Quick FAQ on the new targeting stuff.

I've played several hours with this new system now and I find my mouse hand grows more tired with this targeting scheme than tab targeting and with right-click only moving versus left+right click moving. I do not enjoy pulling in random targets and killing non-aggressive rabbits, pigs, yadda while firing at enemies. Not only does it pull in otherwise non-engaged MOBs, risking me unnecessarily, it takea more time to kill what I have under the reticle because of all the shots/spells going elsewhere.

I'm not dead-set for tab targeting but what is under the reticle should take priority. It is not fun, however to have to keep moving the camera to keep the intended target under the reticle and thus the focus of the attack. This is causing me to have to perform many micro-moves and if in mouselook mode to hold the mouse COMPLETELY STILL during battle and is wearing me out much more so than holding down left+right buttons to move did before.

I'm going to put this out there one more time - in Star Wars Galaxies this mouse move/look mesh worked perfectly. Take a bit of time to login to SWGEMU and see how cleanly it can work. They also incorporated a setting that the end user could tweak that was a box of space around the reticle that the mouse could be freely moved in before it started moving the camera. This free movement space would let the player have some forgiveness in moving their mouse while clicking buttons that did not result in moving the reticle/camera. Granted SWG used tab targeting, but in later iterations it also included primary and secondary targeting and permitted targeting using another player's target. These are key in working well as a group.

The problem I see right now, in addition to too many micro movements, is that the UI is in conflict with itself at this point. Many of us were completely comfortable with using the pointer in addition to hot-keys to fire off skills, now by default we are stuck in mouse-look mode and to say the least picking a mode is buggy and non-persistent. Mouse-look should stop as soon as a window opens (such as looting) but it doesn't regularly do that. The interface was designed for us to use the mouse for firing off skills and that doesn't work with mouse-look mode (duh).

Overall I'm still not enjoying the changes, but am curious to see how it will be by end of Release 30 before I make a final judgement.

 

It should be better if the system had a guess-to-target (front of me) which I can confirm locking it explicitly (TAB or other key) but, after that, the choosen target must remain locked even if it moves (into a reasonable arc).
Chris' video shown it (the "remain locked" feature) but my experience is telling the contrary: as soon as the target exits from the central cross I LOSE it... and it means I'm losing ALL mid/far targets as soon as they move, mainly 'cause of the current lag but, anyway, having to track them "manually" moving the mouse, following them to keep them into the cross (which is too LITTLE) is driving me mad.
The only time when I can keep them (wannabe)"locked" is when they're running toward me... wow... LOL: as I saw some posts ago, this system is very good for melee, at least as it's bad for ranged ones (mages especially).
That's my current (sad) experience.

Suggestion: try adding the ability to explicitly LOCK the target, when I "acquired" it (AKA it's in the cross), add the "toggle target lock" key-bind, even usable with mouse: I'm thinking to bind it to the 3rd mouse button but, as it's a bind, one can configure it to whatever key/button.
When I don't (explicitly) lock, the system works free as nowadays (so I'll use it for melee combat), when I "lock the target" I can use it like the traditional one.
As an addition, the locking could be lost by:

1. explicit toggle
2. target going off range
3. target going off-arc (e.g. +/- 60° from the avatar's front)
4. explicitly using a "next target" key (TAB or whatever other key)

That way even mages may use that system, IMHO.

Last (but not least) detail: even when I've the target "in front of me" ("in the cross": I can't write "locked", honestly), there is at least one spell which "seems available" (Searing Ray) but, when I try using it I miss nearly 100% of the times (while, at the same time, I can use Fire Arrow with no problem). I'm sure it's 'cause of the range: the target is in range for Fire Arrow but not in range for Searing Ray (and this is the expected behavior of the spell) but, if I've the target out of range for a spell, it should be better that spell is not "highlighted" or I can think the target is "in range" and I'll waste my time and Focus (and reagents, if it happens to a spell which uses them) using it.

P.S. (EDIT)
I forgot to write that, most of the times the mouse passes from the "normal" state (non-combat) to the "war" state... the cam is completely screwed (resetted?) pointing directly UP... that's makes the start of a fight not that confortable.
This happens even when I explicitly switch from the free-mouse (visible pointer) to the "enslaved mouse" (the new system) or when I right-click my avatar to move the cam around to change it's angle of view.
My system is a MacPro (late 2009) with ATI Radeon 4870 HD graphic card and Logitech Trackman wheel (3 buttons) trackball, drives updated today (will edit if it stopped happening).

