(NecroThread)Archery "adjustments"

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Barugon, Jul 24, 2019.

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  1. Chatele

    Chatele Avatar

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    Geesh all this talk about nerfing ARCHERY again, is making me not want to return to this game.... been playing another game at the moment.... But still paying the monthly fee to support this game, hoping it gets better.... waiting for EP2 …. I am an archer, and I don not own any of those bows you are talking about and I am light armor spec …. don't nerf us because of PVP or because of the bows.... if it is the bows causing the issue then nerf that.... I have hard enough time as it is AS A NON PVP, SOLO PLAYER.... Don't touch my archer lol
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2019
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  2. GMDavros

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    Amen to that.

    Fenris
     
  3. Violet Ronso

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    Have you read any of the "nerf archery" comments? I'll repeat what I've told every new person hopping on the "dont nerf us" train : we are not asking to nerf Archery, we are asking to nerf charged shot archers, and more their power into glyph using archers, you know, the casual players.

    TLDR : we want to nerf min maxers play style and buff the casual players style, thus we want to buff how you play... smh...
     
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  4. Cora Cuz'avich

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    In an empty hallway?
     
  5. Diab Blackbow

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    They already nerfed charged shot once. They just need to fix what is making it broken now. Glyphs for Ranged are still strong, I was hitting 1300+ Aim Shots without tactics specialization, 1500+ with.
     
  6. Violet Ronso

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    And that is fine, but it isnt as consistent as a charged shot, otherwise people would not be using 1 glyph out of the whole tree (disabling shot to slow), and only charged shots for the rest. If you watch girlsname's stream, you can see him running from boss to boss, zone to zone killing off the mobs with worthwhile loot, not even paying attention to anything else, and looking like a fully automatic sniper being wielded by speedy Gonzales, it's insane, and he is doing that to show off how strong it is right now. He pops air shield (with a 0.4 focus transfert rate, meaning he only takes 40% dmg) and barely uses focus, so his whole focus pool is used to mitigate the damage he might take when he isnt dodging, so he has an insanely easy time soloing pretty much anything (or close).
     
  7. Diab Blackbow

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    I watched his stream... He does a little more than just use Charged Shot. He also has a ton of XP in skills. You are trying to protect the casuals by using an extreme example as justification. There was a time when you could use a lot less XP and get 100% avoidance. This is not nearly as broken as that.
     
  8. Violet Ronso

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    The avoidance thing has been fixed since, and sure, GN has a lot of exp, so his power is higher than others, but the case remains. I tried the build, as a lvl 100 adventurer and noticed the difference between charged shots and glyphs, yet I have 10x less exp than him. Like I said, we arent asking to take power away from bows, just make then focus dependent like everyone
     
  9. Barugon

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    The difference here is that Aimed Shot takes focus and has a cooldown, free-attack does not.
     
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  10. Spinok

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    High level mage is not even close to focus dependant class. Generally focus cost for mages should be raised twice may be more to make it focus dependant... But who cares...
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2019
  11. Violet Ronso

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    So a mage with 0 focus can still roll at 100% efficiency? Dang I must have misunderstood how spells work, my bad.
     
  12. Spinok

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    If you play right way as high level mage, you will never have problems with focus. Its hard to put your focus even to half of pool if you do pve right way. So by the fact there is no difference with charged attack.... ahh there is difference your regen focus MUCH faster for your air shield then archer can do it ;)
     
  13. Aetrion

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    It does seem relatively easy to regenerate focus faster than you can burn through it as a mage.

    I do want to speak in defense of archers though. Yes they are amazingly powerful, but to me it doesn't feel like that's annoying because they are too strong, but because as a mage I just feel too weak.

    It seems that with magic everything is balanced around having to put enemies into the old Ice Field/Ring of Fire/Meteor Shower combo, and those ground effects don't stack when multiple mages use them, so having multiple mages in a group tends to be inefficient. On top of that aggro management is tricky in this game, and there aren't a lot of players who come in with raid experience from games like WoW, so throwing tons of AoEs around tends to get the mages killed pretty quickly. Archers on the other hand are the DPS backbone of any group and can dump tons of damage into a single target. Yes, that's very powerful, but I'd rather keep it that way, I need those guys around!

