Random Discussion About Chris' Daily Blog

Discussion in 'Developer Depot' started by Chris, Apr 5, 2017.

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  1. Kpopgurl

    Kpopgurl Avatar

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    Again please keep in mind physical resistance types are coming.

    IF you are having a resistance system, it is SUPPOSED to happen that some schools aren't useful. There are options for every school to level. I don't see why that is a problem. I agree though on bosses. Would be nice to have versions like Fire Trolls, Ice Dragons etc. to equal that out. I played Air mage and now Death/Water. I always find places to level. I haven't put much thought in it, but I think any combination of 2 without the opposing schools can find places to farm efficiently be it Rise, Fall or Monkey room.

    Mages are much stronger than physical characters. They have OP healing at the moment combined with the best dmg possible (against vulnerable target). Show me someone NOT using magic? Physical chars level those schools too ;)

    In fact they additionally level combat schools as is it in the current resistance system. *if they PVP it is a must*. So thats why we are revamping everything in the first place :D
     
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  2. Hornpipe

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    And on top of that, you get the multiplier on decay for level 40/80/100/120 skills.

    You can use almost all passives at a time : at least 3 in the tactic tree, 5 in the focus tree, 1 or 2 in the subterfuge tree, 2 in the earth tree, the 3 resistance passives, the 4 in the moon and sun tree... and the passives which go with your weapon tree when you use one.
    Also, you can still stack most debuffs and as @Spinok said, using sun blinding spell and firelies moon spell is almost mandatory because archers don't have any natural way to go through the damage avoidance of the target on their most powerful attack (I don't talk about piercing shot here). And I can tell you that, every time I tried to duel an heavy armor correct build, damage avoidance has made my experience a nightmare because I don't used the debuffs. Note that I'm wearing a whole light armor, then it is maybe invoved in the balance problem as well as the body slam knockdown and maybe it's not all about bow, I can't say easily.
    And that's only one exemple among many others. A lot of the SotA experience is still built on the "the most skills you have trained, the better will be your experience". Think about that : what would you do when you have the choice between investing 8000 times the experience you have in your level 80 archer skills and investing, let's say, 100 times this experience to get all the skills to 80 ?
    Therefore, everyone is more "powerful" for leveling everything. The mastery/proficiency system will help with that for sure, but it won't solve all the problem.
    And the problem here is that the decay system don't fight that phenomenom, as @Sara Dreygon pointed out : in fact, it is more painful for people who want to invest more in a few skills because your experience is better used when spreaded with the multiplier on decay. It's just a matter of logic, in my point of view.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2018
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  3. Lars vonDrachental

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    I would like to share some ideas regarding mastery skills and I hope no one else suggested these ideas in this 250 pages thread. ;)

    First idea: I would suggest a change of declaration. I think it would be more reasonable if you would be the master of one skill but the grandmaster of the skilltree.

    Second Idea: The current GM grants a buff for companions to level a skill faster…and I would suggest that someone who is master of a skill tree could emit a buff that is e.g. slightly raising the attunement of that school (and maybe even with the debuff in the opposing school) or is slightly raising the skill level of the skills in this school for everyone in his group (e.g. at max +5 skill level for everyone else who is using death magic if there is a master of death magic in the group).

    Third idea: I would suggest that there is a visible indicator of your mastery. E.g. master of taming an a small pet will always sit on your shoulder or coincidental an additional non-combat pet is following you, master of swords and the movements of your sword will left behind “shadows” of the last 3 positions of your sword, master of fire magic and your eyes will be swathed in flames that glows in the dark,…

    Forth idea: I suggested it in a telethon some while ago to implement combos of group play and maybe the masters of a skill tree could be used for such an idea. E.g. if a master of water magic is casting spell that is soaking the enemy and a master of air magic is casting lightning within the next 2 seconds he is doing additional damage. If a master of heavy armor is doing a body slam and a master of bludgeon is doing a break armor within 2 seconds the damage resistance reduction of the enemy is larger than normally,…

    Fifth idea: I would suggest that masters of skill tree should get something like a reversed heat system. So to say if they are just using their profession they start to get better, faster or more efficient in using the skills of their mastery. Once you use a skill of a different school this chain is broken and you are back to normal. This chain-bonus do not have to be huge but interesting enough to think about it. E.g. for each 3 spells in the chain you get a 1% faster cast speed up to a max of 5%.
     
  4. Antrax Artek

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    Yea but what's the goal of limiting opposite schools?
    What an earth/air build can do that a ice/air build can't? I think also none ever seen ubers sun/moon mages around.
    This is not limiting the magic in general but several schools combinations and types of character without a real reason.
     
  5. Kpopgurl

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    I agree! Like I said I would prefer mages get to pick 2 schools and lose attunement in all others. Of course the attunement in those 2 schools should be kick ass.

    That solves 2 problems: Mages OP healing and OP dmg at the same time... If they dont have a healing mastery their healing will roughly be the same as Melees... INT bonus but less attunement...

