Question about fire resistance

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Barugon, Jun 4, 2019.

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  1. Barugon

    Barugon Avatar

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    Does fire resistance actually have any affect on fire from Xavara, Riei Firefeather, Dragons and such?
     
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  2. jiirc

    jiirc Avatar

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    If a mob is doing fire damage then fire resistance should have an effect on the mob’s damage. These mobs have been around for a long time. Some of the older mobs do not calculate the resistance correctly and the may be mobs that fall into that category.
     
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  3. Barugon

    Barugon Avatar

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    I'm only asking because once I had made a full set of fire warding gear and it made zero difference in the amount of damage I received from Xavara and Riei. I'd really like to know if these warding skills will do anything for PvE. Has anyone done any testing?
     
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  4. Jezebel Caerndow

    Jezebel Caerndow Avatar

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    hmmm, curious if you tried using like def stance and death shield if it would reduce it, therefore showing that those are being treated like physical attacks. Might be worth a test.
     
  5. jiirc

    jiirc Avatar

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    In my mind, testing is tricky because you can’t tell whether the mob is old or new. As such old mobs Are likely to not show any difference while new mobs would. So you attack a mob and don’t see much difference between normal and high resistance setups. Is that because the damage multiplier is so close to 1, ie source attunement is nearly the same as the target’s attunement-resist value that this term closes in to 0 making the damage multiplier 1. Or is it because the mob’s use of resistance broken because it is an older mob? Hard to tell until Chris fixed the broken system for old mobs. Unti” then it’s hit and miss with the only th8ng that can be said is it’s supposed to work for everything in pve.
     
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  6. DavidDC

    DavidDC Programmer Moderator SOTA Developer

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    from the top of my head and being a fire, i know thats elves and normal monster and normal lich we can resist, but all the boss kind cant resist as they are physical fire based, like mac said raising ur physical def will stop them a bit
     
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  7. Lazlo

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    The easiest of those to test on would be reia’s immolation type effect, because you can get a good sample in a reasonable amount of time. You can then just look at the top and bottom of the damage range.

    I’ll do it sometime when I have time, but my testing in the past suggested that fire resist works in pve when it’s from douse, shield of ice, or fire attunement, but not wards, potions, or blessings.

    Whether or not those bosses attacks are fire based I’m not sure.
     
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  8. Lazlo

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    I can confirm that Xavara's attacks have a physical component. Within the first couple of minutes of testing I've already seen a parried and a glanced fireball. That makes it a little harder to test with shield of ice since you would have to throw out all damage rounds where you get a glancing blow due to avoidance mod.

    I don't think that necessarily means that magic resistance isn't a factor, but I don't know how that works. Iirc a physical component was added to some things so that elemental pets wouldn't be completely damage immune vs. some mobs.

    edit: each time you get hit with a fireball from Xavara, there are 2 attacks. So far, any time that I've had a partial magic resist, it's been on the first attack, and every time that I've had a physical damage mod, it's been on the second attack. Small sample, so maybe just coincidence, but maybe the first attack is always magic and the second is always physical.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2019
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  9. Lazlo

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    Confirmed now that Xavara's first attack is magic, second attack is physical, and that they always go in that order. I guess that explains what they meant by adding a physical damage component to some mobs. It's just a separate attack altogether. I'm guessing that also means that things like dragon/phoenix fire are probably just magic, especially since those mobs always had separate physical attacks anyway and couldn't be tanked indefinitely by elemental pets.

    Will test different resist stuff now.
     
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  10. Barugon

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    So, which is better, having higher fire resistance or getting a little more damage via Ignite Weapon?
     
  11. Lazlo

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    Done 3 small trials so far. vs. Xavara first attack. First 100 normal hits, all frontal with same gear/buffs.

    Baseline: Max hit 115, min hit 69, average 90.82
    Baseline+Douse: Max hit 115, min 73, average 94.9
    Baseline+Shield of Ice: Max hit 93, min 57, average 76.4

    Not very big samples, but big enough to see that the +20 fr from douse didn't do much, if anything, and that the +%fr from shield of ice did a lot.

    I also did a test with evasion just to make extra sure that avoidance wasn't somehow affecting results, and it wasn't.

    Will try ward stuff next.

    edit: Baseline+full ward gear: Max hit 112, min 68, average 90.2
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2019
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  12. Barugon

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    I think Douse is broken. I was testing with it on QA and it didn't seem to do anything.
     
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  13. FrostII

    FrostII Bug Hunter

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    That sure don't say much for warding PvE , now does it.....
     
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  14. Lazlo

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    So I went to do a little more testing today and I noticed something pretty weird.

    The first thing that I wanted to test was normal attunement. It's an important test, because if the attument from gems is more effective in preventing magic damage than wards, there would of course be 0 reason to ever use wards in PvE.

    In previous tests, I was using weapons with mossy handles to make it easier for me to tank fireballs indefinitely. Since I didn't already have any mossy weapons with sorcery gems and I didn't want to burn 2 handles just for a dumb test, I used a couple wands with +10 fire attunement for those slots instead. Given that I no longer had mossy regen, I threw on some white iron plate with lots of hp enchantments to make it easier to stay alive during testing.

    I used cloth armor in all of my previous tests, but I didn't figure it would hurt anything to change armor type at this point, since the attack I was logging is clearly a magic attack. Partial magic resists fire on the attack, glancing blows do not, and fire elementals are completely immune to the attack, so it's clearly a fire based magical attack. My test resulted in a damage range of 101-62 and a 10% drop in average damage, which seemed like a really big damage reduction for just adding 40 attunement.

    So since that was pretty suspicious, I swapped out all the +attunement, but stayed in full white iron plate and tried again. I pretty quickly hit a couple of numbers that were significantly lower than the baseline minimum, so I loaded defensive as was previously suggested, and it resulted in a very significant reduction in damage.

    So apparently damage resistance (or maybe some other thing like armor type bonus), can reduce magic damage, and in this case, much much more effectively than various +magic resist effects. It seems like that also might not be working as intended.

    In any case, if you do any testing of magic resist, make sure you keep your armor types and physical bonuses consistent, otherwise your results won't be accurate.
     
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  15. jiirc

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    I’m assuming this was done Xavara again. Here why I think she, he??, is using the old system for resistance, the fact that it says ‘x’ amount of magic damage was partially resisted. If you look at the way damage is calculated using the damage multiplier, there isn’t a fixed amount of damage that is reduced anymore. Instead there is a damage multiplier that affects the amount of damage that was calculated. So I can’t see a way that the system would know how much damage was negated by resistances.
     
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  16. Lazlo

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    Yeah, it was against Xavara. I'm open to suggestions for stuff to test against. Lower level mobs would be a lot easier since I could just use regen food/blessing/lute and build up large samples while doing other stuff. Something like a fire elemental would be ideal, but I don't know if those would be any different than Xavara. I don't completely trust hazards, camp fires, etc. either.
     
  17. Barugon

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    The warding skills in the magic trees are much more expensive than the 5x that @Chris was stating in his stream. I just got Fire Warding to 80 and it cost more than three million experience!
     
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