A Changed Perspective on Release (rmt)

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Superbitsandbob, Jan 31, 2018.

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  1. Oeneusc

    Oeneusc Avatar

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    I'd like to think that if Dev's are spawning anything on a production server that it would be logged. Other than special events I can't imagine them needing to even spawn a bottle of dye.
     
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  2. Diab Blackbow

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    Now people are getting crazy. A few thousand dollars from gold selling kick backs is not worth loosing your job and risking your career and families financial security. Those people will be caught and dealt with. Life will go on.
     
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  3. Earl Atogrim von Draken

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    No, no. That's all by purpose if you'd ask me. Hype it as much as possible no matter what. Fan the flames as long as there is something to kindle by all means.
    Some of the assumptions here are actually so insane they aren't even worth a retort.
    Folks, don't get baited by stuff like this.
     
  4. Joe Zhudarak

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    i have fun collecting rares, i have fun selling things for $ and using the money to buy adds on, i have fun playing sota, grinding, doing quests ...there are a place for everyone here.
     
  5. Filter Bubble Algorithm

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  6. Filter Bubble Algorithm

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    If you dont know, you dont look, and if you dont look, you will never know.
     
  7. mass

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  8. Filter Bubble Algorithm

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    Dude.. whoever would do that would be stupid to openly admit it... that is the whole point of what im trying to convey.
    Ive had people steal from my business for years and I could never figure out who, until I put a trap and they fell in it. Looking at a million hours of camera footage would of done the same... but a trap is a million times more faster and simpler. I just couldnt go through so many hours of camera footage to figure out who was stealing. That's my point.
     
  9. Jezebel Caerndow

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    Dev spawned stuff has no loots. I love that a post showing my anger towards having stuff spawned on me is now trying to be used to say the devs were spawning stuff on me for economic gains, LMAO, wow.
     
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  10. majoria70

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    Yes I was too when I heard this too. Imagine paying for skill raising when so many would gladly help each other without being paid but such is life and you don't have to do that as I will never. So it is up to you to play it the way you like.
     
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  11. Nikko

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    I wonder how many more of these threads we'll see... Unbelievable.
     
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  12. sefer

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    Many of you are playing the role of devils advocate, talking about fair and unfair... Let me ask you some questions here, really think about this.
    (questions 1-9 are from a book, MMOS from the Outside In.)

    1. Is it fair that some people have more free time to play than others?
    2. Is it fair that some people have better internet connections or graphics cards than others?
    3. Is it fair that some people have better reaction times than others?
    4. Is it fair that some people can solve challenges faster than others?
    5. Is it fair that some people have more friends in the game than others?
    6. Is it fair that some people get into an exclusive raiding guild but not others?
    7. Is it fair that someone knows a developer on the team and gets inside information?
    8. Is it fair that some classes are obviously favored over others?
    9. Is it fair that some of us are developers and understand the game mechanics faster than others?

    10.You enter a golf tournament, is it fair that your clubs are more expensive, made of the best material to ensure stronger better swings and your opponents do not have them?
    11. You join a game and are invited into a pvp guild that wants to win the most points in an event coming up, they powerlevel you, give you the best gear, and show you a video of how to use the current meta skills/items. Is this fair to those not in the guild?
    12. You have a job and can only play for 2 hours a day, you started a year ago. A new kid to the game joins your guild and doesn't need a job, they play 8+ hours a day and have passed you in only a couple of weeks. Is this fair?
    13. You joined the game late, those who started when it came out have items no longer available, like shields with something called LRC or HCI on them.. Is this fair?

    Money has always been affecting games... Where you live, the internet connection, the computer, the keyboard, the mouse... When it comes to pvp or pve, someone will always be better than someone else, just from those things alone. Do you think its unfair that someone has less internet speed than you? A worse keyboard? Old parts that make the game stutter and lag? Clearly it isn't fair, right? To them? Surely you should stutter and lag too, just to make it even and fair. "But I bought these parts so that it WOULDNT stutter, and this internet so that it WOULDNT lag, how would that be fair?" But they can't afford that.... Therefore its unfair that you have that advantage and they dont.

    So when you say "Its unfair they can pay people to get power leveled" think about all those other questions. Its unfair you live where the internet is better. Its unfair you have better internet. Its unfair that you have better computer parts. Its unfair that you have more time than them to play. Does that mean the game should be designed to where everyone lags and stutters, where you can only play if using default keyboard and mice from Dell, and everyone is only allowed to play for 1 hour each day. You also are only allowed to play 1 class, using the same skills and items, obviously for fairness, right? After all, if things were unfair, it wouldn't be fun and fair for everyone...
     
  13. Sher Shadowleaf

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    For me, I do what I do every day and don't really worry about what anyone else is doing, beyond hoping they're enjoying their day. It sounds like you're concerned with other people getting ahead of you, or lording GMs over you. There will always be people higher and lower than you and you can't worry about it to the point you want to control policy in order to place yourself where you want in the hierarchy of levels.
     
  14. Satan Himself

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    Listen, Lawyer Boy Nib aka The Real Internet Lawyer. Not an issue here, but since you raised the point, changes to the TOS require bilateral consent or are generally unenforceable. Port's waiver of numerous provisions in the TOS over the years will make certain terms of the TOS impossible to enforce. TOS does not give the provider of services the right to confiscate property you've paid for without specific cause. Finally, agreeing to the TOS is not a blanket waiver of damages.

