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Question for a common reported R2 problem (with poll!)

Discussion in 'Release 2 Feedback' started by Lum the Mad, Jan 24, 2014.

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Should "barks" (things NPCs say unprompted as you pass) appear in the chat log?

Poll closed Feb 7, 2014.
  1. Yes, as they do now

    26 vote(s)
    27.4%
  2. No, I like the idea of them only appearing over the head of NPCs

    50 vote(s)
    52.6%
  3. My opinion doesn't fit in the above two options and I'm posting it in more detail in this thread!

    19 vote(s)
    20.0%
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  1. Mishri

    Mishri Avatar

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    That was part of the release instructions of known issues:

    "Line of sight for non-player characters is still not incorporated for R2, so you will still occasionally see NPCs talk through walls. However, NPCs will turn to face you and animate while talking to you (or other NPCs). If you are behind an NPC, it may not notice your presence until you speak up (this is by design)"
     
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  2. smack

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    Yep, that distance slider should help. Most people don't hear conversations more than 20 feet away unless someone's talking really loudly or is yelling. Does the game even have that concept such that NPCs talk at different levels, perhaps just a normal and yell level? If so, that should be taken into account if we're filtering on distance.
     
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  3. vjek

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    I voted yes, and agree that channel direction/tabs is a good path forward. As much information in the log (with the expectation there will be a client side logging facility) as possible is always good, imho.
    The chat box in general needs a few "expected" features, but I am presuming that will come with time.
     
  4. docdoom77

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    I voted a resounding NO! I really hate this feature. There is enough for me to read and remember with blocks of important text and keywords without worrying about ambient conversation. It is confusing as I frequently mistake someone else's "barks" as part of the conversation. I want it completely out of my chat box.

    Now if there were a second chat box, that just held "barks," I would have no problem with that.
     
  5. Jambot

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    I also think barks shouldn't clutter the chat log ; it's already filling up quickly without other players talking (let alone advertising their shop ^^). If pieces of information are to be overheard in NPCs' conversations, then let them be overheard :) Plus we're certainly bound to hear each and every quote most NPCs have to say just by idling/crafting/chatting in town.

    On another note, let me suggest the replacement of the phrase "barks" with "gay banter" :D
     
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  6. Doppelganger [MGT]

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    I think the NPC barking is fine but I don't think it should be included in the chat window. That is very distracting. The chat window should be restricted to who you're actually "talking to". I say lets keep NPC barking over their heads!
     
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  7. PrimeRib

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    It's all just awkward to me. If I know someone's name, I should know it. Show it over their head or give me some mouse over dialog. Now I see people's names in chat and have no idea who said what. Ideally I'd have an in game journal which gets auto-filled with important stuff they'd said that's automatically / easily pulled up.
     
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  8. Floors

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    Given the size of the chat window and the difficulty I had trying to "scroll it" with a mouse, and not the up and down arrows, I would tend to say no.

    Just have it for the conversations you're having with individuals.
     
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  9. stile

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    Im fine with overall how they are done now, but agree with the chat tab's. A "NPC" tab that you can take a look at and review when necessary would be nice. When other people are around the ability to have a tab for players vs. NPC's as an automatic filter would be extremely useful. Especially if you have to go AFK in an emergency real life situation and when you come back need to catch up by scrolling back a bit.
     
  10. Balec Fares deCani

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    I'll also suggest the barks should have a separate, resizeable, dockable chat box and log. They can have a different retention time (and independent scrolling) to simulate the barks being transient peripheral information. Having a separate chat box would allow them to be experienced in real-time in the periphery which is the intent. It would be handy if you could target a NPC for conversation by clicking their name in the bark window (which would be display only). Being dockable the chat boxes could attach to the bottom or top of the other and be moved together. You could scroll through the barks after the conversation was over (as if you were mulling over what you heard in the background), click a NPC's name alongside a statement of interest and if the person was still in the area they would be highlighted with the dialog circle.

    The grey text for targeted conversation and white for barks is opposite what I would expect/desire. The grey is more muted and the white demands my attention more. Perhaps that was the intent, but customizeable colors per chat window would be nice. I'd prefer the targeted conversation to stand out more than the barks. Or perhaps there can be shades of brightness to the text depending on whether the person was whispering, talking directly to you or barking loudly.

    There could be separate hotkeys for showing/hiding each of the windows (bark and conversation). And it's be nice to be able to select and copy the text in the chat boxes ;)

    [​IMG]
     
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  11. Dermott

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    I wouldn't mind a contextual filter on the barks. If a bark has a useful keyword, then it should be included, if it's just an NPC saying "It's a nice day today" or "I don't know what to buy", then it doesn't serve any good in the chat log. Morton's crying for more beer is another one that could be done without.

    NPC barks that directly address your character SHOULD be in the chat log.
     
  12. Aeryk

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    Place my vote with those saying that if the NPC is speaking to the character the conversation should show in the chat log. There is however an annoying level of repetition in those conversations. If the conversation is recorded in the log the NPCs should not need to repeat themselves. There may be instances where it is appropriate to repeat -- but in a more natural manner (the player has left and come back after some period of time).

