Overland map comments

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Modu, Sep 5, 2016.

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  1. Modu

    Modu Avatar

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    Inc wall of text. Stay with me, I'd love to hear others comments.

    I'm not a huge fan of the overland map. I hear talk that you want regions, but when you can go from one corner of the world to another in less than 10 minutes, the overland map is pretty much killing that. Also, why are there no boats from the west coast to east coast? Are you trying to tell us this world really is flat?

    I know that random encounters are just getting added, but I think you are going to have a harder time keeping those random encounters interesting. I remember that Anarchy Online had randomly designed dungeons (missions) but after awhile, they all looked and felt the same. It seems pretty complicated to make things 1) truly random and 2) match the area you are currently travelling through.

    If you want a truly immersive, regional world - make us run across one zone to another.

    I shouldn't be able to run past forest after forest past city after city that you took a lot of time designing.

    Make us run through and enjoy the sites, and make us think twice if we want to spend an hour or two to get even 1/4 of the way across the world.

    There's a couple other problems that manifest in the zones:

    First is the zone in markers:

    [​IMG]

    With every zone having these, it just feels so generic. We don't need skulls to judge a zone difficulty, the monster con system is good enough. Not trying to be a jerk, but, I want to log out when I see these torches and generic gates at each zone in.

    Because zones can't interconnect naturally (due to the overland map), we get double the zoning times which everyone will tell you is the worst part of any MMO - everybody hates zoning. Secondly, you have to do something like this where you have these artificially, immersion breaking zone entrances and exits.

    Which also leads to:

    [​IMG]

    I can't take a good picture, but I'm sure you've all seen them. These walls look like they are out of a game from the 1990s. Just a flat texture of trees. My hope is that these are just place holders. Is there some issue with making a forest that just takes you to the over land map similar to other zones like the random encounters? These are just terrible and really make the game look cheap and old.

    I'm not trying to be negative, just bringing light to some things that really bug me while I'm playing, in hopes there can be some solutions. I wouldn't take the time to write up things like this if I didn't care.

    When you have a world where you are trying to make things feel like a living world (NPCs who go to sleep, for example), things like the overland map, bad zone walls and generic zone gates feel pretty counter productive to that goal.
     
  2. Kara Brae

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    I agree that the walls of trees on the edges of scenes look and feel fake. On the other hand, I like being prevented from leaving the scene unintentionally when fleeing mobs.

    I agree with the comments about the generic zone gates. On the other hand, when I am desperate to flee a scene :eek: I am grateful to spot a familiar-looking (and thus recognizable) exit.

    On the whole I have come to really like the overworld map. I'm glad I can run past towns and points of interest to get to where I am heading. Thinking back to when I used to play Skyrim, where the whole map was interconnected, I always took advantage of insta-travel to return to places I had been. I had the choice to walk everywhere (or even travel on horseback!) but didn't because it was too tedious. That's only my own personal preference of course. I guess no matter what the devs do, they can't please everyone. :(
     
  3. Modu

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    I guess one way to sum it up is why try to make a realistic world where NPCs go to sleep if you do things like the overland map. If you are going to make things so accessible, why bother with NPC sleep schedules that jut end up being annoying in an unrealistic world? In for penny, in for a pound.
     
  4. Headquake

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    I kinda like overmap , first i was suprise when i saw it , and first i dislike it. But now i like it , yeah that could be more ''imersive'' . But **** the goal is to have fun , not dodge 74 archer and 36 wolf , bear when going from ardoris to soltown. Imo it would be really annoying to just go through a infinite number of zone time after time after time. Yeah maybe its less imersive but its more fun like that. Anyway i bet you realize this is not a game for hardcore gamer. I don't think many people would really enjoy going through 15-20 ( with all the loading coming with them ) zone to go through a dungeon with their friend. In a real open world with horse and no loading , its cool to travel but in sota going from zone to zone just gonna turn in a borring dodging monster run + Loading Map festival
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2016
  5. Gideon Thrax

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    I dunno - I'm starting to really like the overland map. It offers a transition between scenes that is nice reprieve from the loading screens and catching a glimpse of other players in the game is always fun. My understanding is that over time the overland map will mature and show some really great and dynamic animations for folks moving across the map as well as a measure of activity and events in towns.

    I can appreciate your frustration @Modu - but for what the overland map is, I like it, and it's supposed to get a lot better.

    The regional world will hopefully become something more as the economy takes shape.
     
  6. Phiedrus Oliva

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    I love that there are so many Towns and other locations in SotA.
    But it would be a nightmare to cross them all in 1:1 scale. The overworld, however, is the way to meaningfully travel between locations in a way I don't want to commit suicide as if I only had to go from Britt Alleys to Wharfs crossing Central. Let alone going to Ardoris.

    I'm happy with how the overworld is implemented, big enough to get lost in it, convenient enough to get you anywhere in a reasonable time.

    Regarding skulls and scene gates, I respect your opinion, just a matter of taste. Personally I got used to them and so like them the way they are. Not saying that randomizing them wouldn't be a bad thing at all, but these are not the annoying things I'd give priority to be changed, if at all.
     
