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I am shocked by the character progression system

Discussion in 'Release 11 Feedback' started by robatzen, Oct 28, 2014.

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  1. Jynx

    Jynx Avatar

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    Just to lend my voice to the discussion: I would love to see a skill used experience based system.
     
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  2. Joviex

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    Well, to be fair, that is your fault.

    They (Richard) even explicitly stated, numerous times, this was not UO2 nor was it the next single player Ultima.
     
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  3. Weins201

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    OK only read page one but it you are asking for way to much. As it stands now with the ability to change skill trees gaing in any other easier skill and just moving the skill around to gain in the easy one again .

    Perhaps if the was a penalty for changing skills around say 1 point for every 5 removed lost would make it harder.
     
  4. robatzen

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    Thanks for your input, but this thread is not about skill-reset mechanics.

    Well, let's try to utilize your input anway. :)

    Regarding a skill-based-character-progression-system something artifical like a "skill-reset" is not needed in any way, because you just have to learn the new skill you want to master. You want to learn something new? Just go and do it! In fact the question for a "skill-reset" is a good example for how artifical and absurd a level-based-character-progression system actually is.

    I mean honestly, what is a "skill-reset"? Is it a special brainwash for my character? I go into a room as a wise mage and I come out as a scary warrior? Oh no ... wait I want to be an archer ...

    Stuff like this is killing the RPG genre. Games become more and more flat and shallow! Once upon in time there was a meaning in the term - Role - Playing Game, when you really had to play a ROLE with all consequences and limitations!

    In modern "RPG" games we do not play roles anymore. We just play exchangeable wrappers ... I really expected SotA to head to another direction!
     
  5. E n v y I I

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    If they created levels within the individual skills it would be so much better.
     
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  6. Weins201

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    What do you mean skill reset? The way it is now you earn points by gaining levels and can place them ANYWHERE in the skill tree you want. And there is a limit to the points you have.

    You want a place that I go out and learn fighting and that skill stays there forever, then I go out and learn Blacksmithing and they stay there is that what you want? If so then I agree.

    But with points spread into skill trees like they have what you are asking for means if I go out and fight and max that tree then I move onto to another tree and eventually I have maxed out Bludgeon Heavy Armor and EVERY mage tree possible?

    At some point there needs to be a cap and that is where you run into problems.

    Like Lux said level within each tree?

    Not bad ideas.

    Again that would be a whole new leveling system than what they have now :-(
     
  7. Borg

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    You are not the only one.
     
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  8. Lord Gorynych

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    There can be compromise by gaining two kinds of XP.
    Something like: 70% skill-oriented XP points that can only be spend on certain skill tree (ranged, melee, magic school) and 30% of "universal" XP points that can be spent on any skill tree.
     
  9. Beaumaris

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    I'm ok with the 'get a level, get a skill point' approach.

    I think that makes for a game where skill truly has to be earned through a period of diverse adventuring, vs. simply grinding something like a sword skill on the same target for 4 hours.
     
  10. Borg

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    Normal playing or Grinding is optional it depends on your play style, its DEV team task to provide good Normal play skill points gain progression.

    You know?, when you see something working you feel it immediately, but with this level system and also with the combat system this is not the case. When you have so many doubts and concerns then something is wrong.
     
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  11. robatzen

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    I tried to explain this several times within this thread. The basic question is about a level-based-progression or a skill-based-progression. Both systems can be grindy, of course it depends how they are implemented. Still, this argument keeps coming up every 10 posts. I dont know why ...

    Anyway, I think this thread has received a lot attention in such a short time and it has clearly shown that the majority of posters are not happy at all with the system that is in place now!

    No other topic has created so much attention and discussion after R11, so to my mind it really is time for an official statement on this!
     
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  12. Fox Cunning

    Fox Cunning Localization Team

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    I've always been in favour of a level-less, use-based system. I don't see how killing wolves with bow and arrows makes me a better swordsman, but there you go.

    A mixed system would also be possible, similar to the BRP rules; basically when you level up you can only increase the skills that you have used the most.
    Never had a sword in your hand before leveling up? Sorry, blades skill tree is locked for you.
    Only used a bow a couple times? Then you get to spend a maximum of one point in that tree. And so on.
     
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  13. rune_74

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    I think you need to be careful in professing that the majority are not satisfied with this, sure people who have posted in the thread may not be, but as history shows it is not the metric to use as a base. There are quite a few (meaning about 95% of the backers) who haven't posted here.
     
  14. E n v y

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    To be fair, probably less than 5% of backers are actually active on the forum.

    Anyway, I see nothing wrong with what has been explored in this thread. I believe it has created some genuine questions and has provided some good points.
     
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  15. rune_74

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    True, just grates me when people use the amount of posts as a level of player interest. Let your argument stand on it's own.
     
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  16. E n v y

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    If people are passionate about it, it doesn't hurt......i've seen plenty of other threads such as ones on single player do exactly the same.
     
  17. rune_74

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    Nope those get merged;)

    I'm fine with people being passionate, just speaking for yourself really....not sure why you are fighting me on this?
     
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  18. E n v y

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    Wasn't fighting anyone on anything :)
     
  19. Jynx

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    Would an in-game poll be possible? It is true that not everyone gets onto the forum, but anyone playing at the moment is in a position to lend their vote to a decision. Do we exclude non-forum users from decision making? Or do we try to include as many voices as possible?

    The reason I ask is that I think changing the leveling system is quite a big shift. Does Portalarium focus on the voices on the forum because they're the ones willing to give input and feedback? Or would they try to catch a larger pool of opinions?

    I can't quite make my own mind up one way or the other. I can see the argument for either side:

    Feedback on the forums show a buy-in from the backers in contributing thoughts, ideas, opinions.
    VS
    Getting a larger (and therefor, more accurate) reading of opinions via in-game poll.
     
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  20. Fox Cunning

    Fox Cunning Localization Team

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    Good idea.
    Zenimax did that with ESO during the closed beta, and I thought it was brilliant. Basically a survey button popped up in the game UI whenever you performed a certain action for the firs time (e.g. you access the crafting interface, and a button pops up for the crafting-related survey).
     
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