...

 

Thank you for your thoughts, Cordelayne!

At the moment you could produce your ideas inside of books

May be someday we have tools to provide more player input in another way ...

 

Indeed...

 

@Browncoat Jayson

Good points, to be sure. My initial thoughts were to include lore that was somewhat broad but consistent with what we know and could fit into LB's vision. Perhaps our esteemed leader might be able to help in this endeavor? Again, I recognize the need not to detract from any current work.

I do disagree with you on a consistent voice. The consistency should be in the veracity of the lore and it's ability to adhere to what is deemed "canon", you might say. Otherwise, the voice should be markedly different because authors are different. Points of view are different and often biased! That is to say, the voice of the Obsidian's would be dramatically different from that of the Titans when discussing the Fall, for example. It would be fun to read the varying opinions of the two, because they would be so disparate in tone and style.

At any rate, I believe there is no greater time than the present to try and implement new content like this. Yes, it is more work, but what if there is no episode 2 and beyond? With the help of a few, we could add in new content that breathes new life into the game. Something that ties your character, to this new world, to this New Britannia!

 

It's wonderful that the discussion of gathering, clarifying, and properly collating Shroud's lore has recently come under discussion, not just outside Portalarium, but within its halls as well! Just yesterday and today there has already been some momentum in that direction as Keith, Richard, and myself began discussing elements of our existing lore that need to be properly archived and made easily available (including many of those same topics you mentioned above @Cordelayne ) Many of these things have been hinted at here on the forums, in bits and pieces as we created lore-specific art here and there, or built maps from time to time that drew directly from (and expanded upon) the lore mentioned in "The Sword of Midras"...

I will be helping to do this as much as possible over the following months, as time allows, while I also engage in what I did last year in March of 2017 when I began focusing on Shard for a time. Starting in July, I will continue my efforts here at Portalarium, but at an even more reduced schedule for a while (one or two days a week instead of the four I’m now working)... This year Shard Studios is attending Gen Con 2018, and I'm preparing for that over the next month, while simultaneously working hard on our third book, the "World Guide", which coincidentally will also focus primarily on properly collating and expanding all the fiction for the SHARD RPG universe... Interestingly enough, the presentational format of the lore we are working on for Shard might actually work nicely for SotA as well, as it addresses the concern for handling "multiple voices" when it comes to lore presentation.

Markedly-different voices become wonderful if each voice represents a particular "scholar" or "historian" persona presenting some tidbit or section of the lore that happens to fall into the realm of their researched specialty... There could be an "Albus Kensington, Master of Obsidian Histories", or a "Larena Farfield, Scribe of Verdantis", or a "Sorelia, Mistress of Elven Lore"... Though I won't necessarily always be at the office, if there were a good and easy way to make these available online, such as in a special Google Docs location that anyone could look at but only the creator and a few of us here at Portalarium could edit, then we could actually creatively touch them at any time we please while making them available for all to see! The cool thing about that is, until they are edited, existing errors could always be attributed to the failings of that mythical scholar personality, in the same way ancient historians such as Pliny and Herodotus often has wild tales of supposed events that became popular "historical" readings, even though they were full of errors... These writings wouldn't need to be "canon" per-se, just close enough for us to edit later as needed, and they can be polished as we go for greater and greater accuracy, perhaps with added content! As they become edited on our end, and potentially/eventually accepted as correct "canon", then they could be "locked' and preserved in that state...

The @Mad Hatter has been wanting to work with me to focus in on the histories of the part of Novia pertaining to Xenos for quite some time... Adding those works to an even larger collection that I'm describing would be excellent! And who knows, getting as much detail and filler-history crystalized as is reasonable (considering the freakish nature of what citizens are able to remember about pre-Cataclysm times) might help Richard and Tracy eventually work on stuff as Episode 2 begins ramping up...

Anyway,...this is all very exciting...

Scottie ^_^

 

Soo.. my reply to a similar post was fairly accurate..

*giggles maniacally*

All is proceeding as I have foreseen..

-Met

 

@Scottie, thank you for always taking the time to read and thoughtfully respond! Your leadership and constant willingness to discuss and expand on ideas is always appreciated. You have my ebullient thanks. More importantly, congratulations and cheers on Shard Studios! It is exciting to hear about SHARD RPG and we all look forward to hearing about it's success at GenCon 2018.

As things move forward, it is great to know that the lore is getting more attention and that no matter where folks may be, access to that information will be available for all to read and enjoy. Thanks Scottie!

 

Sounds good. I like Shrouds Lore (except the elves).

 

I think Scottie is more like Gandalf in this situation. Many of us have been lore-starved from the get go. Just imagining that there might be more in the future, whether it actually comes to fruition or not, is encouraging.

