Please Do Not Add Vendor Search Through Lua

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Wilfred, Apr 8, 2020.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Wilfred

    Wilfred Avatar

    Messages:
    556
    Likes Received:
    1,025
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Developers, please do not implement vendor search through Lua.

    Chris put up a poll and discussed vendor search in today's Twitch stream.
    But the poll only had a few options.
    If more player input is needed, please put up a poll on the forums where players can choose from all the options.

    Here are my thoughts on vendor search options:

    - The current vendor search system.
    Players have to run from vendor to vendor, checking each vendor individually to try to find what they are looking for.
    This system is extremely annoying and basically useless.
    So annoying that most of the time I don't even bother shopping.

    - A vendor search system where the vendor data is accessed through Lua.
    A Lua based vendor search system would have several major issues:
    - It would take players outside the game to get the vendor information.
    Having to go to a website or run a separate program to search vendors would break immersion.
    - It would give more experienced and technical players an advantage over newer and less technical players.
    Players who do not know about or do not want to bother with accessing vendor information outside the game would be at a disadvantage.
    - It would be hard to fix the system by adding in game search later.
    Players who have gained an advantage from the Lua search would protest loudly at any attempt to implement an in game vendor search.

    - A vendor search system where prices are not listed.
    Better than the current system, but still very annoying.
    Players would still have to waste time running around checking a bunch of vendors to compare prices.
    But at least players would only have to check the vendors that actually have what they are looking for.
    In my opinion, any vendor search system should include current, up to date prices.

    - Town based vendor search.
    The best vendor search system to start with, in my opinion.
    I would like to see vendor search added to the Town Criers.
    This would have the added benefit of creating natural spots for players to gather in towns.
    Let players browse all items for sale or purchase in the town, sort prices, and then set a Compass Destination marker to the vendor they want to do business with.

    - Regional vendor search.
    A Master Crier could also be added to the main city in each region for Regional Search of all vendors in the region.
    Useful to compare vendor prices in more out of the way towns, so the main market towns do not have all the advantage.
    Keeps the idea of a "regional economy".
    I think regional search would be just enough effort to be fun.
    Most of the time you could just check the Master Crier in one region and know that you are getting a fair price.
    But players who want to ensure they are getting the absolute best price could check the Master Crier in each region.
    Running around to all the regions checking prices could be considered fun or annoying, depending on your perspective.
    Regional vendor search could be implemented after town based vendor search to ensure that the bugs have been fixed on the smaller scale town system first.

    - Universal vendor search.
    The Master Crier in each region could provide a Universal Search of all vendors in the game.
    Players could easily find the vendor with the best prices and go directly to that vendor without having to travel around checking prices first.
    Universal vendor search is a bit too easy, in my opinion.
    Universal search also destroys any idea of a "regional economy".
    I would prefer a regional search, but would not be opposed to a universal search, if that is what everyone else wants.

    - Universal vendor search from any vendor or bank.
    Any vendor or bank provides a Universal Search of all vendors in the game.
    Much too easy, in my opinion.
    Also does not have the advantage of creating in game gathering spots.

    - Universal vendor search and sales from any vendor or bank.
    Basically an auction house.
    Absolutely terrible, in my opinion.
    Completely destroys any value of location, as players do not need to go to your town and visit your vendor to buy your wares.
     
  2. Antrax Artek

    Antrax Artek Avatar

    Messages:
    1,002
    Likes Received:
    2,087
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Viborg
    The most important thing is that the feature must be accessible to all and and not just to those who take advantage of LUA.
    I hope the search will just point out just where to find an item without giving any information about price, adding prices to the global search can really make worthless variables such as the vendor location.

    Edit: One of major risks is that players will start a prices war to make their vendor appears before others, and this can be a really bad hit for the game economy.
     
