Looting items in PvP helps crafting! -- (Dev) Replied

I heard a dev named B on one of the threads who said there will be no looting. I like the fact people can opt out of PvP, but for those who do looting has to be acceptable.

If you make 20 swords and armor pieces in 5 minutes, but people only lose armor and weapons due to decay once every two weeks or so where will crafting be?

Someone in chat said they could make crafting slower. Great idea until somebody makes 50x the gold adventuring in dungeons than crafting. NOT WORTH YOUR INGOTS OR TIME.

WE NEED LOOTING IN PVP (ESPECIALLY CONSENSUAL PVP)!!!

 

why do you think looting would speed up crafting? still same number of items in world

 

Whatever the solution on the looting end... Its not necessarily good that you can gain so much wealth adventuring either. And even if you did find a dungeon with a pile of 5,000 gold, it would be hard to carry it home in your pockets and would need a lot of work and planning.

In general, I think gaining wealth in the game should be hard.

 

I think the skills of the crafters should be needed also for repairing as well as making new items. I truly hope the items will have value, like they had/have in real life: the good quality stuff really costs, weapons cost, armor costs a lot - compared to the average income! Not everyone can be rich, not everyone can have tons of gold in their home / bank... There needs to be a rotation for the currency as well.

As long as the currency doesn't suffer from hyper-inflation like in some games before, I'm really happy.

 

@Citizen There may be the same number of Items but looted items get horded or reduced to ingots. At least that's how it was in UO.

However I heard good news from Chris in the chat. He said certain Guild options would allow for Full Loot in PvP. So that sounds much better to me!

SOLVED in my book.

 

Full Loot in PvP, sign me up!

 

I agree with full looting in PvP.....this does actually help crafters as the people who die then have to go and buy items to replace what is lost. Also people seem to forget that Pking is actually a profession and that there needs to be some kind of reward involved.

I just really hope the items that crafters make don't become insanely complicated with various modifications etc. It should be simple with various layers of quality that can then be reflected within the sale price.

 

I think there was some talk about having crafted items be able to be upgraded some way that would risk breaking.

So it may not be possible to make 20 of the best swords in 5 minutes as an example,
Maybe it is closer to 5 amazing swords per day (along with 95 broken ones)

Let us also not forget that the rate that one can craft goods can also be easily gated by gathering skills. Maybe you dont have the raw resources coming in to attempt to make 100swords a day, maybe you are closer to 20? Keeping the same ratio would drop you down to 1 amazing sword (19 broken ones)

You can see how easily you can adjust things (while in game development) to balance out supply and demand


As for looting people in PvP
I would be against it as far as the normal model of PvP, as LB is trying to encourage people that specifically dont want to PvP to try it out. Nothing will derail that quicker than the risk of losing all of their gear.

Maybe you have different tiers of PvP though? So hardcore PvPers that are always flagged can loot other PvPers of the same PvP setting? People on lower settings that are safe from being looted could not loot others,
Something like that may be a compromise

 

We completely understand the fact that full loot helps crafting. We also have not made any final decision on loot rules.

I was more speaking to the fact that we do not want a PvE player to be killed by a PvP player unless there is proper risk/reward communication. I personally like the idea of a full loot free-for-all in open PvP.

 

I'd like to see intelligent monsters loot players so they are forced to hurry back before another player kills the monster. Not sure how this functions fairly with instances though...

 

I would like to see looted gear be broken for the looter. Wait, hear me out!

You kill a guy in full leather. Only his equipped items appear broken, and they are only broken for whoever loots them. This way, looters will evaluate the value of the items they take in terms of upgrades or backup gear that they wish to take and have repaired, vs the weight of lugging around a bag of garbage scrap to vendor. A knight in plate who kills a ranger will not summarily loot a full set of leather into his pack without thinking twice, unless he values the gear enough to go have it repaired. Looters will take everything of value to them but might leave a few pieces behind to be reclaimed by the owner because the scrap weight is not worth carrying around. In the original owner's eyes, any gear left has only suffered the normal wear and tear of battle and it not instantly damaged.

Something like that might help players consider their encounters more thoroughly and PvP would not just be about farming players for profit, or as much profit as a free set of plate every few minutes. It would still stimulate crafting, repair, and replacements, but it doesn't mean you have to take 100% of what is on a player's corpse automatically. Just a thought!

 

<cite>I would like to see looted gear be broken for the looter.</cite>

@LordSlack - I don't think the gear should suffer some extra damage from being looted. The damage to the gear should be sustained during the battle. This damage can be substantial as the player wearing the gear did perish but the act of looting actually damaging the gear more is an unrealistic penalty.

 

I don't see looting in PVP necessary for keeping crafting alive I've played PVP and PVE and my crafting skill never got any extra use in PVP. Hope they stick with no looting.

 

@Death-Knell - I think the point is that the crafting community get more sales if PvP is full loot. Your crafting skill may have never gotten use in PvP but PvP provides another avenue for your loot to go, either into the smelter or my bank, but not back to you thus forcing you to support the crafters.

 

How will it make any difference? there is still x number of swords, the only difference is who has x sword. In fact if anything its going to DETRACT from crafting because you steal my sword, sell it to an NPC now person x can buy that sword cheaper from the NPC than they can a new sword from Death-knell.

I'm with Death-knell, this is just a poor excuse designed to please one tiny segment of the community (the open full PVP people), will do nothing for the crafters at all

 

I'm sorry, looting doesn't help crafters, it helps trade at best - good items circulate, bad items get resmelted. The reselling also doesn't happen by crafters, but by looters. To be fair, there might be an initial one-time effect when combatants purchase spare swords for quick replacement, but once you have those, it's back to 1:1 circulation.

What *does* help crafting is item wear/durability based on either time, wear, or both, and those could even be influenced by the crafter in the crafting process for either a small bonus or malus, depending on demand.

 

@Calem - Full loot help crafting alot especially since many looted items will be recycled and the material you get from a worn item will be less then what you used making it. It seems armor and weapon will in the end brake if they isnt repaired and that can also be a huge dump for items in the world.

Another option that removed items from UO was a trashcan placed close to hotspots like banks where you could throw away items not wanted. Many looted items went through that trashcan when the player reached his banklimit.

Less items in the world help the ones that create them, the crafters.

 

@Calem:

Looting does help crafters, the person who is getting looted has to buy more weapons. I guess the guy who sold it to him could sell it back to him theoretically. There's no reason you can't have item durability and loot though. If you don't want loot, stick to the PVE option.

 

"How will it make any difference? there is still x number of swords, the only difference is who has x sword. In fact if anything its going to DETRACT from crafting because you steal my sword, sell it to an NPC now person x can buy that sword cheaper from the NPC than they can a new sword from Death-knell."

You are assuming that the NPC will resell the sword for less than Death-Knell. I think NPCs should serve as an item sink and not competition to the crafters. NPCs should buy low and sell high.

Looting needs to be implemented for a lot of reasons and the crafting professions and NPC vendors will need to be developed taking that into account.

 

PvPers and PKers in general hoard or reduce the items to ingots to be recrafted. They don't usually resell the items so they are out of the general economy.

I think there was a thread about it in the PvP area and they mostly said they didn't resell the items they keep them. However B said they haven't made the decision. I'm sure they will come up with something that works. I was just concerned.