 

One thing I should mention, though, so as to manage expectations up-front, is that regardless of who might be the "Gandalf" in this situation, the possible "Balrog" that could get in the way of letting Portalarium use player-generated literary content (other than some of the bullet-points indicated Browncoat Jayson) might be a concern about the same copyright laws that keep folks like George R.R. Martin from ever reading any of the fan-fiction produced by his readers... He's literally been told by his lawyers that he has to stay away from even skimming over fan-created works, because if he uses any of the ideas presented in them he could be sued. Not because he's using their ideas for his writings (since, after all, his readers used George's ideas when creating their fan-fiction, and he's not suing them), but because the law would interpret that he's making money by adding their ideas to his works. It was a concern over this that caused Portalarium to decide that we would most likely not be able to make the giant library in Artifice contain every book that any player ever wrote, and that we would instead assume that we could only include books containing the automated journal entries from player's journals (plus any books and literature written by Portalarium employees)...

Of course, there may be ways around this, such as the "Creative Commons" license stuff used in Wiki pages that allow contributors to use verbatim writings and entries from Wikipedia sources (as long as they are cited in some way, I believe)... Portalarium could (and should) begin organizing all their lore in a nicely-organized site like that one under some kind of "Canon" heading for all to see and refer to, but before we start accepting and potentially using (or creating in-game books with) fan-based fiction/lore content, we'd need to figure out a way to make sure that some sort of "Creative Commons" licensing can apply to it that will allow Portalarium to make use of it without any legal fears...

My need to mention this concern comes from a direct conversation with @Sannio this morning, where we discussed the implications of setting up something like what I described in my earlier post above. He feels very strongly about making sure that any such attempts take into account possible legal issues,...as well as very clear expectations, up-front, concerning how much time any of us may have to actually read over and edit submissions (considering the recent down-scaling of staff to fit budget here at Portalarium), and how to limit those submissions to achieve the highest quality while not making it seem like a game of favoritism on Portalarium's part... I agree with his concerns thoroughly, regardless of the form this lore repository may take, and would love to find ways of solving these problems in advance... Portalarium still needs to organize, codify, and make more easily available its existing and ongoing lore,...but finding good and effective solutions for letting players add to that content would be a wonderful thing.

Looking back at @Cordelayne 's original post, I also realized that, for lack of solving the issues of using player-made fictional content I mentioned above immediately, another way to begin adding to the world's lore is by merely publishing one's own books in the game and organizing them and presenting them in ways that allow others in the game access... I've already begun doing things like this as my character Nimrond Ionescu, having published a poem based on actual in-game events, and a whimsical story loosely set in the world... I created these with the help of Minerva, gave her copies of them, and encouraged her to copy the writings and distribute them to others as part of her coffee-house... No one from Portalarium really has to oversee those writings, nor do they check them for validity or canonical correctness. These writings are merely the thoughts and tales of a travelling storyteller. They could be factual or fictional. A wandering "historian" character created by any player could do the same, and these volumes could be added to the game in any way they wish without any real oversight by Portalarium (with the exception of us removing things that were reported as offensive and contained things requiring us to delete them)... Assuming we at Portalarium are eventually able to get the "Bookshelf Container" items made, then those personally-placed bookshelves could contain loads an loads of player-driven content rife with legends and lore, and perhaps real history as well! If labeled and arranged properly, such books would list themselves in the inventory of the bookshelves like an alphabetical catalogue that could be easily perused by anyone looking into them...

Anyway,...just some more food for thought...

Scottie ^_^

 

If there were an in-game collection of books containing SotA lore then that's what I would decorate my library with.

 

I would love that (and happen to run a wiki that can do just that). I try to make sure everything I run across is in the wiki, but its hard when we don't have an official statement or idea of the intent behind certain things.

We have things like NPCs, Locations, Astronomy, etc, and add references from releases and developer posts as we can. We also welcome player-based information in the Community pages (we have both an "official" Astronomy page and a Community: Astronomy page, for example). Timeline wise, we even have a Calendar with dates of releases and other major events!

Any time you have content that you want us to add, feel free to shoot it to me in whatever form you prefer; links to Google docs, emails with attachments, direct messages, smoke signals, whatever. I'll get it posted, and if its official I can lock it down so it can be referenced but not edited.

 

This is my dream Scottie! A whole library FILLED to the brim with player made books, game lore, legends, etc. In fact, you have reminded me that I owe @Vyrin the second book in my own character lore!

 

I do own a library in Elad's Lighthouse (the Tower of Knowledge, use the Town Crier to find Jayson Albrecht's village lot). The first floor is official books and lore, and the second (and eventually third) floor is all player created work. There is a donation trunk outside if anyone wants to add their books to my growing collection.

Unfortunately, I've been busy and missed a lot of the series that have been ongoing. Hopefully I can remedy that soon.

 

I will most certainly stop by and feel free to visit my humble library in Brittany Estates. It does boast a fine art collection by Denis Loubet as well!