Founder/Benefactor Deed upgrades to Keep/Castle lots

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Mishikal, Feb 18, 2019.

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Should it be possible to upgrade Founder/Benefactor deeds to Keep and Castle lot sizes?

Poll closed Mar 4, 2019.
  1. Yes

    35 vote(s)
    53.0%
  2. No

    31 vote(s)
    47.0%
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  1. Fionwyn Wyldemane

    Fionwyn Wyldemane Avatar

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    Ahh that is a good point and *if* true something I had not considered. It sounds to me like the real concern here are the "Benefactor" TF PA City deeds which cannot upgrade. You may be right, but can either of us really predict the outcome of the decision to exclude both the Benefactor & Founder deeds from the Keep/Castle upgrade path?

    I tend to think that any type of PA deed will always be more desirable due to the fact that they are Place Anywhere. That plus there will always people who will never want to live in a POT or even spend the moola to upgrade their deeds.

    But I could be wrong. I've been wrong about a great many things! In any case, I appreciate the dialogue on this important issue. Thank you for the opportunity to share thoughts and exchange ideas. :)
     
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  2. smack

    smack Avatar

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    Actually, this was discussed during the KS and a promise was made about it. Subsequently, when Keeps and Castles were created, another promise was made to make these exclusive to pledge rewards. Thus, the situation we are in now.

    Not to stir the pot further, but they also stated tax free deeds would only be pledge rewards too, but it appears you can now convert any deed to a tax free deed for a fee...so...
     
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  3. Godra

    Godra Avatar

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    Again this is another *bleep* up by the Dev team. They talked about deed upgrades with COTO's, but never said what type of deeds, before R61. Or at lease they did not say anything about the TF Founder or Benefactor deeds when they did mention it. I can't speak for others and only myself, but I assumed it would be restricted to POT deeds (Taxed and Tax Free) and the Add-on store place anywhere deeds. I never assumed it would be any of the pledge reward deeds. I thought they were all exclusive and "Expired" items. If you didn't upgrade, purchase or were in a payment plan to a certain pledge level by a certain date, well, then you were out of luck. Then came R61 and it was implemented in live game play that you could upgrade any lot deed for COTO's, except the TF Benefactor/Founder Castle deeds because there wasn't anything else higher to upgrade too. It was available for a few weeks then the ability to upgrade to a TF Benefactor/Founder Keep and Castle deed was removed.

    So again, I make a statement and pose a question to @DarkStarr and @Chris … this action before thinking process isn't working well, especially with a lack of good communication on your part. We saw it with the Custom Duke Heads and now the deed upgrades. I am fine either way, but you just can't enter it in live game play that allows even 1 player to upgrade to either one of those lot types and then shut those two deed types down to the rest of the player base. Unless, that 1 (or how ever many others were able to upgrade) was reverted back and given back the COTO's spent. So, exactly how many deeds were upgraded to the Place Anywhere Tax Free Benefactor/Founder Keep or Castle Lot Deed; and how are you going to handle this situation?

    I am a RF Duke. I could really care less if someone could upgrade to a TF Founder Keep deed. I didn't pledge to get my money back. I didn't pledge that high because I wanted this as an "Investment". I did it because I wanted the items that came with that pledge level. I always assumed that someday in the future they would possibly have a Kickstarter for EP2 and would offer similar pledges or bundles. I never really thought of myself as being "Exclusive". I wonder if that is an available title in game???:rolleyes:
     
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  4. Godra

    Godra Avatar

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    Wow, that whole thread from 2013 tells the whole story. So basically they have changed face on just about everything with deed upgrades. So no TF status transfers to a taxed deed converting it to a TF deed because it would create a pledge loophole, but they did it anyway. Even though there is no more pledging. This whole game has been doomed since 2013. What they said years ago is really painting themselves in a corner. Things didn't work out as they or all of us thought it would, but because of statements and promises and wording....we keep chaining them to that same corner. As said before, I think we (us backers) need to see a bigger picture. Attracting new players with TF deeds (honey) is better than showing non obtainable items, such as a TF Place Anywhere Castle deeds and big Castle homes (vinegar) that only early backers with mucho dinero can have!!!
     
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  5. Uncle Ben

    Uncle Ben Avatar

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    A good solution to make TF Founder/Benefactor deed to be in a better position would be like as Thronwen suggested earlier.

    Allowing TF Founder deed to upgrade to something like "Tax Free Founder City lot Deed with POT only Keep/Castle lot access" or "Tax Free Founder Keep lot Deed with POT only Castle lot access (assuming upgraded from a TF Founder Keep deed)". These newly created TF Founder/Benefactor deeds will be able to make use of Keep /Castle sized lots, yet Port is not breaking any promises since the access to the exclusive lots will be POT only.

    Perhapse @DarkStarr or @Chris can let us know if such implementation can done to the current deed upgrade system.
     
