Massively: SotA's "Launch" and Future

I lack the Photoshop skills, or I'd put this on the Shroud logo

 

I hope the devs read the comments. It's the only way to make this game better.

 

Has anyone played Naval Action? Holy cow - if boats become something like that - YAY!!!

 

The part where it says, "Players are meant to be able to earn anything they want in offline play, barring very specific pledge rewards, so if you wish to play the game as a single-player experience you won’t have to still be paying for the MMO side as well." sounds very ominous.

Is it possible we all end up paying a subscription to play the MMO side?

 

An optional subscription (non-pay-to-win) is the only reasonable idea in this situation. Such as giving a high-valued amount of store credit per month, etc.

 

I see nothing in this post to disagree with in principal, though you can in checkers Mount another checker...
While the Design, and intent of all of these things could be put into the roadmap for the project, one of the key tenets of iterative development (One that we've all experienced and contributed to over the last three years) is incrementally releasing functionality. Having boats and mounts with which one might be able to transport larger amounts of goods seems to be a logical beginning step toward sea battles and jousting.

 

We know they are. I'm talking specifically about this stuff, "I should have just crapped in my hand." I wonder who is adjusting the coding they are writing today based on that helpful insight!

New /crapinhand emote?

 

Yes, of course. But like MANY of the systems that have been created over the last three years, it may be months if not years before we see deeper iterations and in a persistent environment that has a huge impact on how the game is played.

For example, look at POTs. We have no blessing system. In my opinion this impacts a great deal about what kinds of POTs are created, where they are located, what the design of them is. When the blessing system finally comes out months and months from now it may be over two years since POTs were introduced. We'll be playing the game one way, and then blessings will change the way the game is played and people that made decisions (big decisions) about their POTs may be saying "This isn't fair" and they'll be right. That's how I see this boat and mount thing playing out a year from now.

 

Yeah, I couldn't agree more with that. But if you filter out all the nonsense you'll find quite a bit about the combat system and the general tone of people that "don't like it". This has been going on for years and is consistent with much of the feedback given on the forums here. I'm happy we are continuing to make changes, but I'm disappointed that a small group of people that enjoy playing level based EQ and WOW like systems seem to have slowed us down quite a bit from getting to a point where we could address this. In short, I think we wasted a lot of time listening to the wrong people.

 

I'm somewhat expecting this at some point, as the add-on store doesn't seem feasible for a long term solution. Maybe when they actually launch and start marketing more towards new buyers, it may be more lucrative.

 

That's the nature of the beast, Your Excellency. It's is what it looks like on the sausage factory floor.

If you can figure out how to give everyone what they want when they want it in an IT environment with increasing demand, and limited resources and funding, you could easily become the richest man on the planet.

 

Yes, correct. But once we are persistent I don't believe this is a strategy we can afford to use any longer.

Imagine for instance that you are a hot dog vendor. Is is wise to construct the hot dog in front of the person that intends to eat it? What are you going to tell them, please come back in two days and I'll have your hot dog ready for you then? No, you're going to have hot dogs ready to be consumed.

As of July 28th, we're no longer at a point that we can release half finished systems.

 

It won't change with persistence... It is the nature of iterative development.
Every major MMO (including Ultima Online, including Mounts and Boats) developed systems over time, releasing incremental enhancements.
There is nothing new here other than the seat on the factory floor. The floor is there, it's always been there, and the sausage has always been made the same way.

 

If they introduce a subscription fee then they have to exclude the offline mode from this. This would make the offline part even more stand-alone and then they need the offline part to be worth the money as a stand-alone game. And for this to happen, they would have a LOT - and I mean A LOT - of work ahead of themselves.
Selling an offline MMO - which SotA is right now and which seems to be the direction the offline mode is going - will not work if they have to compete with any other real single player RPG out there.

Actually I think no one should ever sell half-finished systems why I think that Early Access is a very bad way to "release" games. I am charged full-price for a game that is not finished and won't be finished for quite some years?
I wonder if this would work for other software or any other product out there, too.
I accept Early Access for a short amount of time but then I am of the opinion that I can expect a finished, working game for my money.

 

What your saying is very inconsistent with your pledge to a Kickstarter. If you didn't want to be sold an incomplete system, then you would not have backed the game until it was finished.

But regarding what happens after July 28th, I'm not talking about adding or improving elements of the game. I'm very happy the developers will continue to improve the game as needed. What I don't like is the thought of major systems being added to the game in piece mail. I think that's likely to unnecessarily impact the persistent world in a negative way. Players are trying to make long term decisions based on "how we think boats will work" for example. As the sausage is being made over months if not years, I can see some players getting an unfair advantage based on the early iterations of boats. Like say you live in a town without a port. No big deal now, but what happens when boats are in the game? It just seems to me like there should be more care and time put into making a system balanced before it completely unsettles the entire economy.

 

Only if the devs fully commit to having no integrity. They've said repeatedly it isn't pay to play its buy to play (i.e. no subscription) so if they change that... but let's be fair, they've been backpedaling on lots of kickstarter and pledge promises. So maybe we will.

 

You should probably explain how KotoR successfully made the transition, much like I explained why ESO's solution was terrible for the current players.

 

The only one I think has done a good job is DDO (Dungeons and Dragons Online).

Free side:
Everything can be earned/unlocked by playing (earn add on store points). There isn't any hampering of auction house or chat or any of the normal features. You can either buy new quests or wait to unlock them.

Paid side:
Everything new is automatically unlocked (until subscription ends). Bonus points for store every month. Unlocks difficulty without having to play lower difficulties.

Everyone else, including games release by this same company, hamper too much stuff that I'd consider an integral part of the game.

 

I see Kickstarter more as some kind of pre-order. I "pre-order" the game, hoping and expecting it to be like it was mentioned in the announcement and then I play it when it is released. If it is good then I am happy, if not then I "destroy" the devs with my rage

Early Access on the other hand has become a release method, anyone is using to charge money up front by selling an unfinished product, hiding behind saying that online games are not "released" anymore, they are just always in development.

On the one hand, I pre-order a burger. I give money and wait until the waitress brings it to my place. Then I eat it and I either like it or not.
But if I buy a burger and the waitress just brings me some buns without meat because the meat will take longer to roast and if I don't get the fries I ordered with it because they decided that salad would be better then I am getting very angry.

 

Sub would always be optional, itll never be forced, no logical debate against that unless you arnt reading.

Easily implemented with options for past backers (certain pledge tiers get subs for free for a certain time frame or some other similar option). Its an idea with credit. Though just needs to be balanced.

Id be willing to pay an optional sub of 10 bucks a month and receive absolutely nothing, just knowing that im supporting the game/dev/progress, but that's just me. I don't like when games throw too much stuff at me really, waters them down and makes them less meaningful.