 

I agree there are times that I start shooting a person I didn't want. However I would hate to lose the ability to be able to change targets dynamically. Honestly I think we ought to try to get more skill first with the targeting system... or perhaps they could add a toggle button to allow for auto lock, but it seems like extra work for nothing.

I wouldn't like to have them go back to highlighting enemies, but if there was some way to indicate as to wich opponent we have currently targeted I honestly think that is the most we ought to ask for (perhaps one quick highlight or adding a momentary brightness boost on the new target as we look at them to simulate a natural eye focusing on a target).

Having a lock on current target mechanism might actually break this system. Truely we ought to be aiming better. Instaead of flailing around, over time we should be able learn to make sure we have the targets we want. This system is really good at keeping targets at close range even if the target isn't perfectly on them, even at further distance it still grabs a target if not perfectly aimed. That is useful and logical for a constant movement combat system like this. However at a distance we really should be better at aiming especially if it is an arrow or an arrow spell. That seems like it will be more fun for the skilled players of archers.

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The more I use this system the more I like it personally. I'm finding that it is FAR superior to having to manually select a target either through tabbing or especially having to try to click on a target to highlight them. This new targeting system is far less stressful and more organic feeling. I hope this doesn't change at all except a few minor tweeks if needed.

Also this aids players who can stealth in the fact that the targeter must see the person first, not just be clicking tab all day to get a lock. Kudos on the awesome targeting system.

 

. As far as i can tell it does highlight what your about to hit. Your current target flashes red

 

ok I'll pay more attention. I don't know how I didn't notice that. Maybe it is one of those things about getting use to the system. If I knew what to look for I might have seen it. We learn new things every day. Thanks for the info I will look for that. I honestly cannot think of any changes this system needs then.

 

I DESPISE this new targeting system as an archer. I can't hard target ANYTHING!!! I'm shooting at a bandit standing on my toes and then all of a sudden my arrows REFUSE to target the guy on my toes and shoot a guy at the limit of my range!!! By definition, that's broken! I've tried zooming in to 1st person, staying in 3rd person but angling the camera so it's looking straight down, etc...nothing changes. This is getting old!!!

 

IMO the new system is already broke!! My crosshairs are on my current target who is standing on my feet and my arrows suddenly start flying at a different target behind him and totally outside my field of view. This is horsecrap!!

 

You didn't write which "class" you are: if you mainly do melee (then your love for this new system is understandable), an archer (mmm) or a mage (can't believe).
This system is designed having in mind the eye-targeting features of modern war pilot helmets... they just forgot we don't have eye-tracking devices.

I'm absolutely sure this system is the best for melee warriors, which doesn't mind that much if some casts they can do get lost.
I can believe an archer can find it useful, so to be free to throw at whatever target he prefers without having to "select" it before.
But I can't believe a mage can find it useful at all, as a mage have his targets "in mind"... and we've no mind-target device available at the moment (this is why we used the TAB, in the past).

 

I totally believe that this is happening, but could you record it occurring and post a video of it? I am not an archer and trying to figure out what is triggering this. I am sure the devs would also appreciate such in conjunction with a bug report...

 

We're used to see the "selected target" (locked or not) as it's healthbar near to ours: I'm having very few healtbars, comparing to the previous system, and not 'cause of I'm unable to use the shiny new targeting system: I'm sure that, if I run towards my targets, I'll have much more healthbars... but, as I'm NOT a warrior (and not going to be one), I'm trying to "acquire a target" in the mage's way, from far: this, nowadays, seems nearly impossible (or, at least, really hard) with moving ones.

I can believe the dev team fell in love to the new system but, ehy, there is a HUGE amount of players (mainly mages) which is telling you that you destroyed their gaming experience (mine also): it should be better you listen to us, as we don't want to trash the new system (we're also using it for melee ops) but we would like to play SotA, instead to be forced to go playing another game... I'm serious: I'm playing WoW, nowadays, mainly 'cause of this new system.
I left WoW months ago to roam SotA, I enjoyed it, like I enjoyed UO in the past, as a mage (even if I tried to be an archer too... many time ago), but I don't want to become a warrior 'cause of the targeting system: if I'll be it will be my choice, not yours.
My choice, at the moment, is to go playing WoW, and this 'cause of your wanna-be-wonderful-but-now-shitty new targeting system.
I work all the day and, at evening, I would like to relax enjoying games like SotA: you made me to enjoy more WoW instead.

