Drop level system for a full skill based system

Discussion in 'Skills and Combat' started by ilcontegis, Oct 29, 2014.

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  1. mike11

    mike11 Avatar

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    My 4c is that I agree the level system is a bit startling, and, with some other things, shaping up to be fairly standard in terms of combat and power separation.

    I liked the game better without the xp system but that doesnt mean its crap. I say they can repurpose it somehow, and if they can just dont have levels and try something else.

    I think combat and pvp will be better for it in the long run. Time better spent making other things.

    Sent from my GT-S5690M using Tapatalk 2
     
  2. GimmeUOPlz

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    Yeah, the one thing I'm unhappy with atm is the progression. I'm pretty sure its going to gravitate towards a more "hybrid" system if you will instead of the dull linear level grind that exists now, mainly cuz they promised they wouldn't have a dull linear level grind like there exists now in the game.


    Id be very happy if they just adopted a use base skill system, but honestly we all know by now that there are problems (BIG problems) regarding fun factor, grind, more prominent and potentially serious bugs and abuse, etc. with use based systems. So I'd rather they find some nice middle ground here to satisfy both sides.


    And also, as a side note, I'm not too worried about it because I do NOT play these games for the progression, whether it be level or use based, I play for the content and PvP. For me and many other people its kind of unimportant if we're being honest. STILL I don't like it, but I would never quit because of it.
     
  3. Uncle Ben

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    I'd like to see the re-introduction of the Skill system as well. However, seen that the "Trainers" will be included in the following releases I think that boat has already sailed.

    The Devs did manage to make the current leveling system somewhat resembling the Skill system (Don't flame me, I am not saying its the same). I noticed that the skill points gained per level appears to be decreasing after every 10 levels (Maybe I just cannot count but it does seem to be that way currently). The deceasing number of skill points gained at higher level is resembling back in the old UO days where your skill gets harder to advance at a higher rank.

    Now my opinion on the concern of a character who intend to become a Mage, yet using a sword for leveling. Just like in University of the real world, for 1st year students, regardless of the their majors they have to take some English, Math and Science courses. Only until they are into the 3rd year and up the students start to actually focusing on what their actual major is.

    With the University example in mind now come back to SOTA. A brand new character who knows nothing about killing stuff wants to become a Mage. He (or She) may simply just pick up a random cleaver and starts to kill chicken (you know just want to kill stuff and a cleaver is something right in front of him). After some days of chicken chopping he may gained enough knowledge of how to kill a live creature. At this point he finds a seasoned Mage to train and acquire the knowledge of fireball. As the character progress he would find that using Fire based skills where he has been trying to improve all along can kill things way easier than a cleaver or other methods. After this realization, the character will stop using anything else other than his "focused" fire spells to advance at a higher level (After all a cleaver or a mace just cannot kill a dragon well enough when compared to a bad @$$ fire spell).

    As for respecting, I hope there will be some kind of exp debt (if we are sticking to level system) so the character have to "regain" their skill points rather than just getting a big refund back to you all at once. The exp required for regaining the skill points of course should be much less when compared to gaining an actual level.

    For crafting, I have no information over this, maybe in the next few releases we'll know how it works.

    That was my 2 c on this matter. AND YES if there is a way to re-introducing the Skill based system it would be awesome, just I doubt that it would happen.
     
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  4. Haz

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    I think Ben may have the jist of it.

    I was not real happy about a leveling, as opposed to a skill based system. Then I watched the last R11 hangout. Appears trainers will be coming in R12. I think, if used correctly, trainers to build certain skills will limit the " use a sword to build Margery skills" type of play. One of the reasons, as mentioned in the hangout....a Mage trainer may require you to go on a quest or do something for him before he will train you. With a little bit of luck and fore thought, I hope the devs set it up that if you are wanting a Margery skill then the trainer is gonna require that whatever you do for the trainer, requires it be done using Margery! We could further lock out using swords to become a Mage by locking those points you used at the trainers to the skill tree you were trained in, meaning if you used five points to learn a fire skill from a fire trainer, those points are gonna stay in that tree even when respecting.

    I'm not saying every skill will or should require a trainer, or even that skills in the lower levels of a tree, or at lower levels of proficiency should require trainers or lock the skills to that tree, but I can't help wondering how sword fighting to make a Mage is going to be handled. I'll bet there is something in R12, using trainers, helps curb this mode of character creation.

    5 days to the beginning of finding out.
     
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  5. Isaiah

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    Trainers also provide a gold sink, and a deterrent for people to respec their characters all the time.

    The level based skill system is also good to remove the repetitive skill grind as some may have touched on. The ability to just play your character and you can assign skills as needed. That means if I like to fish I can keep fishing etc. Who cares if somebody fishes and becomes a blacksmith. Also there is no telling whether or not that fishing alone could gain you enough skill points to even master blacksmithing. You might need more skill points in fishing to be high enough level fisherman to gain XP efficiently anyway. I'm not sure I communicated that point well enough, but if I did, you should be able to see why using the skill you want to level up might be a necessity anyway.
     
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  6. Tompez42

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    I worry about this mostly with crafting. It is going to be really difficult to make sure one crafting skill isn't the 'easy' skill everyone uses to level the 'good' crafting skills.
     
  7. MalakBrightpalm

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    I dislike the gold sink provided by trainers. It really only applies to newer characters, who must respec often in search of a good working build. Those who are more advanced will have worked out their power base, and will have more room to build exotic talent point constructions that don't have to work... yet. They can rely on the solid base to make them effective farmers, producers, fishers, dungeoneers, and PvP players, until that elaborate construction is complete, and ready to use.

    All of which is to say, the gold sink wouldn't effect end-game players and end-game economy, but serves as a very effective stumbling block for new players.
     
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  8. Lord Spaz

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    yup its the pattern I see with this game same as any other MMO nowadays with some added features and many things lost on the way

    After watching some of LBs interviews I rly thought we would go back to the great games they made but to me it looks like they took a few good ideas from recent games (the crafting system from minecraft) and wanted to just create a game with that new knowledge. Its exactly what I did not want them to do... because I feel Games and especially RPGS with 1? exception being the TES series and even those apart from the graphics arent that good from a rpg perspective

    I like to take the example of Grand Theft Auto and its creator Rockstar, as to me they show every other game company how games are supposed to look feel and be with todays tools. The game itself is still the same, its an open world where you play a thug that along with a brilliant story (wich they took from the movies they watched but hey if its good then sure everyone needs insiration right) So all they did was improve their initial idea as the new technology allowed to do so.
    The small things they added were all present in RPG a long time before like make your character wear diffrent stuff or have an actual character progress.

    That tells us an idea that is 20 years old or almost still has great (actually no other even come close) success.

    So why think you have to be like the new kids you guys made stunning games and all those companies took inspiration from you guys...
    We still think you can kick it but do it like in the old days!!
     
  9. ilcontegis

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    I'd be happy to know devs opinion on this regard.
    This is a deal-breaker point for many of us.
     
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  10. YuriGaDaisukiDa

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    this has been bugging me.

    I understand why they went the way they did, but there are tons of little things that made UO great that no longer exist here in SOTA

    i feel like im playing a wow clone with some UO features, instead of a game in the spirit of UO =[
     
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  11. YuriGaDaisukiDa

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    as it stands I'm really disappointed.

    I realize this is alpha and a lot is gonna change, and be balanced, but there are a lot of features that are core features, and i dont see them being removed. like the way they did levels....

    also no mounted combat anymore? another thing off the list that made UO the best
     
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