Quests 2.0

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by oplek, Jun 19, 2020.

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  1. oplek

    oplek Avatar

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    I was thinking about the new quest system that's supposedly coming up. I wasn't sure how that'd be approached. Would they develop a secondary UI that just kicks in depending on what zone you're in? So if you're doing EP 1. stuff you'd see the old UI, and if you're doing EP 2. stuff you'd get to experience the new and improved.

    I looked back at the 2020 vision to refresh my memory.

    I'm not getting the impression that what I thought they were going to do, is what they're planning on doing. It sounds like it's more an under-the-hood system, but won't actually be improving the quest experience? (and I don't mean experience as in numbers)

    Quantity of quests isn't the problem... but it seems like that's what they're trying to solve?

    I get that they're "a small dev team operating on a shoestring ($20M+) budget yadda yadda yadda", but that's not the issue. It's the allocation of resources.

    I'm looking at the other quarters, and I'm seeing a lot of things that can be axed in favor of improving the core of the game. We do not need mounts. Even if that only takes an hour to grab an off-the-shelf-library and plunk it into the game, that's still an hour not spent correctly (and much more than an hour in the long run, having yet another disparate system to balance, debug and maintain)

    Arguments about them being a small team doesn't really hold up when you realize all the time wasted on the Obsidian Trials, brewing, the tenant system... and even Player Dungeons. That is also a failure at this point (if it's even "done" yet... I can't tell) It had no real vision behind it. More time wasted. Player dungeons could be something... but the conceptualizations around it are just... off and aloof.

    The entire 2020 vision should be scrapped. Full stop. They need to go on walkabout, discover themselves, try not to get stabbed while helping someone in down-below... and tackle a bold vision of what the game needs to actually have meaningful and fun gameplay.

    That's not quests 2.0, exactly. What I'm speaking about would naturally have that come up as a task item, though.
     
  2. Bedawyn

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    That's how I read it from the beginning. I took the 2020 vision as my signal to emotionally un-invest from the game. It's hard, since I do love the potential of the world they've created and my characters who sprouted from that world. But everything I love about that world is everything they've chosen to de-emphasize, so... I don't envy the folks who had so much more invested for so much longer, it must be heart-breaking for many of them.

     
  3. Rook Strife

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    Some good points in there but most importantly this


    Can't say I agree on the Obsidian Trials though

    Decent combat + some kind of battlegrounds practically guarantees significantly more players

    There is a very large segment of gamers who enjoy this kind of stuff.
     
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  4. Morgathys

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    I agree, investing the few hours of Dev time on stuff like `Obsidian Trials` & `PVP queue` seems to me a poor prioritization of what is needed to be done.
    The impression it gives me is that the Dev team seems to want to please a handful of people who have a huge visibility through Twitch.tv but who do not reflect the silent majority of the player base.

    Trust me, I'm a PVP player but I am mature enough to understand and accept the fact that there are crucial elements still missing before going ahead with PVP enhancement.
    There is some pillars which each MMO should be based on: Story, Exploration, Combat, Progression, Economy and Time
    I think SotA excel on some elements such Story & Exploration but have some lack on Combat & Progression

    If I'm rolling back to the OP subject, I totally agree some basics like Quest revamp, IG maps, Crafting interface should have an higher priority on the roadmap.
    For attracting new players, we need to move forward from the `Beta` stage.

    ---

    I know my own preferences but it's very difficult to interpreting what `others` really enjoy in a video game. Fortunately, Dr. Richard Bartle did some researches in the matter and the result are public.


    PS: These pillars do not come from 'Off the top of my head', there is real concepts in video games/mmo design.
     
  5. Barugon

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    They're using Ink as the quest engine and the UI is exactly the same.
     
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  6. Cora Cuz'avich

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    Maybe, but truth is a three-edged sword...
     
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  7. Rook Strife

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    In other MMO's, there is a large audience who focus mostly on PVP with no concern for most of those pillars.

    Log in, queue battlegrounds and that's basically how they spend their playtime.

    Here we also have the added bonus of the housing system which is quite good.


    A tiny fraction of that audience would greatly eclipse our current playerbase so it's worth investing the time and effort

    It's also cheap and reasonably easy to do.


    Most of the skills and frameworks they need to improve combat have been in the game for 5 years.

    Go through skills and change a bunch of numbers

    That's basically all they have to do and it would drastically alter combat and make it more entertaining.
     
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  8. Beaumaris

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    Could you link me to the dev report on quest system overhaul progress that has occurred since that 2020 vision? I must have missed that. Gauging progress based on what Catnip presents on social media, my perception is that the focus remains on tweaking mechanics and polishing a scene here or there. I'd like to hear about story, but judging from the news, if feels that has taken a distant back seat. If that's wrong, I'd appreciate a link to the progress update on that. Thanks!
     
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  9. Vladamir Begemot

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    Well, so much for that then.

    These guys REALLY need to play some other games. Nothing from the last ten years looks as bad as the quest UI. Literally the only games that look like that are hacking games where you are using a command prompt.
     
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  10. Barugon

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    Well, other games have much more story/quests. The real problem in SotA is it's lack of actual content.
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2020
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  11. Vladamir Begemot

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    That's A problem. But if they keep the UI as it is they might as well just stop adding anything more.

    There's already a full length single player game in there, but no one new is biting because it looks like a crack house. It doesn't matter if it's a mansion, it doesn't matter how big the rooms are, if you are immidiately turned off when you drive by, you are not going to stop and see if you want to buy.

    We put up with the terrible UI because it was the prototype UI. Nobody who is trying the game now believes that, so they will just give the questing side an immidiate hard pass and play something that isn't MS-DOS. There are plenty of options.

    Same with crafting, people KNOW how to do it, other games have gotten the interface for it right, the length of time it takes to make things rights. The developers need to go try some of those and bring the right back here, or people will go to the games that ARE doing it right.

    You can't have a successful game built on prototype UI elements.
     
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  12. Feeyo

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    And with the minimum of content, the system is also utterly broken.
     
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  13. ShurTugal

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    I often wonder if they even bother reading these types of post or if they just chock it up to more "complaining from a small group". It feels like they dont because they keep chugging ahead full steam.
     
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  14. Feeyo

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    They read it. Just ignore it, because we are trolls :D
     
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  15. Barugon

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    I can't speak about what turn's away other players; I can only speak for myself and the UI was never really an issue. Sure, they could display more information and in a more logical manner but the real issue, for me, was the buggy nature of the quests. Ink was supposed to "fix" that for new quests but what new quests do we have? I played through the "Unusual Doe" quest on QA but the story was insulting to me and there was no experience awarded at the end.
     
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  16. Cora Cuz'avich

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    Yeah, that one bugged me. I loved the Bunker C bit, but the ultimate end of the quest was being told you were stupid for doing it in the first place. A metaphor, perhaps?
     
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  17. Bedawyn

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    Hmm. Haven't done the doe quest yet, but I did recently finish the low-level quest for Lord Macsen's missing document -- where the end is essentially the same, being told you shouldn't have done the quest in the first place. I do hope this isn't going to be a trend. :-(
     
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  18. Barugon

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    But seems to be. Look at the book you get for completing the episode 1 storyline. It's really not the best idea to tell your players that they're bad people and are dumb for playing the game.
     
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  19. Echondas

    Echondas Bug Hunter Bug Moderator

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    That doe quest was adjusted on live and it has rewards now - FYI.
     
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  20. Barugon

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    I just did it and here's the result.
     
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