Open PvP feedback (R12)

I find these extra dishonorable behaviors, and for that reason they should give extra criminal points to aggressors.

Attacking and killing someone flagged as [AFK].
Attacking and killing someone engaged in conversation with NPC.
Attacking and killing someone out of combat mode. ( as you know entering combat mode has a starting combat cool down, so aggressor has an initial advantage).

 

Portalarium must work on the pvp system now.

 

Really? it's weird but I thought that was the main focus for the last few releases....I personally think they need to start working on other facets of the game. They need a rudimentary karma system in however like the one I described.

 

Well, currently I can heal only parrty members and not other PvPers:/ Basically the game assumes any PvP player is my enemy (even my friends and guildmates!) and does not allow me to help people.

POTENTIAL enemy. Big difference.


I know who my friends are and I know who my enemies are, but it would be way easier if the game allowed me to mark/track friends and foes and assumed neutral status on people I did not encountered before (unless they are in same guild/faction or known criminals).

PvP is in an infant state. Since you never were a PvPer this might seem odd where we are at now, but for the rest of us who PvP we have an idea of where this will evolve to. There is already a color beginning to be implemented to let us know who are party members and guild members, it is only logical to expect that it will one day include faction members and opposing faction members, and hopefully let us know who are repeat murderers.


Well, I want you to have option to attack me, I just think that mindless killing in protected areas (e.g. cities) is silly and unrealistic without consequences. Cities should be safe to a degree and unless you have a very good reason to kill me, you should not do it.

You do not need to flag for PvP. That is optional. If you want to only fight in zones then that option is there for you. Flagging for PvP is really only something that people who really want to take the risk of being attacked anywhere. It isn't about killing anywhere it is about having the RISK to be attacked anywhere. That might not make sense to somebody who doesn't like PvP or only likes to have duals. The PvP flag is not a dualing system it is to increase the element of danger and I want to have the risk of being attacked at anytime. If they remove that from the game it is a HUGE loss.

Also I think that attacking players just because they are OpenPvP is silly.

PvP is in an infant state. There are no consequences yet, and there is nothing to fight for yet either. The system will evolve. However it isn't silly for some people to just attack somebody because they are an easy target. There is a style of player called a PK. This is a murderer who's focus is to attain wealth and also FAME by becoming a true villan. They don't mind that people hate them. They are playing that type of character.

As silly as this sounds to you, eventhough I myself do not like PKs I wouldn't want PvP without them. Hunting a murderer is fun (Usually because PKs usually don't allow themselves to be captured easily). Also because these guys play the role of such a dispicable jerk it feels good to see them get what they deserve and maybe a little trash talking as you walk all over his broken corpse. (all in good fun that is).


I can understand killing for loot, or for revenge, or for many other reasons that make perfect sense in the game. That being said we need more reasons to PvP in game (fight over areas and resources). So far we can only hunt down PKs or PK and both without any consequences.

What you didn't mention here is the fact that PvP adds an element of danger, and a need for being alert at all times. So you understand loot and revenge... but you may not yet understand the fun of having the "potential" for an attack. For example I might not go out looking for fights that day, but I like to be able to prove my metal against somebody foolish enough to attack me (for any reason).

That could work and would be easier than relogging.

EDIT: The people who have a lot of experience in PvP know what is good, and the people who tended to steer clear of it in other games don't know what it takes to make good pvp. This is why PvP has so much debate, and is such a hot topic. Games have a hard time doing PvP right because of the polar opposite positions on the topic. (which is why PvPers get so passionate in these forums). Since SotA has optional PvP it would be nice if those who don't know much about PvP would just trust the PvPers on this topic.

 

I don't think this is necessary. They already did some work on PvP and now it is time they continue working on real core features of the game. PvP is a side show/endgame thing (one I enjoy).

However right now I would rather them work on crafting, some other skills, and adding new points of interest just like they are. PvP doesn't need all that stuff added right now. It is not a secret that this game is not in its final state. We clicked the box saying we know this is not the final version of the game.

PvP is only in a state of having the ability to test your skills against eachother. That's all we need!!! We need to be able to test the skills until they get balanced. Balancing out the skills is more important than getting faction and wars up and running. when those features are added great. However skill balancing is still the most important feature to PvP at this point.

 

Dueling is a perfectly civilized way of testing skills against each other.

As far as I can tell the only thing that flagging yourself PvP accomplishes is to allow sick and twisted people to get their jollies by going around killing indiscriminately. How is it a 'test of skill' when you're afk or zoning in or talking with a merchant? I have no desire to encourage the socio-pathic behavior of these sorts (even in a game). Not to mention it leaves a bad taste in one's mouth to come back to your screen and see your ghost floating there, not having had an opportunity to even strike a blow in self-defense!

[ooo how about this? we can set our avatars on auto-pilot so that if attacked while afk or shopping or zoning they will fight back automatically! LOL jkjk - not a serious request!]

So... although it may be too UO-ish, imho if you're going to incorporate open pvp into the game then you ought to also incorporate penalties for murder -- up to and including being a known malefactor that cant show his/her face in town without being instantly guard-whacked. [And no buy-offs! (see: forged pardons). Can avatar's actually be executed???? hmmm..... this is coming out of Texas after all!]

 

so let me get this straight, those who want to flag for PvP are psychopathic? This is borderline trolling. Actually it is trolling.

