No trade Subscriber Rewards. Sorry, that's a deal breaker.

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Vladamir Begemot, Oct 4, 2019.

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  1. Datendrache

    Datendrache Avatar

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    Sorry to add to an already long thread, there's a lot that's been said but there's still a lot that hasn't.

    Tagging @DarkStarr too...

    @Chris -- you might not like these comments, but please consider. You like elegant code, right? A solution that works so well, so clean, that you know its right and can be trusted? That's business, too. It works best when its easiest on their customers.

    Its been said a lot lately that Portalarium wants to simplify and work with models that are familiar to other successful games. Movement was made from the add-on store for cash to COTO in-game purchases, etc. You've referred to this as being a "real" company and not a "Kickstarter model", so I know you have faith in the direction.

    I'm going to point out something -- you'll look at it two times. First is when you look at it and proclaim its an obvious bug and I should be reporting it in the bug forums. The second time, you'll realize its a systemic problem in your marketing and sales process, and the "bug" is actually due to a bigger issue that isn't so easy to correct.

    Situation: I wanted to buy a new flaming keep sized dragon. At 970 COTOs, its a bargain for a nice piece of PoT deco... Except, I read a bit more closer and realized I made the assumption it could be placed in a PoT without having a Keep-Sized Deed and Property. I did know that a similar recently added item -- the dungeon entrances -- could be placed in a PoT. But if you look at the screenshots, you'll see the language for both the new teleporters and the flaming dragon are similar, stating they both require properties.

    [​IMG]

    So, do I buy the flaming dragon and potentially lose my COTO? Of course not, people avoid buying incompatible and/or unusable stuff. Because its heritage I'm stuck with it if I buy it, so my decision making needs to be precise. So I ask Discord and ask Universal Chat -- nobody seems to know the answer. I PM a few people and it seems that nobody that I know has bought one. So, I haven't bought one yet.

    Fixable by changing the language, perhaps? Or maybe I'll wait for the test server to go up? Bug it, right?

    I mentioned it will feel systemic the second time you look at it. Here's the real problem -- I'm reading the text description fields in order to determine if this product is suitable for my purchase for a simple statue item. What's worse if that its similar to other items with different requirements and prices, making my purchasing "very uneasy". I no longer have an instinct into my own buying decision and have the scrutinize it. That translates to a delayed or lost sale.

    In fact, the systemic issue is far broader than just the lack of a "PoT Deco" category, or even a Heritage Item category, etc. A completely "new" player that you are trying to convert to a paying player has to go through what is a historically large and complex decision making process that even players that have been in game for years don't understand completely. And to fix the system, it has become more complicated as new marketing features like The Vault, Heritage, No Trade, Subscriber, Login Rewards get added on top of other potential tags such as Stretch Goals, Telethon, Livestream, Milestone Rewards, SeedInvest, Meretz, Kickstarter Projects, Community, Make-A-Difference, Seasonal Occurring, Seasonal Rares, GM Crafted, etc. Many of these have several subcategories.

    Does a "convert to paying" customer have the same feels as a senior player when buying from the Vault? Does that same player understand they need to carefully read the details in the text fields when they make their purchases? Based on existing items, can that player feel "burned" with their decision making them adverse to future purchases? Do they get appropriate warning messages if an item they are buying is similar but different from past purchased items (like the Prosperity Tools)? Are there issues with these items in the fine print that might make them feel insecure about buying them? (Speaking of which, I'm still not even sure why its possible to steal or kill a player in PvP for an eternal pattern -- I don't know of any other MMO that allows purchased styling to be pilfered by other players.)

    Similarly, putting all the Eps 2 POTs on one large land mass away from the adventure areas in a non-free-to-play area when we know that its already a struggle for nested POTs to attract residents also makes me wonder if this is going to convert new governors into big spenders ... The ways in the past worked to an extent, but expecting better results is probably not wise because there's more stipulations for the new players. Why choke the players and the company with red tape?

    Side note: I'm still not even sure why we went from Bundles to A La Carte, since that was one of the ways Portalarium was able to control the simplicity of purchases.

    My advice is simple- reduce the number of caveats. If you want an elegant solution, pick three maximum. Or eliminate them altogether. If you can understand why I don't get on the "Trade Once" bandwagon, its because its just one more thing to make the whole deal more complicated.
     
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  2. Fenrus MacRath

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    The reason an end to RMT would be a condition, is that the NEW MONEY , will be looking to monetize every single aspect of the game for their own profit. WHY else would new money be interested in this dead ass game? Cant be competing with the old player base to get that cheddah
     
  3. Spoon

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    Icons - more icons. (KISS)
    This since icons don't need as much translation and they are really easy/nice to add to the store item instead of massive paragraphs of text. Then the icon could have a tooltip if you hover with the relevant text. That way when the devs add a store item they drag the relevant icons to it (or preferably they are automated by the actual game flags).

    So think one icon for POT placement. One icon for salvage to Eternal Pattern. etc
    With just 10 icons you could get rid of 90% of the encumbrance of all the store text and remove a whole lot of misunderstandings leading to upset customers.



