Dismiss Notice
This Section is READ ONLY - All Posts Are Archived

Option to remove the GM icon...

Discussion in 'Release 27 Feedback Forum' started by Xail, Mar 23, 2016.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Ancev

    Ancev Avatar

    Messages:
    1,150
    Likes Received:
    1,956
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Guy Fawkes mask in the add-on store imo!

    ...and pitchforks. No rebellion can be complete without pitchforks.
     
  2. Brightstar

    Brightstar Avatar

    Messages:
    106
    Likes Received:
    100
    Trophy Points:
    30
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    New York
    My whole thing with the showing GM stats is I don't go walking around advertising what my skills are. You should figure that out by the gear and weapons I'm wearing, otherwise, you won't know until you fight me. It makes for an interesting combat where you as a PVPer must prepare yourself to fight a variety of combat styles/skills. So, IMO, I don't think you should have your GM skills showing or see others either.
     
  3. Noric

    Noric Avatar

    Messages:
    1,328
    Likes Received:
    1,822
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Once slight twist to the whole "Don't dispay combat GMs" idea would be to show them publicly in conjunction with some emotes (like Flex).
     
    Oba Evesor and Moonshadow like this.
  4. Katrina Bekers

    Katrina Bekers Localization Team

    Messages:
    2,793
    Likes Received:
    7,826
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Location:
    Kópavogur, Iceland
    Oh wow, the PVP'er brigade in full swing.

    WHAT AN INCREDIBLE SURPRISE!

    Where is Jaacob? Swamp Thing? They didn't hear your call?

    Btw, unfortunately there is non-consensual PVP - it's called Guild Wars, where one can find himself flagged everywhere without any way to preventively avoid that.

    Se le cose nun le sai, salle.
     
  5. Skyo

    Skyo Avatar

    Messages:
    484
    Likes Received:
    662
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Gender:
    Male
    Don't two people consent to this? Both guild leaders? Or can you just declare war now?

    Depending on the answer I may be starting a guild.
     
  6. helm

    helm Avatar

    Messages:
    660
    Likes Received:
    1,282
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Well, that'd be 'Q.E.D.' I guess. Only hoping it does not apply too well to the general PvP mindset.

    Just to be clear, I personally support hiding the GM tags for RP reasons only - in PvP context it looks like the way proposed by @Katrina Bekers is indeed the only way to implement such a thing fairly.
     
    Katrina Bekers likes this.
  7. Jefe

    Jefe Avatar

    Messages:
    905
    Likes Received:
    1,007
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I think people will want to remove indicators in PvP as long as they feel powerful. I suspect eventually there will either be a rise in PvP exploit threads or a call to have for info visible when the game is "released" and whatever resulting population surge occurs. Especially if pwners are not forthcoming with build information.
     
  8. Katrina Bekers

    Katrina Bekers Localization Team

    Messages:
    2,793
    Likes Received:
    7,826
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Location:
    Kópavogur, Iceland
    And the rest of the guildmates?
     
    helm likes this.
  9. helm

    helm Avatar

    Messages:
    660
    Likes Received:
    1,282
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Yes, no doubt there will be such requests, especially considering that logic does not appear to be among the strongest suits in the general PvP population, especially the PK subculture: even in this thread it has been implied (rather convincingly, many times over) that GM tags would not address the issue, because they are really not that useful or informative. You're right that many people will not even consider such things before making their demands.

    The sad truth is, childish folks will remain childish and accuse others of cheating, regardless of how much or little information is provided via the player interface. Which in any case is only a small fraction of the information available to the devs, game masters and forensic tools.

    The question remains, what kind of information best supports an enjoyable, immersive and interesting player experience, and how it is explained that avatars actually have access to the information they have about other avatars? This is not, after all, Football Manager 2016. Yet :p
     
  10. helm

    helm Avatar

    Messages:
    660
    Likes Received:
    1,282
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I fear you're fighting a losing battle, against the impenetrable PK mindset. The standard pk answer to this is: "well, who is forcing you to join any guilds then? you can play in single player online or offline..." and so on. :rolleyes:

    It is simply an extension to the general pk canon, which goes something like this: "If you're not prepared to succumb to the random acts of folks killing others without justification, reason, or purpose, without any meaningful sanctions, then please go play inside that box over there. Enjoy."
    A rather similar logic is used in real life as well, for example to make women avoid/fear being alone in certain public spaces, especially in "improper" clothing. "Just don't go there. Stay at home. Problem solved. Oh by the way, your male boss called, wanting to talk about something with his secretary."
     