  3. Chemeck

    Chemeck Avatar

    Messages:
    80
    Likes Received:
    140
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Poland
    I like the idea of asking town crier about location of vendors you need. It fits SOTA well, a conversation with NPC instead of a system window. I wonder how would it work tho, since right now one vendor with 200 items stocked needs a while to show the list and the town crier would have to load all those lists of items and keep it up to date. Also, you want to ask only for one item at a time? I would love to see it in form similiar to selling tab for vendor. You pick items that you want, click OK and see the list of vendors that have what you need, starting from the one that have the most things you need. Then you just click to track it and voila. And i fully agree with Antrax, about LUA and prices info.
     
  4. majoria70

    majoria70 Avatar

    Messages:
    10,347
    Likes Received:
    24,869
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    United States
    Thank you for the heads up since ATM I don't do twitch. I am not for town searches only Global searches so players can find out where to look for their items. I am for mail delivery purchases too but with a cost and limit perhaps like one a day or 3 maybe so other wise you have to visit the vendors.

    This game is comprised of many separate scenes scattered around with time consuming zoning or map traveling required. It doesn't need to get all complicated imo but more information we can easily get about scenes we don't see the better. Then we can make informed time saving decisions on whether to zone or travel or not.

    When making this game into a broken up world it came with costs of a hidden aspect like no one knew what was going on anywhere unless they went there. Few basics were put in place to tell of the world. Also few incentives to make us keep wanting to explore the world over and over.

    Global searches would help as well as a knowledge journal telling us that there is a world of things to do in this game. Of course achievements, lore and tasks in all scenes telling their story is needed as well.

    One achievement should be 'buy something using global search' and tell which keys to press to access it.

    Edited
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2020
  5. Wilfred

    Wilfred Avatar

    Messages:
    556
    Likes Received:
    1,025
    Trophy Points:
    63
    No, I would like a system to let players browse all items for sale or purchase in the town, sort prices, and then set a Compass Destination marker to the vendor they want to do business with.

    I agree, this would be great!
     
    CrandalltheFoole likes this.
  6. FrostII

    FrostII Bug Hunter

    Messages:
    5,884
    Likes Received:
    11,033
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest
    brb
     
    Redhammer likes this.
  7. Wilfred

    Wilfred Avatar

    Messages:
    556
    Likes Received:
    1,025
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Easily discoverable prices would really help buyers.
    I think a price war would be good for the game economy.
     
    arcdevil, Redhammer, Cyin and 2 others like this.
  8. Alley Oop

    Alley Oop Bug Hunter Bug Moderator

    Messages:
    15,680
    Likes Received:
    19,463
    Trophy Points:
    153
  9. Violet Ronso

    Violet Ronso Avatar

    Messages:
    2,632
    Likes Received:
    5,108
    Trophy Points:
    153
    And then people will mark down their price by 1 gold, and then 1 more, everytime they update their vendor, simply to be the top of the list in the "sort by lowest price", which will, sure, be a price war, but I do not care about saving 15 gold on a 2m purchase... I've said it before, but as a buyer myself (and not a seller), I would prefer to have these lists not include price, simply to give vendors the visibility they deserve by holding the product, not by being the last person to reduce their price by one gold...
     
    Mhtic and Chemeck like this.
  10. Wilfred

    Wilfred Avatar

    Messages:
    556
    Likes Received:
    1,025
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I would love to see sellers competing to see who can offer the lowest prices.
    The more information buyers and sellers have, the easier it would be to determine market prices.
    If it was easier to determine supply and demand, sellers could more efficiently direct their efforts to supply goods that players want.
     
  11. Dartan Obscuro

    Dartan Obscuro Avatar

    Messages:
    200
    Likes Received:
    494
    Trophy Points:
    18
    I feel like there are various ideas that could be explored that weren't included in Chris's twitch poll. To name a few:
    • Making the public vendor lists regional or global
    • A device like fyndoro's tablet of finding but to once a day find vendors selling something
    • Having town criers sell a shopping guide book listing all items at that moment in the town that are for sale
    • Listing related items from public or private vendors on the NPC shops e.g. crafted weapons on blacksmiths
    • Paying a monthly advertising fee to list your vendor into a global search
    • A full global search but at a in game gold cost per use
    I've spent enjoyable hours wandering around visiting vendors. I've also been frustrated not finding the item I want. I hope that whatever is done will also makes the world more interesting.
     