One thing you should keep in mind is that they are not finished delivering contet to the game. There will be more meaning to it. Also we need a criminal/murder system so that people just don't kill kill kill for no reason. If there are serious consequences for just attacking and killing a random person in cold blood then only the sickos and psychopaths will play a "PK"

Right now we are experiencing the beginning. There is nothing but the ability to attack one another freely. In the future there will likely be other colors to represent enemy factions, friendly factions, guild war stuff etc. So the ability to flag for full time PvP is to keep that risk alive everywhere. Also it means that you do not go AFK in town ever unless you want to get killed and looted (although I imagine the locals might be bothered by a murder taking place in the city too).

 

I am flagged for PVP and i don't think i am psychopathic. I spend most of my time helping people and /zone to people getting repeatedly ganked to fight the gankers. Most of the PVP flagged people don't even attack each other without asking. And i have a few regular assassins that /zone to me throughout the day to try and murder me (which i think is great fun). Zoned to my new recruits today when they got killed at the merchants and had a decent skirmish that rolled all over owlshead and was great fun.

I like all the suggestions in the OP.

 

Here I disagree with you. I think that attacking random person is still sick, even though (or because) there is no penalty for it.

 

I did NOT say that flagging yourself as open pvp is psychopathic. You are purposely twisting my words. I am merely delivering my honest opinion based on both my personal experience as well as experiences other players have related to me.

There are -- at this very moment -- many people flagged open PvP that are honest, caring... dare i say 'virtuous' individuals. I am proud to be a part of their game experience and to have them as part of mine.

However one has to admit that not ALL people flagged as open PvP are like that. If they were then we would not even be having this conversation because I would have no concerns about open PvP at all.

I am quite conscious of the fact that the game is unfinished, I have pointed this out numerous times to people myself. The name of this thread is "Open PvP feedback R12", and that's all I did, gave my feedback. If you don't like my opinions you have every right to state your own. There is no need to be insulting here.

 

Yea, IMO one of the open issues with the "consensual-PvP" model is the assumption that if you do choose to flag PvP you're okay with anything that happens to you. That there doesn't need to be any type of controls or even justice system, because you "asked for it."

 

I love being in open PVP! Doesnt make me Psychopathic, i just love the adrenalin rush, i love helping out other people, as many here can vouch for! Ive healed most people on a random, even if i dont know them, im sure they can vouch for that as well!
If playing a game the way i want to, open PVP is psychopathic, then so be it! Ive been attacked on a whim before, and you know who you are! No biggie to me! You win some and you lose some! But when you get mad because i killed you after you attacked me, un-flag from PVP and plain rage quit along with a bunch of excuses why you didn't beat me, at that point i think you have issues! Those of you also know who you are!
PVP is not for everyone, but there are those of us that love to be in PVP mode 24/7 doesn't make us any different than those of you that like to be in PVE, all the time! So try to understand that PVP is just not for all of us, and we'll understand that PVE is not for all of us either! Enjoy the game the way you like too!

 

Well you don't have to be happy with anything that happens to you but you shouldn't be amazed that some people try to kill you. OH Imagine how wonderful the world would be if we could all just flag for PvP and everybody just acted virtuously and nobody attacked anybody unless they asked for permission first. LOL yet that's what the people are arguing for in this thread and when they hear good criticism they back off and say oh um uh you're twisting my words. No I'm not very interested in their words, but the ultimate conclusion their words lead to. Ya know what I mean?

 

It is late and i have the sillies so i wont type my joke about it being because of the way your dressed.

 

Isaiah, I totally understand your concept, but just because you can does not always mean you should. Yes if you are flagged you should expect to be killed. That is true. Right now in game there are no guards and no punishment for criminals that do this. So it is a free for all if you are flagged. You stated that you are not a pk when the game launches, but you do it now, why? because there is no consequences? Do you get that rush now and not later? What has made you do it now as opposed to later? All I want from pvp and I could even tolerate open world full loot pvp if people understood that if pvp had meaning, more people would do it. More people would understand it. As it is now there is no meaning for it. What is the reason to stay flagged if every pvp flagged person is just going to attack you? Maybe I am different because I like RP PvP. I will have a PvP town, but I will have a reason for pvp. I will have a story to go with it. Just meaningless thoughtless killing of people will just drive you to a lower pvp population. Sure everyone flagged will be hard core, but there will be less of you.

 

Dry humor. Strive for dry humor and you can get your jokes across without being moderated for trolling. Works 75% of the time. Just don't post a lot and you wont get banned.

 

Not really, they just want to see consequences for mindless attacking people on sight.

 

Last time i checked, being fricken hilarious wasn't a banning offence >.> I already made a serious response in here.

 

AHH now this is the real reason I personally am posting in this thread because I think it leads to the conclusion that we need a basic murder/criminal system. There needs to be some consequences.

As it stands I like being able to attack anybody even friends. However, there needs to be some kind of system to cause people to think twice about their actions, although those who wish to become killers will still be okay with it too... but it should make them outcasts. Attacked by guards and shunned by shop keepers in respectable towns could be good things for murderers.

 

Isaiah, I posted this link on another thread, it has some interesting ideas for justice.
http://www.aschulze.net/ultima/blog/blog_20090310.htm#punishment