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Temporary PVP Flagging

Discussion in 'Release 23 Feedback' started by Abydos, Oct 29, 2015.

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  1. Beaumaris

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    Good point. And I guess it could work in reverse anyway, for people flagging themselves as PVP.
     
  2. Ristra

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    I wish that was not disable from the start! R1+ with guards that smash people for looting chests they don't own.
     
  3. smack

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    Nah, I think the Oracle is neutral to avatars and will see anyone.

    That would be fun, a race to the Oracle to spam "hail blessing yes bye". Also, it's not like that can't happen now as players visit the Oracle to remove their Blessing. Step outside the confirmatory and get insta-ganked. :)

    I think that's why a cooldown timer should also be considered.
     
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  4. Kether

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    I too think that if a PvE player gets flagged for PvP by attacking, it shouldn't be as easy as leaving the scene to remove the flag. Either a (long) timer or a required visit to the Oracle are good options, imho.

    While I understand the reasons behind this system, I do believe that a PvE player being able to land a free first hit to a PvP one without the possibility for the victim to do a preemptive strike or defend himself in any meaningful way is just a very big issue. A possible solution for that could be the following: When a PvE player attacks a PvP one the attack, whatever its kind, gets delayed for a couple of seconds while a visual cue of the oracle removing the protection is shown on the avatar. That way, if the PvP victim is alert, he could still react. This, of course, removes the possibility of a PvE player using any kind of sneak attack against a PvP player, but I really think that shouldn't be an option. Want to attack without being flagged PvP beforehand or just quick de-bless yourself? Go up-front and be prepared for the consequences.

    Another idea (unrelated to the above) that could be fun would be to completely remove the [PvP] mark in the name tag, so noone can know the blessing status of another avatar beforehand. Then, the following things could happen on an attack:
    -PvP attacks PvP: Attack works normally.
    -PvP attacks PvE: Attack does not work and attacker gets notified of the blessed status of the victim. No actual cue of the attack is shown. The (non) victim doesn't get notified. The idea is to not penalize the PvP player in any way and try to still hide his status as best as possible, to compensate the fact that he has no way to discern others that share his gameplay other than to try.
    -PvE attacks PvP: Attack works, with whatever solution to the "first dirty free hit" issue (mine above or any other). Attacker gets PvP flagged.
    -PvE attacks PvE: Attack does not work. Attacker gets flagged for PvP nonetheless and the victim (and perhaps others) are notified of this. Did you want to start a fight? That's what you get.
     
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  5. Womby

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    I like this idea. It will greatly increase tension for PVP players (you guys like that, right?) and removes the immersion jarring [PVP] tag. The only potential downside for PVE players is being randomly attacked by hopeful PVP players, like a dog humping your leg.
     
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  6. Heradite

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    -PvE attacks PvP: Attack works, with whatever solution to the "first dirty free hit" issue (mine above or any other). Attacker gets PvP flagged with full loot.
    -PvE attacks PvE: Attack does not work. Attacker gets flagged for PvP nonetheless and the victim (and perhaps others) are notified of this. Did you want to start a fight? That's what you get. (Just to avoid accidental flagging).

    If you go to the Oracle, you are flagged PvP with protected loot. But if a PvE player decides to attack a PvP player you should increase the risk for his...duplicitous attack.
     
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  7. Kether

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    That's why I said that the attack should not just not succeed, but not happen at all. Be as non-existant as possible so it doesn't become a bother.

    I thought there was a dialog when you try to attack someone. If there is, no accidental flagging can occur, so even atempting should flag you.
    The thing about the extra risk if you get flagged by attacking (instead of by the oracle)... I'm not sure. After all, the reason this possibility exists is more of a convenience (tournaments in which someone forgot to flag or things like that) than the actual desire of PvE attacking PvP players (which will happen nonetheless), so I don't quite like the idea of punishing people who use it for its actual intended use instead of for backstabbing :p That's why I also said that there should be a visual cue of the protection being removed, and not a subtle one, to be sure than everyone nearby gets notified of the deed (and the victim can respond adequately)
     
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  8. Ristra

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    This only affects open PvP. Those that choose to flag open PvP are requesting the Oracle drop protection from player attacks. Fitting that people who have not requested their protection to be drop can still do so by attacking another player that did.

    The restoring of the protection is the concern.
     
  9. Numa

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    I think the Oracle would incinerate anybody trying that on sacred grounds. Outside though ... ;)
     
  10. Sold and gone

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    What I predict will happen with this is no one will flag at the oracle, or the majority will not. It might take a bit to get to this scenario but after a month or two no one will flag. Stealth builds will be the dominant build for those who do flag. The only real flagging will be in pvp areas where it will be equal. The stealth/backstab from a blue character will be common.
     
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  11. Ristra

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    Na, true PvPers won't care...
     
  12. Sold and gone

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    oh, how many are left here?
     
  13. Ristra

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    They all are, they are stealthed.
     
  14. Sold and gone

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    and if advantage is gained by being able to attack from being blue, then the true pvp'rs will not flag, they will attack from advantage. Sure there might be a couple for a while, until they get punished enough. You will see the opportunist come out of players, not strait up pvp.
     
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  15. Ristra

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    Bringing in the "what people will do" logic has failed me time and time again on these forums.

    What you are saying is true but to admit that is to admit that if everyone was PvP those that do not wish to PvP won't even log in.

    The difference here is only people that wish to PvP will have to deal with this. They choose to flag open PvP and open themselves up to attack. That's what they want, people to attack them. This flagging makes it so anyone can attack them. It's not really any different for them. Only thing that matters is the opening attack. If combat is so out of wack that one hit ends the fight then SotA has bigger issues.

    It does solve the non PvP flagged healer issue very well though.
     
  16. Abydos

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    In more than 30 hours of play, I saw two players with the flag.

    Moonglow Felucca
    Blake Blackstone

    For now, it is impossible to have the flag. Gang Bang Bang Gang Yeah Yeah !!!
     
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  17. Sold and gone

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    We will see, I'm not going to argue with you. It is just my prediction.
     
  18. Ristra

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    It wasn't a gang bang before?
     
  19. Heradite

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    It might exist for a convenience but that's not how it will be used. People will use it to gank. That's how people are. So make them add more risk.

    Which is why I'm for increasing risk for them. This way there is an advantage to flagging at the Oracle.
     
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  20. Sold and gone

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    It would be easier for them just to not have insta flagging. If they do continue with it then yes, there should be penalties involved with being able to do so. I would love to see the discussion on how they came to this conclusion in the first place. I see no threads discussing this with the community. I would love to see the discussion of why this is implemented.
     
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