Realism and PvP

Hi i'm Daniele. I'm following Sota forum since a while even if i didnt play it. And i'm waiting for the release of the game with the intent to buy it. Sorry for my english in advance.

I'm an old player who loved the original UoL .
UoL most important aspect was "Realism". Thanks to it, players could literally descent into their characters and fully enjoy what many players call it an "immersive game"; in Uol even grinding became more enjoyable compared to newer games.
The biggest exception from " Realism " was the death. To put it easy: in real life if you die... u die. In Uol you could resurrect ( ... and hopefully get back your belonging). Apart death, which was\is a mandatory choose, most of the game was realistic and, thanks to that realism, UoL still stay in the heart of many persons.

With the introduction of Felucca\Trammel, the developers showed they were more interested in following the market trend than to stick with the concept of "Realism". I understand this and i have no complain. I guess that nowdays, with Sota, developers are following the same trend. And again, i understand it and i have nothink to complain.

I arrived to my question.
As a "new" player to Sota i wish to ask to experts about how PvP is handled, specifically about loosing your belonging after death. The fear to loose your belonging was driving many players to be very caution when leaving towns. And gave you many and many stories to tell your friends even nowdays. This was an important part of realism, peculiar to Uol. I have read there are some kind of different "ways" to play Sota but i didnt got it. I would like someone to explain frankly to me about PvP in particolar, and Realism in general, in Sota.

Thanks you - Daniele

 

If you defeat another player, you are able to use what is called "price of the oracle" to claim a few random items from the person you've slain. There is a catch though, the person you've slain, may also use "the price of the oracle" to pay gold in order to keep those items when they resurrect.

So if you kill someone, you may receive a few random items from them, unless they pay the gold, then you'll not receive those items.

 

thanks for your answer Jordizzle.
This solution sounds like a compromise. One side a chance to get a "reward" for the killer, the other side the possibility to do not loose your belonging.
I'm unsure what "price of the oracle" is about, but even considering the Magic, this solution is far from Realism.
I guess, it is still more realistic than other mmorpg of nowdays. isnt it ?

 

I don't know, that's nightmare mode. When you die, you die. Game over start over. Seems like a great way to keep it interesting if you keep battles within a few levels of one another

 

@battlew, not in the sense of realism that you have described. I understand and agree with your idea of realism, which is something myself and a lot of past UO players value (and also many old 8-bit dungeon crawl player's value) and why I wanted to play SoTA as well. Today, the roguelike community continues to value this type of realism in the even older game mechanic of "permadeath", and it is one of the core defining principles of the genre. You didn't just lose your possessions, it was "game over". These games, like many early dungeon crawls, increased your anxiety as you descended levels, imbuing a visceral sense of value to your character. If you were 12 levels down, for example, and came across a monster, you knew that if you died you would lose all of that progress and have to do it all over again...). This realism made the monster that much more important, made your life and your gear that much more important. In UO, as you must know, this feeling translated fairly well into the long trek to find your corpse and finding out that all of your possessions (and possibly clothing) were stolen.

Luckily there are still many people making permadeath games and you can play games like Pixel Dungeon or Nethack on your smartphone to experience this feeling again. Some modern MMORPGs are also exploring concepts such as a character that ages and dies (Chronicles of Elyria), and worlds that are one-of-a-kind and then get destroyed (Crowfall). I don't know if they will be any good, but nevertheless it is good to know that people are still interested in the idea of impermanence to create realism. Wurm Online (quite older) has a nice feeling, as you have to run back to your corpse to get your belongings, just like UO, and your stuff decays away...

There is a new Japanese anime I watched this season called Kino's Journey, episodic morality tales, with each episode being about a different "country", which is like a different fantasy world with different rules and customs. In episode 1, "A Country Where People Can Kill Others", Kino does not know what to expect when he enters the country and prepares himself for all-out warfare, thinking that an armed populace where murder was legal would have rampant crime, but (I won't tell you the spoiler) the actual experience surprises him. It reminded me of how many PvE players can easily misjudge PvP in well-balanced worlds. The series tries to push a world mechanic to the extreme in each episode to see what a possible outcome might be.

It's just fiction, not an actual simulation, but after watching the series, showing multiple different worlds with different customs and rules, one has to question whether just choosing compromises, like you discovered with SoTA's death mechanic, is the right approach.