Have fun.

 

I honestly have not had much trouble targeting a ranged target with magic or bows. It takes more footwork to make sure your target is going to be hit, but the system is more-or-less working fine for ranged targets. My only gripe here is that the target I wish to focus on should stay somehow locked so I can keep an easier eye on the health, but target-wise, if something else is in the way it will eat my fireballs or arrows. Footwork is important (and much more so, than most other games), do you think this is a game people??

 

So they just released a first revision of a new major feature and you are angry because it hasn't been smoothed over and refined yet? That seems like an obvious fix. Nevertheless I don't know all the details. I have to take what you said at face value. Your experience that you explained to me is that X happened.

Other than what you told me I don't have any other facts. I don't know if you weren't aiming correctly, I don't know if there is a game mechanic that judges that if an archer misses, the arrow flys past the guy it was intended for and has a chance to strike a far away target (which seems very realistic).

Now if missed shots are able to fly off course and potentially hit something else within range, then the system is not broken. However you might be totally right and they might need to tweek the system and work out any bugs. For example your client may be showing that you aimed correctly, but somehow the server side had a little bit different information due to some sort of lag spike. This might need to be looked into as well. Lots of stuff could be happening here.

However I haven't had that experience. One or two times it has shot a person a bit further away when I wanted to shoot somebody closer. However that doesn't mean that is what the system was designed to do. If it was designed to shoot people randomly then yeah the design is broken. However the design of this system is rather logical, and after some performance tweeks we might not have to deal with that long shot thing.

That said as an archer you really should be aiming your shots in the first place. If you run around and just wish that your character does ALL the work then I don't mind if a better skilled player ends up being a better archer than you because they actually make sure they shoot with precision. So when they fix the targeting issue (if it needs it), then I would hope that archers have to learn how to aim, especially for targets at a distance.

 

Yeah I totally agree. I would like to see the health of the last person I target stay there until I target the next person or something like that. Don't humanoids start to hobble or move differently when they are injured? Maybe they could use that and some blood animation instead of having to show the health bar all the time. If the guy to the left is a hobbling bloodied mess then we know he's probably near death. It is difficult to fake blood.

EDIT: I'd be satisfied with just seeing the health bar, until a much later update where the hobbling and blood stuff can be added across the board. For some reason it seems like it would be a whole lot easier to show a health bar then to add more injury animations to every thing that walketh upon the planet.

 

As an Archer, if you have "Auto attack" enabled, then there is a good chance you will randomly hit targets other than your intended one that are in the area. As you are moving about auto firing at your target, it's very easy to unintentionally target another enemy....at least that has been my experience. That being said, I only use charged attacks with the bow to minimize attacking everything in range.

 

I'm curious, do you have "Auto attack" enabled in the game options? I tried to duplicate what was happening to you, and was able to do that with auto attack on. I stood on the sheep in Owls head and targeted the one at my feet. I double clicked on my target, and was able to kill every other target in range, (sheep, rabbits, etc.) before I killed my intended target. All of that carnage by double clicking on one target with a bow.

 

@Chris, I don't know if anyone has brought this up yet but because of the targeting changes, it would be very easy to inadvertently shoot someone that is flagged PvP, thereby flagging you PvP. This opens the door for all kinds of grief.

I haven't been playing multiplayer since sometime around R26 or R27 because of this.

 

ARGH!!! indeed!!! this is terribly dangerous if one (like me) prefers to stay PvE (as every PvPer can kill me in very few )... thanks to have pointed out that, Lord Barugon, I never thought at it.
It's even dangerous to pull more targets than the intended ones (and I fear what can happen, pulling too much, in a dungeon)... but that's much worse.

 

I wasnt aware you could still freely attack pvp people. This wasnt possible in r27

 

you can; i've used it to insta-flag so we all can rez within party. it's harder with the new targeting, though: the only thing i've gotten to work consistently is root (which is nice, as i don't actually wanna hurt my friends).

 

I think you can heal pvp people in a party to flag pvp but i didnt know u could target non-partied pvp folks. If thats true that might be an issue