    As far as PvP is concerned, it's not the damage that should be in question, it's the mobility. It's the combination of being able to run at high speeds and do a ton of damage that makes archers extremely powerful in a PvP scenario. There should be a bit more of a tradeoff between damage and speed. When all is said and done though open world PvP where people aren't artificially confined to balanced matchups will always be dominated by the fastest ranged characters you can build. Having the initiative in a fight is simply too powerful of an advantage. If you can escape from a losing fight and stay on the enemy when you're winning you essentially play for win or draw. If you can't chase enemies down and you can't get away when you're losing you play for lose or draw. No matter how you slice it, in open world PvP speed is king.
     
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  14. Barugon

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    After spending a lot of time in UT this release, I've concluded that the most effective schools are:
    • Death (Corpse Explosion) for the sommoners at the begining.
    • Life (Banish Undead) for the rest.
     
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  15. Sara Dreygon

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    I do quite fine with berserker and no magic shield - you just need to kill it before you die. Once you hit enough str, HP, skills, equipment, etc. a handful of attacks can kill most everything (except some bosses), especially when you mix in a body slam. Many mobs you can body slam, stab, stab, stab, body slam, stab, etc. and it dies fairly quickly often without even getting an attack off.
     
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  16. Cora Cuz'avich

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    How much is "enough?" And at what (approximate) level could that be reached? I always figured (wrongly) that once I was over level 100ish, a lot of the tough stuff would become doable, but I still struggle with a lot of things. I can kill the phoenix, but it's a loooong hard fight. The daemon isn't too horrible, but the wave battles to get to him, and tracking down keys to get into the room, have made it more hassle than it's worth. (At least, until the elite skeletons become relatively easy to deal with. I'm not a fan of having to grind content in order to grind other content.) Torc is no big deal, since he's more an issue of tactics than skill levels. I can do the "lesser" dragons, but a few good crits in a row can still kill me. Clockwork Dragon was over in seconds.

    Then I see @Girlsname soloing the spider queen, and I wonder how much further I actually have to go to get there. Certainly, build and tactics are a key part of that, as is "getting gud." I think I might have a way to remap my mouse to make the left button work in free attack the same as it does in auto attack, and using a key on the keyboard as the attack button, that'll help a lot, as I won't have to unlearn two years of muscle memory. I also have to learn how to get my focus up, my build has been all Dex up until now, with strength a close second. I've never worried much about Int/Focus, but with the air spec, it's a lot more important.

    Still haven't decided if I want to dump all my xp out of the ranged tree. (Except for the base skill and the useful innates, of course.) It'll certainly make bumping the tactics/air skills over 100 easier, but I think I may do it the hard way for now, and see if it's a build I'm going to stick with before blowing $30 on unlearn items.
     
  17. Chatele

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    That's the problem with PVP in this game. You will never balance pvp/pve… not the way it is implemented here. You balance a skill in archery for ex. , for PVP, you screw it up for PVE and visa versa. A lot of the games I played that had pvp/pve did a much better job at it. They made it so you had 2 sets of skills. 1 for pvp and the other for pve…. so for example charged attack would work different in pvp then pve. So, if a skill was too powerful or too weak in pvp, only that skill would be adjusted. Hence, it did not affect your skills for pve… ex: aimed shot would say PVE bla bal bla, PVP blah blah blah… That's what this games needs to satisfy both the pvp people and the pve only people. Till then, it sucks to get nerfed every time someone cries foul... legit or not.. JMHO
     
  18. Cora Cuz'avich

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    Figured out my movement issues, mostly. I have to use the middle mouse button to left click stuff now, but I mapped the left button to "w" and attack to "~" so now in combat, it's 95% like using auto attack. (Still need/want to figure out how to re-map the numbers to the function keys, so I don't have to shift-press buttons to use the utility bar in combat. )

    I was able to solo the Double Daemon room, which was pretty cool. It's a loooong fight, and my fingers were a little sore after, but kinda neat to do that. I still remember when I first found it, I had to try and lure the early mobs away in small groups. This was after my first attempt to get the banner in Brittany Sewers, and since the mobs in the waves there were the same, I had assumed the final wave would be Shadowmasters. Was very surprised when two daemons spawned in. Ran like hell, and still died when they were bale to fireball me through the walls of the cave.
     
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  19. Barugon

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    That would be really nice.
     
  20. Cora Cuz'avich

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    What would be really nice was if the game didn't prevent you from using mouse movement in order to use Free Attack. I don't know why they couldn't have just made a keyboard key the attack button in the first place instead of making it the left mouse button with movement disabled.
     
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