info about pvp

Discussion in 'PvP Gameplay' started by Isaiah, Apr 4, 2014.

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  1. enderandrew

    enderandrew Legend of the Hearth

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    Agreed. They can still figure out a lot of the specifics.

    How many of the map tiles should be open PvP?
    Can guilds be at war with more than one guild?
    How will PvP rewards and PvP specific skills work?
     
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  2. MalakBrightpalm

    MalakBrightpalm Avatar

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    I don't think the first two questions are particularly vital, as they can be changed at any time without ending the world. That third question though, touches on one of my specific pet peeves with MMO PvP.

    When there is a different system to PvP combat than PvE, it drives the two worlds apart. It makes it harder and harder for people to make the jump between them, isolating the two populations. Even though it WILL be possible to balance the system, it will become necessary to balance it again each and every time an exploit or expansion or new tactic is discovered, and since the two combat systems are closely linked, but different, what fixes one will often break the other.

    This leads to endless rounds of patches and rebalances, as the effort to prevent some PvP kill exploit nerfs a vital skill in PvE, which then forces a rebuffing, which breaks a new part of PvP, and on and on.

    I've seen it happen to several games before, and YES, the devs can just keep repatching it, if they want to be spending 50% of their work hours on rebalancing the system.

    An easier, and more elegant fix, is to have the two systems be identical. What works on an NPC human works on a PC human, and vice versa. The simple refusal to have special PvP skills and equipment, and to have all abilities work the same regardless, will make PvP different from every other cookie cutter game out there, since they won't wind up re-creating the same tired old PvP moves, but we will instead be trying to figure out how to use the same moves that work everywhere else against dodgy, cagey opponents.

    Ideally, there will be no need for seperate builds, we won't have PvP tactics that differ wildly from PvE tactics. I know that we will all find ways to bend the system any time we can, but if they devs only have to balance ONE system it will take so much less of their time.
     
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  3. cs2501x

    cs2501x Avatar

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    It would indeed be nicer if people were more welcoming. ;)


    Well said. :)

    To answer the OP: I do not think that SotA will be UO2. The position right now is that SotA will have voluntary only PVP, no full loot, etc. It's shaping up quite a bit differently, but, as Robby as pointed out, comments and feedback are welcome. Keep in mind though, no PVP functionality has yet been implemented in the pre-alpha releases. There's likely still a lot to discover with this particular feature set.
     
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  4. enderandrew

    enderandrew Legend of the Hearth

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    UO has been running for almost 17 years. It has full open PvP for less than 2 years. For over 15 years, players aren't forced into PvP if they don't want to. I'd say the system UO has had for over 15 years is more of a defining characteristic of UO than a system it had for less than 2.

    Anytime someone says SotA won't be anything like UO just because it doesn't have a system that UO itself rejected quickly doesn't make much sense to me.

    SotA will be a lot like UO in many ways.
     
  5. Robby

    Robby Avatar

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    We have the power of the revolutionary "selective multiplayer" on our side that no other video game has yet tried. UO was revolutionary because it was MMO. It set the stage for all the future popular MMO's like WoW, which in my opinion, are terrible!! Not gonna be to hard on blizzard though, they make some decent games, like diablo 2 and starcraft.
    This game will set the stage for future MMO's is my thinking. It gives us so much control over how we adventure in the game, and I think the idea came about because of the fact that we want to keep a large community of people together in one world, so we do this by allowing them to control wether or not the play solo, with friends, with everyone. Ive noticed for awhile that many individuals play MMO pretty much single player even though their online. I always thought that perhaps it would draw in the solo playing crowd more if they just had access to the player vendors and stuff and could play solo.
     
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  6. Time Lord

    Time Lord Avatar

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    Well Said Robby ;)!

    Both Posts, I couldn't have said it better myself :)
    ~Time Lord~:rolleyes:
     
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  7. Robby

    Robby Avatar

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    Well I try my best to say it all well. =P
     
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  8. rschultzy80

    rschultzy80 Avatar

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    What do you mean by this?

    Are you saying Felucca isn't full open PvP because they added Trammel? Because "half" the world is still full open PvP.
     
  9. Eriador

    Eriador Avatar

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    He is not saying that Felucca was not open pvp, he is saying that UO was not after T2A . Here also the open pvp zones will be open pvp zones. But a game is not a full open pvp game is you can choose. Thats basic.
     
  10. enderandrew

    enderandrew Legend of the Hearth

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    Players aren't forced into open PvP if they don't want since they have a choice of where to play. People who insist that a game isn't like UO unless you're forced into open PvP against your will are ignoring the fact that not even UO does this.
     