  11. Skyo

    Skyo Avatar

    Messages:
    484
    Likes Received:
    662
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Gender:
    Male
    Oh wait so it is 100% consensual. I thought I was going to start a guild for a moment.
     
  12. Katrina Bekers

    Katrina Bekers Localization Team

    Messages:
    2,793
    Likes Received:
    7,826
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Location:
    Kópavogur, Iceland
    Yep, I'm fighting a losing battle, @helm
     
  13. Cinder Sear

    Cinder Sear Avatar

    Messages:
    2,576
    Likes Received:
    3,836
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Location:
    Spite
    Lte's just have a toggle. Simple. If it leads to total game destruction, I'd be surprised. If it leads to some leaving, I'm sure others will come anyway. It's just the visual toggle. Not a big deal, pk or not.
     
    agra likes this.
  14. Cinder Sear

    Cinder Sear Avatar

    Messages:
    2,576
    Likes Received:
    3,836
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Location:
    Spite
    I'm not a pk, but am running around with 99's to hide my 'gm'.. is that a problem (I also participate in consensual pvp, the only pvp available as far as I'm concerned)? I'm confused at the animosity displayed at this idea... over a few pk's? Did you get ganked really bad or something? Did it hurt? Again, not a pk, but trying to understand how horrible a toggle would make the game?
     
    helm and Moonshadow like this.
  15. Jefe

    Jefe Avatar

    Messages:
    905
    Likes Received:
    1,007
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I think the best analogy is youtube commentors. There are good and bad.
     
  16. Jefe

    Jefe Avatar

    Messages:
    905
    Likes Received:
    1,007
    Trophy Points:
    93
  17. Duke William of Serenite

    Duke William of Serenite Avatar

    Messages:
    1,993
    Likes Received:
    4,429
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Location:
    Grunvald
    I think we have enought stuff above our heads but if its just a buff icon that is totally kewl.
     
  18. helm

    helm Avatar

    Messages:
    660
    Likes Received:
    1,282
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I reread the entire thread just trying to understand what you mean by animosity...actually there appears to be a pretty good consensus that having something (among those things, a toggle) that would enable one to hide the GM tags would not be a bad thing at all. Some don't care, some think it's a great idea, but I don't see any strong statements that it'd be a horrible or even a bad idea. It's mostly "yes, i support this!" against "nah, who cares?"

    The "pk angle" of this is just, I think, a sort of reminder of the premise that one should never base design decisions solely on the needs of PKs (see definition inside spoiler, just to be sure), not in a game like this. This does not rule out other good justifications, which indeed appear to exist. So the "pk factor" (which to my mind is always diminishing/negative/discouraging by nature) is not a big deal in this particular case.
    I use the term PK (Player Killer) in a derogatory sense; referring to a player who kills other players randomly, without any real justification, reason, or purpose.

    So my term does NOT refer to "Player Killers" who have some kind of acceptable RP based justification for their actions -- "acceptable" meaning that one can't just take a sentence like "I'm a crazy MF that killz all that movez!" and claim that it's "my RP based justification" - it needs to have at least some kind of depth to it.

    The problem with PKs is not anything like "ganking" as such, it's appallingly dimwitted behavior combined with pathological arrogance. I play the game to relax and enjoy, and suffering fools is not part of that. For example, I can kind of ignore stuff that goes on in cities, like constant running around like headless chicken, or gustballing in the streets, but how do you ignore a random, no-reason, unprovoked attack? You can't. You are forced to take part, whether or not you think it's dimwitted or not.


    And there are no mechanisms in place to prevent it -- there could be, but Portalarium has elected not to implement any of them (this has been covered in more threads than I care to remember). OK "friends only" mode comes pretty close, though it has it's weaknesses, and it's kind of pathetic "solution" to this particular issue.


    And please don't get me started about "just a few PKs" -- it might be true at the moment, but there's no way of knowing how many PKs there will be when the game goes live. The lack of preventive mechanisms does not feel at all encouraging to me, but we'll see.
     
  19. Beaumaris

    Beaumaris Avatar

    Messages:
    4,289
    Likes Received:
    7,415
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Caladruin
    The ability to select one GM title to display under character name would be a better feature, IMHO.

    This would allow those who want to show a GM title to show one of their choosing vs. it being an all or none affair.
     
    Katrina Bekers and Fister Magee like this.
  20. Jefe

    Jefe Avatar

    Messages:
    905
    Likes Received:
    1,007
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Just have to be careful with number of titles, otherwise you might end up needing a sign like this plastic surgeon.

     
    Katrina Bekers, Mata and Moonshadow like this.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.