Rats Nest

Takes some sack to go all row lots. Love it.

 

The other question is on connecting to other towns / the overland map. As per DarkStar's responses to my questions (see: https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...pot-submission-form-guidelines-and-faq.27317/), there is an implication that you can only connect to adjacent spots. However, if you have an island town (which I have on my form as a choice, you too) then it isn't entirely obvious how many connections we can have. Non-island towns connect to the overland map just once, and then internally to any other town that have a touching hex. Island towns don't have any touching hexes (well obviously water!), so I wonder if that means that island towns will only connect to the mainland just once? Or perhaps to another town and with an overland connection just outside that town too.

 

Yep, it's unclear. The arrangement that Abydos and I have is that we assume this connection choice is reasonable, and since we haven't had a lot of guidance that says otherwise I think that's the only thing we can do at the moment. If the devs say otherwise or reject this idea, we'll try to find another way to keep the towns connected, and close to one of the three Shardfalls.

 

Thank you, I look forward to reciprocal respect.

 

I think being connected to Abydos's town is reasonable. Perhaps one more connection to the mainland of Norgard is reasonable too: i.e. just outside his town. All other connections would be great if you can get them but might be asking too much (I see you have 4? listed).

 

I think islands are a bit different than the mainland. If you look at Pax Lair or Vengeance, you'll see that anyone can get to their town from any direction by land - even though they're on the coastline. Whereas an island is surrounded by an unsurpassable barrier (water), which requires a special link to reach your destination.

So if Rats Nest only had one connection, I'd have to make a choice (that I think would be unfair) to have all my traffic go through Verdantis Shardfall before it reaches Rats Nest, or have a connection back to the coastline. If that's the choice that has to be made, having an island anywhere is going to be undesirable.

The best comparison I have is Verdantis Shardfall. There are several docks there, but right now there is only one working boat back to Novia. I believe that each dock should (and will eventually) take you somewhere new.

The other important aspect of all this is that Rats Nest and The Horned Society will be pvp zones. So if the entry and exit points are singular and static then it makes it very easy to camp. If you have 4 ways in and 4 ways out, that's going to give players more options that frankly they'll need to survive.

That's my logic, and that's what I'll pitch to the devs. Hopefully they agree.

 

That's all good points. If there is only one entrance / exit then it would be easy to camp. I guess they could have one point on the mainland but then randomize the location where you appear within the city (up to, say, 4 possible spots). I'm hoping they'd give us multiple points though.

 

Great town concept. Good work.

My only reservation would be allowing a connection from town to a shardfall. It seems too convenient to run back to a bank.

 

It's no more convenient than if you were Vengeance and had a location close to Grunvald Shardfall. At least our towns will be PVP and you'll have to deal with that. I had suggested that any POT close to a Shardfall should have to be pvp, but Darkstarr recently said that would not be the case. To me, that's the bigger issue.

I had actually thought of not having a bank at all in some of the concept drafts, but eventually decided that it would just be too easy for another POT that has a bank to become a more desirable place to live. PVP players are not adverse to risk, but they're not looking for Eternal Damnation mode either. So the bank is in, and it's no coincidence that all the guard towers are in a path from Verdantis Shardfall to the bank and then out back to the mainland. I expect that to be a very dangerous path that will need love from the guards.

Side Note: A benefit that most people will overlook to living in a large pvp POT like this is that for solo players, they need a "briar patch" that they can run to if they want to survive in open pvp. Otherwise, you're always going to be out numbered. You're always going to be at a disadvantage.

For example, take the Order of Vengeance. They're a group of Anti-PK's that are very organized and good at pvp. There's absolutely no way that a solo player is going to survive against those guys unless the solo player has a "home base" that they can't get besieged at. This is not currently an option in pre-alpha and it's showing. Every PK in the game is being hunted down by larger groups and basically forced into single player mode.

We don't know exactly what will happen if you visit a Shardfall, but it's assumed based on developer comments that once you enter you'll be flagged pvp for a certain amount of time. So even if you go back to an Oracle protected (non-pvp) town, you're still going to be pvp. But the people in your town are NOT and therefore they will not be able to help defend you.

I would argue that all non-pvp towns are places where solo players can be camped by larger guilds and anti-pk groups. But a place like Rats Nest will have places to hide and run and pop out the other side back into the world. There's really no way to get stuck. Groups of people are not even likely to stand around your row lot waiting for you to come outside because they themselves will be at a disadvantage verses the indirect aggression of the city. Remember 500+ pk's are running around, plus there are guards that unless you live there will be unfriendly to any type of attacks on anyone. (I'm assuming here)

So it will be very interesting to see what happens, but if you're looking to reap the benefits of a nearby Shardfall, I think the best place to live would be a PVP POT.

 

Grats !!! we will rock !!!!

 

I like the point about having routes out of PVP towns that enable a player to not 'get stuck.' I could see camping as an issue.

On the other hand, might that be part of the fun? Nothing like a good town siege.....

 

When there's a guild that can successfully siege Rats Nest and all their connected towns, that would be quite an accomplishment and also one that was short lived in my estimation.

 

I will definitely come and take a look at the town. Where will I resurrect?

 

Awesome! I have no idea how death mechanics will work. It's not going to be a good solution to have static respawn points. I don't think the devs have figured all that out yet. Any suggestions? I think having multiple random and secure areas is certainly one way. But if I had my choice, I'd say players killed inside a POT should respawn in their homes, if they have them.

 

Love your Town Idea.

But feedback from my side. I am a extremly visual person.

Please do not regard what i will say now as a critic, but only pointing out a concern i have for your Rats Nest.

Row Houses compared to all other houses do not have 4 visual appealing sides, but only 2.

So if you will enter your town at current design unfortunatly you will be confronted as a player with easy 50% naked wall, if not even more.

Like this example. The right Side.





I marked only the half of your Town with what will be naked walls to show you. In case you are aware, then regard my feedback not important.
But in case you had not been aware about Row Houses only having 2 visual appealing outsides, then i think my feedback is important for you.





That is the reason i would recommend to always try to have row houses in a Row or an a city wall - so the goal to make it feel nice is long streets and less curves .

Or the developers design Row Houses for each circumstance - with 4 visual sides , or 3 visual sides, and turnable.

 

2 thumbs up from this crazy guy!

 

I can't wait to see how this turns out, such a bold move going all row, love it!

 

Thank you for your feedback. I actually enjoy the idea of twisted streets and back alley's. I think it will add a unique bit of character to Rats Nest. The lack of conventional beauty is kind of the point.

 

I happen to respectfully disagree with Myrcello about the rowhouses.
I think since your POT is named the Rat's Nest, going with the helter-skelter slum (although slightly more upscale) look works. It makes me think of Andre' Norton's Dipple or real world Brazilian slums. The average cast-off from an ordered society wouldn't have the means to live in a fancy abode and the chaotic freedom would have the buildings built just about anywhere. With basements going down up to 5 floors a rowhouse can give you quite a lot of room for your stuff. (Maybe there will be container gardens in basements to grow needed herbs. )

Also with just about everything in Rat's Nest being a rowhouse lot, there is room for a heck of alot of owners and it won't cost players as much to be part of this community, real estate wise. You might not be able to fill Rat's Nest up immediately, but it might do well after beta.

 

I find Rats nest great. And i agree with almost all you say. It is a wonderful idea for the community.

I was only trying to be sure he is aware of row houses having naked walls without windows, doors, decoration on 2 sides. He is fine with that and is aware.






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