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  11. cs2501x

    cs2501x Avatar

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    I've trimmed out a few negative comments. Please try to avoid using insults to make points.
     
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  12. Rufus D`Asperdi

    Rufus D`Asperdi Avatar

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    What he means is that the Felucca/Trammel split with the release of Ultima Online Renaissance effectively provided a PvP Consent mechanism.

    "I wish to PvP today, I believe I'll head to Felluca."
    "I do not wish to be involved with PvP activity today. I believe I'll remain in Trammel"

    So, save for the first approximately 2 years of UO's ongoing run, UO hasn't had Full World Open PvP.
    Many of the PvP Community wish SotA to emulate and recreate a game that only existed for about 13% of Ultima Online's life to date, and vehemently object to a PvP switch in SotA, a form of which has existed in Ultima Online for the remaining approximately 87% of its existence to date. So, not only do they discount the single player Ultimas, they also dismiss the vast majority of the history of the game they hold up as the shining example of the way things should be.
     
  13. rschultzy80

    rschultzy80 Avatar

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    If people wish to play SPO they can. If people wish to play MPO and never flag PvP they can. If I wish to flag for PvP full time in MPO I can.

    Sorry, I didn't realize we were arguing the semantics of the word full. I thought we were discussing actual mechanics of the game
     
  14. FireLotus

    FireLotus Royal Bard & Master Dabbler Dev Emeritus

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    I went ahead and merged some of the redundant PvP threads and culled a great deal of personal attacks and inflammatory accusations. If you suspect someone is using an alt account to "troll" the forums, please report them using either the report button or by emailing me at community@portalarium.com.

    And just to be clear, creating an alt account to troll is not acceptable and will get you banned. Likewise, I will NOT tolerate being rude to a new forum member just because you suspect he may not be who he says he is. These forums are part of our community, and that community is one that is collaborative, constructive, and kind.
     
  15. Eriador

    Eriador Avatar

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    Sorry FireLotus, we just were a little bit bored of the same threads. We just should ask you to add the thread to this one, like you did now.
     
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  16. TEK

    TEK Legend of the Hearth

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    Not only that but as someone who jumped to the Siege Perilous server upon being released, I never had to deal with the nonsense of Trammel or even Stat-Loss for that matter and continued to play until late 2003. So we are talking about 6 years of an open PvP/full loot environment that was inspired by the work that Lord British and DarkStarr had originally created with UO. Sure SP was just 1 server, but that represented a fair % of players who were willing to pay for such an experience....the FULL experience.

    The same goes for SotA. There is absolutely a fair amount of backers, especially high end backers, who love what LB and DS did with UO originally. It's not about griefing and camping the town gate camping BS, but the players creating conflict with reason among themselves with great back and forth combat that had true risk and was not all about gear or spamming the most roots, stuns, and snares. To an extent we know that SotA WILL have this some of this but it is a matter of how much. The great thing though, is if you want have the FULL SotA experience and be able to travel to all areas of the world at all times, then you have to be open to PvP. If not, then you will basically will miss out on a fair amount of content.
     
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  17. Silent Strider

    Silent Strider Avatar

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    This — if the missed out content includes PvE content — is exactly what I won't exactly tolerate. If I find out that, in order to do all the PvE content without PvP, I have to only play offline, then I will sell the two most expensive of my pledges and use the remaining one to play exclusively offline.

    I backed this game for the PvE content, based on the promise that I would be able to choose never to engage in PvP. If I find out that there are significant downsides to choosing to never take part in PvP (apart from missing the PvP itself, naturally), then count me out of the online game at all.
     
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  18. MalakBrightpalm

    MalakBrightpalm Avatar

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    Again and again and again and again and again... RG has stated that there WILL BE NO PUNISHMENT OF ANY KIND WHATSOEVER for not doing PvP. That includes resources, items, specs, skills, and, yes, CONTENT.

    @TEK I just do not GET why we seem to have so many people who think it's a good idea to punish people for not PvPing. WHY on God's green earth would you want to force unwilling participants into PvP? How can you possibly benefit? Are you trying to crash this game? If PvP is so great, it should be it's own reward. If I have to be coerced into it as a "necessary evil" that I endure in order to get access to the desired story content, then the PvP, by definition, sucks and everyone should be ashamed of it. If instead, the PvP is something that is fun and exciting, it will draw PLENTY of people who want exactly that into the PvP zones, and they won't NEED extra special story content to reward them.
     
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  19. 3devious

    3devious Avatar

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    Yeah except that it was said that some of the main story would have PvP elements/possibly quests.

    sent from the future using my Coleco Adam
     
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  20. Isaiah

    Isaiah Avatar

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    exactly. This type of conversation comes up so often you would think everybody knows this by now?
     
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