    Port's long-stated policy (notably published AFTER the TOS) is that we can sell pixels under their guidelines. So when Port induces us to spend money during a telethon, or buy a pledge, as examples, with the explicit promise that we can sell those pixels and pledges, then neither I nor any fact finder will care much at all about the TOS, which is at best silent on the subject and at worst has been waived by Port.

    DLMB

    (P.S. I have 100% faith in Port doing the right thing legally and have NEVER seen them do anything that I considered improper, legally speaking. Although the decay feature should earn Chris some time in jail .....)
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2018
  15. Earl Atogrim von Draken

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    Man. If you do serious posts you don't pull back ^^
     
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  16. Jezebel Caerndow

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    While time lord has giving me the most laughs, budners one post about death decay saying, "I like taxes, it give meaning to poverty" is my #1 funniest post I have seen, I am laughing right now just writing this.
     
  17. StrangerDiamond

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    This thread is one of the most interesting collection of logical fallacies I have ever read.

    Its ok because everyone else does it... yet its not been ruled upon in international courts, yet.

    But I think the ideological battle goes much further than that and becomes an issue because it always was an issue. Don't anyone remember the almost tearful apology to WoW players and staff by some popular RMT seller that made a fortune in UO ? WoW sure did enforce its anti-RMT policy, this seller has not only apologized, he promised never to ever do this again, I'm not a stalker so I don't know if it was just words thrown in the air. You don't make someone that has unconditional success bend like that, unless there's a real problem.

    RMT destroyed UO's story, which was constructed with a player economy and NOT a meta-economy.

    Now you can say, well I don't mind its the past : you can say, well it didn't really impact me because the only part it really destroyed was the live story and continuity of ultima.

    Then I'll ask, so you do not care about the continuity of Ultima ? So you didn't really love ultima, you just think it was an ok entertaining game that didn't really challenge your views of the world and made you reflect upon meta-physical concepts ?

    To me and alot of the underdogs, it matters more than anything and I have been asking for a siege perilous server since the day the marketplace was created. I ALWAYS wanted to play away from any such type of meta-economy which is the anti-thesis of RPG. You think a GM in a D&D LARP would allow someone paying 10 bucks to some stranger to get something ?

    NO, it gets you banned from the LARP for life, and it always was.

    So at least stop acting like its strange that people find it insulting. You can say that it doesn't affect you or don't matter to you because whatever reason, but don't try to shift the blame for the emotional reaction that was fully predictable (every MMO has it).

    Time to wake up and really define limits, or split us into a siege perilous server and never look at us again, we'll make our own game even if there's only 100 of us. That is what origin did for us after the EXACT SAME DEBATE, at least we had an option and weren't considered lunatics.

    WE LOVE ULTIMA, WE LOVE UO, WE LOVE RPGS.

    We use money to go by, but we don't love money.

    Simple isn't it ?
     
  18. StrangerDiamond

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    haha, indeed... just shows how much bad arguments we're facing.

    About my previous posts, I don't want anyone to think I'm against RMT, I sure think its ok that Mac is selling exp, I guess as long as there is a slight risk that the beneficiary can succumb to the process. I guess hiding someone behind a boulder will be defined by the devs as an "xp exploit" but whatever, I'm sure mac can do the same thing in a more legit way.

    What I want to see however, is an OPTION for players who want to play outside of the SIMS (ultimate collector) side of the game and who are interested in full immersion into the RPG/story part. This could even satisfy the "single player" fans who want to have impact on the world and a truely immersive experience.

    Would I still log in the main servers for events and social ? Sure, I think we have an rich and colorful community and there would be nights dedicated to this.

    But when I want to play the spiritual successor to the ultimas, I want all that noise OUT, and play with players who chose the rocky and hard road (don't tell me friends online, it needs tweaks or RMT will flourish there as well).

    I wouldn't have pushed for it all this time if the idea for siege perilous wasn't created by Origin (hence some of our devs)...
     
  19. Sher Shadowleaf

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    How is a meta-economy the anti-thesis of RPG? Is an RPG only defined as a D&D LARP, and is SOTA a D&D LARP? I ask because I truly don't know, and never played D&D and have heard 80 different definitions of an RPG, with everyone insisting his/her definition is the correct one. Can you refer me to the definitions, because when I look them up, I can't really find a 'definite' definition.
     
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  20. StrangerDiamond

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    Fair questions :

    A meta economy ruins the definition of rare materials in a RPG, I pay a high price for high end materials not because it is truely rare, but because an outside meta-economy dictates that's what its worth. So I'm not playing a RPG, I'm playing a steam punk medieval sims, which is fine, I always loved sims since simcity.

    What I'm speaking about is not truely the definition of RPG, but rather the definition of game versus simulation.

    SotA is a simulation, with similar rules and feel to old school RPGs, lots of efforts have been put into this and by no means I want to diminish devs efforts here.

    Thats why sometimes people use such expressions as "there is no game in this" "you are not game to do this".

    The risk becomes the definition, but also the intrigue... and where is the intrigue when something external defines the boundaries for progress ?

    I'm sorry if any of this gets lost in translation, I know my syntax is terrible :/
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2018
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