    Outside the store I would also have liked such icons for things like Artifacts for instance. That way the Artifact icon could be in the tooltip of the item and new players wouldn't trash/sell/scrap/salvage them and then get (as) upset when they realize.




    I've been trying to get them for years :p;)
    https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...th-regards-to-rarity.39082/page-2#post-443423
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2019
  4. Vladamir Begemot

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    And probably a server wipe.
     
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  5. CarlNZ

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    That's not rmt, that's buying off blizzard. Start reselling those tokens for real money, you get banned. You can't rmt to buy the best gear, soulbound and you get banned, etc.
     
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  6. CICI

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    lol hear of the twitch loophole of giveaways lol cant get ban for that
     
  7. CarlNZ

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    You do anything blizzard doesn't want you doing with the tokens, you get banned. Besides, much like what sota is doing, blizzard released those tokens to combat rmt, so they're not the best example for supporting rmt.
     
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  8. CICI

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    eve online has plex and ppl use them for giveaways and ask for about $20 worth of bits so same thing as RMT lol
     
  9. Cirsee

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    NO RMT is specifically banned in EQ. Played that for years and they were very against gold farmers. I can't speak for EVE either and games like WoW and ESO also have strict RMT no sale rules. What you may be thinking is the exchanges some games have where you can buy crowns and then sell them for gold to other players via an in-game interface. GW2 and Secret World Legends does that. There are several no trade items in those games as well.

    I think it would be nice to trade subscriber awards between my own accounts if I had more than one or to my family members - maybe a way to authorize certain accounts as okay to trade to? Either way though I need to be able to sort deco and clothing and such. Lumping it all in my bank just takes to much time to sift through.
     
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  10. Sara Dreygon

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    Long thread so didn't read it all but do have two questions so I don't have to read it all.

    I have 5 subs for $45 a month, Sara and 4 other Dreygons and have from the start of the subscription program. I harvest my alt's rewards and toss everything in chests and can't remember having "sold" a sub item, but have traded others who mention that they would really like a set of XYZ by saying just give me some tin, beetles, etc. in return so the alts items ultimately benefits me and is worth it to me.

    This harvesting of items from my alts so Sara has 5 sets of everything in case a need comes up has made the 4 alts at $36 a month okay with me because I at least get the items, cotos, pots for later and am helping the game out financially.

    In the future will my 4 alts that I never play on be stuck with their items? If so, the 4 alt subscriptions wouldn't help me in the slightest, correct?
     
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  11. Sulaene Moon

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    Has there been any updat or announcement on this?
     
  12. Spoon

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    Kinda correct.


    However
    • If you want the crowns, then it is still best value, where the potions rewards etc are bonus on top
    • you can trade the whole reward pack,
      • So for the purpose of trading a whole reward kit, then yes so far we can trade those
      • For the purpose of trading from your alts to your main, you can do that and then when opened it would be the main who got stuck with the no-trade stuff
      • which is also the only way to get the reward emotes
    • some no-trade items can still be salvaged for eternal patterns that can then in turn be traded

    But for me then when they make the deco items no-trade outside trading the whole kit with all the other stuff, that is what gets me depressed.
    It just puts a big fat blocker or complicater on top which means that no-trade deco just isn't interesting as deco which kinda makes them useless.
     
  13. CarlNZ

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    That's eve, it's a different kettle of fish. Sota is clearly wanting to go the more soulbound route of wow. Which is sensible from an income point.
     
  14. Mrpsu71

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    I canceled my subscription. Ever since the change about 5 releases ago where they cut back on the rewards and you have to login to get them, I haven’t received them in Offline mode. If I paid for the item, then I should get it Online and Offline. Not worth supporting this project anymore.
     
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  15. Sentinel2

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    Not if we stop subscribing and providing them income.

    Honestly. I don't know how long I can keep putting crap in my bank before I say enough is enough and cancel my subs. I don't plan on buying more bank slots. And you can't store them in a chest.
     
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  16. Barugon

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    Did they make the subscriber rewards tradeable? I looked last night and all my bundles were the standard light gray text.
     
  17. CarlNZ

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    It's entirely possible the current sub model is insufficient anyway. Better they try something out than fade away from insufficient income. Though maybe they should enable something like multiple subscriptions on a single account so that people can get multiple of the rewards if they're legitimately wanting them for deco and not resale. And maybe the ability to put them back in the rewards chest menu for storage.
     
  18. Jezebel Caerndow

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    hmm thats an interesting idea of multiple subs on one account.
     
  19. Vladamir Begemot

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    Makes no sense to resell, the market for all this stuff is below the price you pay.

    But driving people away from your rewards because you don't want to compete with them later makes no sense anyway.

    You literally already had the sale. Nine dollars in the hand is better than nothing later.
     
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  20. CarlNZ

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    $18 to port from two people is better than $9 to port from the first player and $5 to the first player from a second player.
     
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