    Mages decent high damage AND all utilty from all magic schools... Their dmg in other schools gets nerfed but they keep the utilty just like Physical chars.

    That way we can have all combinations and keep it somewhat balanced.
     
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  6. Antrax Artek

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    Indeed, the Mastery system can be much better without the attunement penalty for opposite schools specializations.
     
  7. Kpopgurl

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    Yeah certainly. I don't see why it has to be opposite. Maybe @Chris has a reason. But as I said I would much more prefer those masteries be REALLY strong, therefor take away power from all other schools. Magic is in the same boat in SotA as it was in UO. Everyone uses it. But the utility use must be seperated from the combat use.

    If you want to be earth/air, this should be kickass good.. But you shouldn't also get to have as high death/life magic going with it as it is now.
    With no alternative healing, it needs to be split as well. *Still hoping for dex based bandages healing wink wink*.

    INT is very powerful and just levelling the schools gives you enough attunement to make all schools decent.
     
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  8. Andartianna

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    Let me put it another way. Someone who selects no magic specialties does not get negatives so they can then raise magic attunement higher then the mage who has specialized. Thus gaining all the benefits of the magic but no negatives. So what is the justification of why mage specialists are receive negatives and other type receive none. This is an open system so there are no limits to learning magic. So if you wanted limits then people who use physical can't use magic?
     
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  9. Andartianna

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    Right so we can do that without the negatives to opposing schools or any schools really. I'm not arguing for the negatives just why they are not evenly applied if we have them.
     
  10. Kpopgurl

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    You get higher attunement in other schools for it. That is your reward. This attunement buffs your skills even more, which combat schools don't have. I certainly do not see where this is unfair.
     
  11. Andartianna

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    You don't see that physical doesn't have a cost for all it's buffs?
     
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  12. Kpopgurl

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    Chris: Mastery gives +attunement in school, -attunement in opposing skill, plus adds a Mastery stat for that school that improves various aspects of spells in the school

    Physicals don't get this +attunement buffs for their schools.

    That's why they don't get negatives as well.
     
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  13. Andartianna

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    ok well we can just lower your specialties output by 10% then....cause the magic bonus does not equal the physical bonus....
     
  14. Andartianna

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    I've gone over why already. Magic specialties limit to one school of magic and turn down the opposite. Single magic schools can not be used on the majority of content unlike physical ones. So if you don't understand how this is unequal I can write out a giant math equation for you....
     
  15. Kpopgurl

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    The resistance system made it that you have less options, that will happen to physical chars as well.

    Then you need to argue against a resistance system >D
    Srsly EVERYONE is using magic even without extra attunement and its insanely useful.

    You can always find mobs weak towards your kind of magic for leveling or resources.
    Again it is balanced still in favor of mages, because their dmg stat is still tied to the only healing option yet as well.

    You should argue for more different mob types with different vulnerabilities. That would make sense.
     
  16. Andartianna

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    Im happy to argue for that as well but that doesn't change that they should have negatives to all the specialties if the magic ones have to have them.
     
  17. Senash Kasigal

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    You cant win this with mathematical correct arguments. Its the same as with speeding. Some do it, even if they know they cant bear the ticket. They do it because they can. Regardless of the consequences. They will blame you, because you gave them the posibility to do so. They will never admit that it was their own choice that let them to the lost of their driver licence / XP.
     
  18. FanofIolo

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    This has been my experience also. My mage build at Adv level 77 and Air Attunement 105 is still very ineffective. So many things are immune to certain kinds of magic that you have to diversify too much. A week ago I started training blades/heavy armor and already do much better against certain mobs. The other day a guild mate took me to the monkey room for the first time and my blades did more damage than all my spells combined. On the one hand it was frustrating because I had invested so much more XP into magic skills, but on the other hand I was glad to finally be able to deal out physical damage.
     
  19. Numa

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    I'm with Womby. People will be willing to pay the death decay price for something truly extraordinary - to empower an artifact, to perform an extraordinary feat of magic or to open a rare portal to a truly unique zone for the sake of their party. It has to be a sacrifice that has meaning for the player. This way it doesn't matter how much XP he or she loses - it will be completely worth it.
     
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  20. Hornpipe

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    @Chris I mostly think that decay would be better understandable for everyone if the pool was built on play time instead of real time. If the goal is to stop the "top end" players, then, you should aim at people who are spending a lot of play time on the game. Building the decay pool on real time is punishing those who only play occasionaly, from a relative point of view. Let's take the casual player who spend only one or two hours on the game. At start, this guy won't lose anything, but rapidly, it will take him one hour to take over the decay. We are talking about the players who won't go into the monkey room (this aberration where people destroy machines in chain with necromancers tricks ?!), and that won't make over their loss easily. Personaly, I think that modification alone would solve A LOT of problems about the ranting here.
    About the psychological perspective, I agree that death decay is very unpleasant, but that was the goal : make death an unpleasant thing. If I don't want to suffer, I must adapt my tactics. Of course, it discourages people who go on an adventure without preparation, but it's a good thing in my mind. I'm tired of playing games where you can do everything inconsequently.
     
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