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  6. Earl Atogrim von Draken

    Earl Atogrim von Draken Avatar

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    I had to chuckle on some of the replys here. I mean, I agree with you, but when in the history of SotA did a final ruling stopped People from discussing things over and over and over and over again and again ^^
     
  7. Mishikal

    Mishikal Avatar

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    How many times has a "final" ruling been backtracked on, too? I think if *anyone* upgraded their founder or benefactor deed to keep or larger during the window where that was available, and they were not forced down to a City size with a refund, then that option needs to be available to everyone.

    Also, the option to upgrade to deed so it support Keep/Castle in a POT also won't address the numerous empty Keep/Castle lots spread out across the NPC towns in the game, either. I.e., it's not like there's a lack of space availability currently for those size lots.
     
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  8. Earl Atogrim von Draken

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    Cool story.
    I will stick with my "no" non the less ;-)
     
  9. Floors

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    Yes, absolutely yes. Those other players, a majority of them abandoned the game, never even decorating their houses.

    Let those who play have a shot if they pony up their hard cash. Quit promising kickstarter backers stuff : they don't even like the game.
     
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  10. kaeshiva

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    I get it, on the no place-anywhere-castle-keep stuff. There's only so many place-anywhere castle-keep spots. And those are reserved for early supporters.

    The problem is a lot of those folks aren't using those spots, or are using their deeds in POTs, since POTs are more attractive places to live, generally, from a convenience standpoint. If I had a huge-mega-deed I'd certainly not want it up on top of a big hill somewhere that nobody is going to walk up in a town nobody goes in save for the occasional quest (if at all) ....long walk for me, no vendor visibility, have to travel for my devotionals, have to travel (possibly) for oracle daily, its just not attractive. This problem isn't just limited to the large deeds but just in general, we're seeing a lot of 'urban blight' in NPC towns - half of the spots seem to be taken up by 'log in once a year' types who are "holding" empty/unutilised spots which makes the towns even less desirable for players who want to live near one another, for example.

    Its not about a desirable place to live, its about status - and I think the early backers deserve that status, and if they want to plonk a big castle there, that's their right. I just wish there was a way to address all the empty spots cause it gives a bad impression.
     
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  11. Humbert_Humbert

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    Not sure how opening it up to additional people would affect current owners gameplay?
     
  12. Sean Silverfoot

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    Because folks do not play now, doesn't mean they won't come back in the future. The Castle/Keep lots need to be available in case they ever do. Folks that have those NPC Town spots and maintain them by the rules of the game, which means as long as they log in before the timer is up, it stays with them. They paid for the lot deed and are using them as required by the lot login rules.
     
  13. kaeshiva

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    Yeah, they aren't doing anything wrong, if they were, we wouldn't be having this problem lol. I'm not suggesting we take away what people paid for. That's why its a problem, until they either come play, miss a long term login, or sell, the NPC towns will be populated with placeholder lots, which is well, less than optimal result.
    There have been lots I've had my eye on since persistence, that are the "once every six month login" type languishing away cause the owner wont play and wont give it up. Eventually just forget about it, its more convenient to live in a POT anyway.
     
  14. Duke Gréagóir

    Duke Gréagóir Legend of the Hearth

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    I am calling BULLSHIP! I am a Royal Founder Duke pledge from the 2013 kickstarter. I love the game.

    SOME may not. In my opinion They are not the Majority.


     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2019
  15. Mishikal

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    There are lots of *unclaimed* castle & keep lots spread throughout the game. I've no problem with people who at least took the time to claim a lot and maintain their timer.

    Heck, the devs even started *removing* NPC towns because they're so empty. I ran around doing the devotional quests the other day, and it's pathetic how many NPC towns have 2/125 or whatever lots occupied.

    POTs completely destroyed the original land rush (which is fine, but it's really changed the game's property content significantly).
     
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  16. Mishikal

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    The fact that the devs have literally removed 3 NPC towns (I.e., removed some of those reserved lots) makes this argument invalid. Clearly they are no longer guaranteeing everyone will have the ability to claim a lot that was initially set aside for them. See the Release 58 Instructions:

    In fact, if they'd rolled out the deed upgrades first, then perhaps they never would have had to do this to begin with...
     
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  17. smack

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    Deed upgrades wouldn't have done much to the housing market. Just look at my survey from last December. There are over 5200 empty lots across 79 NPC and PRT towns. NPC towns are 57% claimed and PRTs are 8% claimed. There are over 300 POTs in the game and the vast majority of those are largely empty. There are far more empty lots than there are players, by a very large margin.
     
  18. Sean Silverfoot

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    Doesn't invalidate it all. Those are PRT towns, not storyline towns. Founders of the Duke/LOTM are guaranteed a spot in storyline towns. Those spots were factored in as such when they first started calculating deeds to lots. In doing so they are guaranteed a keep/castle lot in any storyline town, may not be the same spot but something will be available. Availability in PoT is not static, they are built and/or changed at a PoT owners whim.
     
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  19. Rufus D`Asperdi

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    They can also be restored just as easily, and new ones added, should the need arise. This is one of the advantages of SotA's unusual architecture. The same architecture that has provided nearly flawless uptime, and allows for a single instance of the game in which all Avatars reside.
     
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  20. Mishikal

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    That's simply an argument for allowing deed upgrades then. ;)
     
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