Macroing

You have to use to skills to spend experience on them.

 

True but using = macros to some. If everyone just pressed a button a million times, it would count, but instead people download key pressing programs and go to sleep. That's the deal breaker here.

 

Not slower. Still at 4x. They just get less with a smaller pool.

Exp from mobs and Skill gain are not linked. It's an illusion to think that using a skill while fighting means you were gaining that skill from fighting. The skill is just taking from the pool regardless of what you are doing at time.

You can be fighting away and randomly casting anything that is not really helping you win the fights. Being in a fight does not make that skill use more legit. It just appears to be legit.

We do not really have a use based system. We have an exp gain system with a hidden level system and an exp drain system disguised as a use based system.

 

That's where you are 98% wrong. The fact there is a separate pool is to discourage macros. However, some have falsely decided they are separate. All anyone needs to do is read the responses from port people. It is 100% clear that they do not intend for people to macro.

 

Good. We are not there yet!
I look forward to being wrong in the future.

 

Could NOT have said it any better myself, And the proof is Gust Balls or at least one example is

 

This is testing So all exploits yield some positive testing potential, so I don't hold it against anyone. I exploited gold in a mine once.

 

They may not intend for people to macro but they have set up one of the easiest systems to allow for it imaginable.

 

But getting the pooled experience neccessary to macro with is gonna take you jsut as long as it would be to macro them. If a macroer locks skills and pools xp, then later goes to sleep while a auto-key presser macros them, the person that spent the same time online as him and left their skills unlocked while they went out and accumulated experience is already going to be ahead. The macroer will always be behind the non-macroer

 

How?

 

How really - - - Ok let see you have 10 Glyphs that can be locked in number slots 1 - 10 and all you have to do is hit a number to use a skill.

So with my simple mouse button I record that the f3 button hits 2 , waits 6 seconds, hits 4 waits 23 seconds, hits 3 waits 7 seconds, hits 9 waits 12 seconds and cen be repeated all with a simple mouse recorded button. Razer even has Macro Programs built into it, so does a Logitech Keyboars, and so do Game Pads . . . . .

Now the target can be a Gust ball - it does NOT move, does NOT die, . . . . . . .

 

Great point. I think the appeal here is to the min/maxers. The people that want 100% control over their character. Further, this person would likely choose skills that result in a faster experience pool than using the skill they want to grow. It's common that we farm over mobs with optimal AOE skills even though we fight PvP with non AOE skills. It's convoluted. But to builders, it is playing to them.

I will admit to taming thousands of beasts in other games to get optimal stats. I suppose it could be argued that some gustballers are the same, but this is not those games... I hope.

Alas, my last proposition to kill the ability to turn off training on those skills people choose will.absolutely kill the ability to game the skill system with the exception of people who can farm the exp pool.AFK.

 

Right. The only benifit is that you arent distracte dby tryign to survive so u can focus more on exactly what you want.

But where do you get the pooled experience you need in order to gain off of it? I get how to macro, i dont get how it's mroe efficient and quicker than fighting monsters for skill gain

 

You go and buy a pet - a high-level expensive pet, human or otherwise that can kill stuff you can't at the level you're at and just go stand nearby in a party with them. AFK or doing other things. Possible the point of "why all this objection to macroing when I went to earn all the exp on my own."

 

But your still gonna gain skills alot slower that way than if you jsut go fight stuff yourself. Because you first have to accumulate the experience, THEN go spend it.

A person fightign monsters on their own is gonna skip the middle man and go strait to skill-gain

 

I don't know if you realize this, but you are trying to convince the people that are already doing it right.

 

Seems like there might be a potential problem with afk macroing while a pet is set to agressive and killing stuff automatically. I can see that. But only because you can do it the efficient way whiel your online, then rever to this method at any time while your offline.

But unless there are actually things being killed adn experience goign into your pool whiel your afk it doesnt work. But that woudls till be the case with a traditional leveling system without use based gain. Botting has always been an issue.

This would be a good tiem to poitn otu that after final wipe, botting will be agaisnt the rules and can be reported.

Do what right?

 

You seem to be either intentionally missing a point several people have pointed out to you, or are having a problem picturing the situation.

You are not comparing someone's macroing play vs someone's active play.
You're comparing someone's macroing play vs no play at all.

People macro (or bot, same thing) when they wouldn't be able to play otherwise. They can go sleep, read a book, do whatever.

So you are comparing their slow gain, with your no gain.

They can macro anything. Exp gain, exp use, crafting, gathering, you name it.
That is an inherent part of the fact that your game is played on a computer.

In fact, I have an open challenge.
$20 in store credit for anyone who provides an automated anti-macroing idea that I can't point out a way around or that has an innate implementation failure.
If you think you have a way to fix macroing, Tag me in the post, and I will attempt point out any reason it won't work or would be ineffective.
First one to give me one I can't break gets $20.

But the short answer is, there is none. Because it's not a single problem to be fixed. It's a cold war between developers and players who can program. Less than 1% of players know how to code intricate macros/bots, but all it takes is one to release a tool others can use.

The most effective way to stop people macroing is to design the system so that macroing does not give an advantage over those who don't.
One of the most commonly viewed as acceptable method of doing that has already been implemented on here in one form, the "power hour"/daily 4x that only accumulates while offline, and only lasts a given amount of time, therefore people try to maximize it's usage by active play. This doesn't stop macroing, but it does equalize the playing field a bit since a macroer has to macro for 4 hours(if at same efficienty) to equal the 1 hour of boosted active play, and since active play is more efficient in most cases, that usually is closer to 8:1 ratio. This fails when you consider multiboxing and multiple account rotations.

However, barring that, the next most effective method is not automated, but staff enforcement. That means systems that monitor play, try to detect anomalies, random checks, etc etc. All of this is expensive in terms of staff time to do. Which is what they're setup to due now, go read the TOS and the EULA to see how much leeway they've given themselves, it's a work of art.

Also, i'll point out at this point, that portalarium has already "officially" condoned macroing in their pairing with the built-in macro keyboard. And if you think that can't do much, i have some 1-button combine and pvp and gathering scripts i could show you.

 

Botting is always a problem. And I'm pretty sure i saw somewhere that you will be able to report people botting (it's a problem in every online game).

I agree with this and could swear i have heard them mention that Botting (afk killing stuff or harvesting)is gonna be agaisnt the rules after final wipe. But i cant rememebr where.

I agree witht hat too, But I was thinking tahru, fister, wiens, etc were telling me that hitting a gustball to gain skills is letting people get ahead without doing anythign extra, which WAS the case before the patch yesterday,
But as of yesterday, it is no logner the case because, unless you lock the skills your using, you can no logner accumulate vast ammoutns of pooled experience because they are used up too quickly.


It's hittign a gustball thing i have been attempting to clear up. And i do remember the devs sayign hitting a gustball to gain skills is not soemthign they worry about. And hats why.

But botting is a different issue

 

Bottign would be just as easy without a gustball as well, but currently, you do progress much faster while online killing things yourself. And if you cant get rid of bots, the best thignt o do is slow them down and make botting illegal in-game