    Violet Ronso and Wilfred like this.
  12. Beaumaris

    Beaumaris Avatar

    Messages:
    4,289
    Likes Received:
    7,415
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Caladruin
    This. Good post.
     
    Mhtic, Dhanas, Redhammer and 4 others like this.
  13. Vladamir Begemot

    Vladamir Begemot Avatar

    Messages:
    6,194
    Likes Received:
    12,076
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Gender:
    Male
    Got in today for the first time in a while. Loaded up the bank, a vendor, and a mailbox at the same time.

    HUGE mistake. It took forever to load them. Are we running on a TI-85 now or what? How is universal search even possible at this point? Open the window, go watch a movie, come back to browse?
     
  14. Wilfred

    Wilfred Avatar

    Messages:
    556
    Likes Received:
    1,025
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Hopefully the devs can update the system to be more responsive as well.
     
  15. Barugon

    Barugon Avatar

    Messages:
    15,679
    Likes Received:
    24,293
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Gender:
    Male
    I recreated @Chris' poll that he did on Friday's livestream here.
     
  16. CarlNZ

    CarlNZ Avatar

    Messages:
    333
    Likes Received:
    771
    Trophy Points:
    43
    The layers of tedium put in place to make doing anything a chore in this game needs to end. Global auction house style search with purchase through the interface, at worst having to pick up your goods from the vendor. That way location still matters, no one's going to walk to the other end of the map for 1 gold if it's available next door for a gold more.
     
  17. Wilfred

    Wilfred Avatar

    Messages:
    556
    Likes Received:
    1,025
    Trophy Points:
    63
    See this blog post by Raph Koster for some counterpoints.
    It is possible to make the system too easy.

    Do auction houses suck?
    https://www.raphkoster.com/2012/03/20/do-auction-houses-suck/
     
  18. Spinok

    Spinok Avatar

    Messages:
    665
    Likes Received:
    1,292
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    Yes they will, but it will be good for the economy not bad.

    Poll for this system on twitch is just facepalm. Atos dont need to usk us, to do it or not. This game NEED this system(Inbuild global vendor search), really I understand that for some guys UO is still great, but for the major part of gamers UO is completely unplayable nowadays and it mechanics suxx, same with vendor system in SOTA.

    @Chris ANY DECISION about vendor search will be better then we have now, what we have now is 20 years old shame. Come on VENDOR system in SOTA is probably the ugliest part of the game, why you hate players so much, that you force them to make 30 loadings and 3 hours of time to understand the market on few positions. Really don't you think that players have better activities in SOTA then 3hours running between 95% similar POTs ?
    Another point - people constantly fraud novice players with X10 deals. The vendor search will stop this instantly.
     
  19. CICI

    CICI Avatar

    Messages:
    368
    Likes Received:
    849
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Gender:
    Male
    Yep Please Do Not Add Vendor Search Through Lua
    =)
    - Town based vendor search. (This way market towns can still be useful)
    The best vendor search system to start with, in my opinion.
    I would like to see vendor search added to the Town Criers.
    This would have the added benefit of creating natural spots for players to gather in towns.
    Let players browse all items for sale or purchase in the town, sort prices, and then set a Compass Destination marker to the vendor they want to do business with.

    and a bookmark to the vendor spot be cool too =) for later
     
    Wilfred likes this.
  20. Wilfred

    Wilfred Avatar

    Messages:
    556
    Likes Received:
    1,025
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I agree that vendor search should be implemented as soon as possible.
    But I would like to see the devs take their time and implement a good system.
     
    Redhammer, Spinok and FrostII like this.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.