  7. Roycestein Kaelstrom

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    People already complain about having a hard walking around town zones. I doubt making over world a full blown gigantic zones will do much good. There are games like Two Worlds which have open vibrant world. It seems immersive at first. After awhile, it becomes tedious.

    With full blown open world, what's gonna end up happening is that people would just use fast travel, which would beat the point of having big world in the first place. Spending an hour or two to travel around the world eventually become boring and time consuming.

    The best thing would could get out of this might be the more seamless or faster transition between the scenes.
     
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  8. Brother Oak

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    I don't have anything against the overland map, but agree that 10 minutes to get from one side of the world to the other is far too quick. Need longer travel times to encourage local economies!
     
  9. Headquake

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    I don't understand why people can't stop coming back to this ''local economy'' thing in sota. Anyone can just craft what they want by themself anyway !! Local ecconomy for whats ? Pledge reward ?? There will never be any kind of local economie in sota , i thing most of the people are going to ''troc'' with their guild anyway.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2016
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  10. Fredrick FlameGrinder

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    Things to keep in mind about current travel being quick, Episode 1 will be 10% of the total land mass by the end of episode 5. So 10 minutes will become 50 minutes to travel the entire world.
     
  11. Last Trinsic Defender

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    That's not the case. You have to move at least through 2 checkpoints and this will take some time if it's a longer way. 10 mins. is an exaggeration. Adding the random encounter which should appear all over the world it will take you between 30 and 60 minutes. That's fairly enough in the light of recall- and teleport-scrolls.
     
  12. Toff

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    What I would like to see maybe regional resources, like Cotton only grows in the south, or different types of trees in different regions. And once they implement some sort of mule/horse/wagon type of travel for large carrying capacity this would establish trade routes.
     
  13. Turk Key

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    In the spirit of beating my dead horse.... The overland is NOT a map. It does not give you an overview of where you are in the world, it does not give you directional clues, it does not help you if you are lost. It is simply another scene with a different perspective that allows you to bypass instances or choose which ones to enter. The description for it should be "Overland", not "Overland Map".
     
  14. Nadomir

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    Lets see it from a differenz way and see how it's done in other games. There you run and run and run (or ride and ride and ride) and what do players want the most? Shortcuts! Be it griffons or railways or zepelins or what ever gets you from one point to the other quickly. That's something most MMOs seem to have in comon. That's nice, that's ok...
    The overland map (what's so wrong about calling it a map?) is something I havn't seen that way in other games yet. It serves it purpous to get us from one end of the world to another without instant teleportation, but still fast enough and not so boring, that everyone would complain. It looks great! (To me that is) You see other players traveling there, too... Fact is: Most players DON'T want to spend hours and hours to get from one point to another in the world. That's lost time. You want to meet your friends at the other side of the world to play together? "Sure, pal... I'll be there in ... er... ok, let's see, we have tuesday... so lets meet you there late friday, ok?" No, you want to meet your friend tonight and spend some time with him or her. Sure you could implment shortcuts like all the other games did... and get what? Correct: Somethin all the other games got, too... So the overland map is something special and we should really keep it.
     
  15. nimueCW

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    I think its also important to remember that there are more landmasses planned for the future. While a 10 min walk feels short now, we will be thankful for it when we are crossing multiple continents. Although it hurts in the short term, i like that Port thinks long term for the game.
     
  16. Pikegirl

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    I do agree that a seamless world could be more immersive and gives a greater sense of scale, but this overland map has its own beauty as well.

    It reminds me of a beautiful living game board of a board game, and I personally take time to marvel at the landmarks on the map from time to time.

    This condensed version also allows us to quickly see mass player movement at a glance, and provides more player interaction as one has a better chance to meet another in this overland form.
     
  17. Phiedrus Oliva

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    Interesting point.
    I am into space games, and the mechanic is not that far from the Overland in SotA: in space games you have warp that allow you to travel around the local system (within the same City in SotA), kind of the boatman in Ardoris. I'd really welcome this 'warp drive' (err... boatman) in other cities.
    Then you have a more powerful device (stargates or built-in) that allow you to jump to other stars (cities). You can usually jump star by star the same way you have to choose a route in the Overland map, so it can take you some time to get to a distant star, same as it will take you longer to travel the Overland map to get to a distant city.

    This mechanic is needed for gameplay reasons, and I find the SotA approach quite convenient and elegantly implemented.
     
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  18. Phiedrus Oliva

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    I agree. Not because being a 'map' is a bad thing, but because the Overland, to me, is not 'just' a map, is an added value to the game.
    Yes, I do think so.
     
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  19. Brother Oak

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    Hopefully that's just a design flaw that the devs will work through. There really needs to be local economies for a lot of the other systems to make sense (player vendors, player towns, etc.)
     
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  20. Gix

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    This is one limitation that'll constantly bite SotA's rear. They went with it and now they're going to suffer the consequences (good and/or bad); asking them to change it now is futile.

    While I'd prefer a seamless world, I also view the possibilities that an overworld can offer... so I'm not against the idea that Portalrium has. The problem here is that I don't like how they're doing it; I'd rather have a Baldur's Gate-style map (which also had random encounters) that functions completely differently than walking around manually on a different scale.

    That's why the actual term is called an Overworld... which goes as far back as 1986.
     
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