    Edit: To clarify, only conversation directed at the player character need show in the chat window. Ambient conversation (pub chat and the like) need not be. In both cases the repetition of conversation could use some tweaking.
     
  13. SmokerKGB

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    I'm handicapped, I read slowly, I really hate text in games because it never stays on screen long enough for me to read it, so I am always checking my chat log to re-read everything, then the chat log goes away before I can read it. Very frustrating.

    At first glance I would say all "barks" should be in the chat log, because if someone says "hey, I have a job for you" when I'm running by, I want to see if I need to go back and talk to them, but if they don't say their name, how do I know who to converse with?

    Second, if I am talking to someone, I don't want all the extra text mudding up the conversation, but how do I talk to just one person?

    I would like to be able to "hover" or click on a person to see their name, so that I can say "hey, Carl what are you selling?", or double click them to start a conversation with only them. Or control>click them, to start a private chat, so the chit chatter is eliminated.

    Maybe a timer, after they barked once at me, let 2 mins pass before they bark again or let me go out of range then, back in range and they can bark again, something like that.

    Many times the overhead text comes through walls/floors, I think the game needs to know the difference.

    In UO, the overhead chat was so thick at times, I couldn't tell who was saying what. I was talking to this guy once and he changed his text color to "blood red" and it looked like a blur to me, I had to say sorry, I can't read your text, and he got all mad at me.

    In WoW, the chat log would fly by so fast, that even when someone whispered to me, it was off screen before I noticed it.
     
  14. Kirthag

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    filtering the chats into multiple chat tabs would be pragmatically complicated at this stage I think, but is the best method around.

    The first time I run though a town, it would be good to "catch" what the NPCs are chatting about. On subsquent visits, or if it is my "home town", that NPC chatter can get really irritating. In any case, having a cluttered chat log is really tiresome. I've experienced a few games that allows for chat filtering into separate tabs - then all I do is pick which tab I want to "listen" to - and bounce tabs to see if something catches my eye. Certain system messages are spammed through all channels, and I can even pick if I want to ignore guild/party chatter.
     
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  15. Sunsanvil

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    With regards to NPCs, I would much rather their barks be above their heads, though the font could be sized down a fair bit and the whole thing not so wide (two short lines instead of one long one would prevent overlap).

    Not sure if this is at all relevant, but any and all player character chat should and must be in a separate tab of the chat box.
     
  16. Balec Fares deCani

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    Here is another idea for the separate bark window I proposed earlier. Instead of making the bark window like the conversation window, make the barks something that is transient and fades away never to be seen again.

    The "Bark Box" would be a little section of screen inspired by the little email ghosts that pop up sometimes on the desktop for new emails, but modified to be a rolling chat window where, over time, messages fade away, but there is room to view several messages. The Bark Box could be resized vertically to show more lines of text when you walk into a crowded city for the first time and want to get a sense for what's going on or can be scrunched down to a line or two or turned off completely. Clicking the NPC's name in the Bark Box would target the individual for conversation which would help to identify them in a crowd.

    This would be an inobtrusive way to implement the "in-your-face" nature of the barks.

    Here is a sample screenshot with the Bark box in the top right next to the menu icons.
    [​IMG]

    Also while creating the image for the Bark Box above it occurred to me that it might help the text be readable if multiple lines of text were indented past the speaker's name. Refer to the 2 examples below. The text on the top is more readable to me.
    [​IMG]
     
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  17. docdoom77

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    I strongly agree with your second point! Indentions please!
     
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  18. Taibo

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    I would like the option to have a chatbox conversation inside the overhead bubble with surrounding NPC/PC conversations floating in from the periphery with custom settings like opacity, color, text size based on location, distance and relevance (ex: someone clicks you as they approach from your side and as they speak to you the opacity of their bubbles would decrease and text would grow larger-- depending on your custom settings). Right now the chatbox and bubbles compete for your attention on screen especially at a higher resolutions. When an NPC speaks above their head and you are trying to type in a chatbox that is near the bottom of your screen it is disorienting. Of course you can move the chat window around but it eats up critical screen space when you move it closer to the center. Obviously, the chatbox is the defacto standard of multiplayer game conversations but that doesn't mean it's the best solution. It seems like an old uninspired way of communication. The chatbox does serve multiple purposes like logging all conversations, non-conversation information, system info, etc., but it should be a completely customizable window that allows its user to configure it to their needs and toggle it on and off and maybe redefined as the "info box" or "detail box". The chatbox is a hard thing to replace but with some creativity and skill it's tired old style can be overcome. I think a well designed customizable bubble system would be a welcome change for those of us that want to see SoTA be innovative and unique.
     
  19. Kilhwch

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    Have it on a chat filter setting, along with the ability to have multiple tabs.
    That way, we can relegate it to a particular tab of the chat interface or toggle it off from chat completely.
    Also, it would be nice if we could also toggle the chat bubbles on and off in another section of the UI.
     
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