 

There is nothing of that "realism" in SotA or any gamemechanic from UO related to pvp or death in general.

 

Fixed that for you.

 

I'd be glad to have it more pvp related, but to be that fun it need to be much less grindy to become competetive

I repeat myself for ever, not worth to argue anymore, i will flag with level 100 maybe.
So i've not yet done a 5th of my way to get there with AL 78

 

Frankly, someone needs to organize a friendly PvP event in FO mode in a non-PvP area where we can all flag ourselves, RP whatever needs to be RPed and just have fun. Levels won't matter so much then. Not into hardcore PvP myself for the same reasons you gave.

 

Would also like something like that.
I'm planning to do some RP related Brawling / pugilism, no magic, no weapons, but armor and tactics skills like Stances, Dodges, Flurry etc...

PvP is the extra something for RP therefore it's sad to have no limits / caps and this ultra high requirements to open PvP.

RPvP is the best this game can have,
but to have characters who are this second a Firemage and the other a plate wearer using all defense skills and switched from glasscannon to full tank it's rather unintersting.

 

That's why we should organize a small friendly group who can stick to a few guidelines and rules.

 

I doubt this will work for me as i am, if i am, more a open world pvper and not that much interested in "organized" pvp.

 

@Stundorn,
this sounds contradictorily.

You don't flag for pvp because of the consequences (others are stronger and could loot you).

But to have rules in an organized pvp scenario aren't interesting?

Well, Catherine Rose organized a -story driven- pvp scenario, which was great. May be this would be something you also would like?
There was no fear, someone would loot. We had a lot of fun by fighting and to make the experience, how "strong" or "weak" we are against other weapons or mage spells.

Here is a video from Mac:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=0tq6Nm3THEE

As you know, I am not a fan of pvp, like some players do it - there are enough enemies in Novia I am not interested to loot other players.
But in this way - with rules and honor to have something like a sparring-match or to see, how the different play/skill types work, it's interesting.

If you like this more: ask Envy or Valo and a christmas tale about the gift of pvp
It's also interesting to receive information of other play styles ...

 

Am hoping/expecting decent RPvP to develop in Kahli though it will need some agreements and rules to make it viable and enjoyable for all.

@Stundorn @Elgarion

 

Correct!

I said i'll flag when level 100 or so.
Actually there is only loosing for me, not even any thrill because i'd loose any fight because the majority of flagged players is level 80+ i would rather say level 95+
The pvper normally min max and dont care about RPvP.
If i flag myself i want thrill and a fair chance what is not given atm, because
1. i'm too low
2. i'm not using fotm skills or have them unlocked already. Torpid Torment for example.

I'm not going to fight a mechwarrior with a pocketknife, i'm a wise man, a seer and Seidmenn

So flagging for me would just create a scenario where i expose myself the danger to get pk'd, but in no way were able to fight back.
That's not fun to me.
I need to be a lot stronger to have a Minimum of a chance.
I dont need to win every battle, but to know youre going to loose every battle makes it uninteresting for me.
The Gap between players and the distribution of powers are too powergamer friendly to me atm.

The organized stuff is maybe fun 1 or 2 times, but it dont fit much with my roleplay.
I created a scenario in Gladsheim where i maybe setup some Duells and Brawling for fun (Gladsheim Guards of Reservists)

I'm until not drawn into stories with pvp involved and i have also iC my arguments against partaking in Kahli for example.

There is high interest in RPvP, but actually gamemechanics and other RP related stuff let me renounce.

 

You do know that you can try out the game at no cost?

 

Sounds too structured, the bonus to SotA is the never ending skill gain and a million possible builds, this makes pvp very fun, I find players that argue for caps/planned classes are looking to play min hours and achieve top rewards, imo this doesn't fit into a MMO way of thinking, this is more for Mortal Combat or alike!

Finally a game that allows players to build there ultimate toon, the more time we invest, the better the toon gets, true mmo fun! If you feel like you are at a disadvantage because you can't play as much as the next guy, so you feel the next guy should be punished because of you, and we think this is the way to design mmo's? ROFL! Want to know the biggest problem in society today, well this way of thinking is the problem imo! We are not created equal, if I play more, I should be rewarded more, Period!

 

CRAP ^10

Have Fun - Stun

Because of this bullshit many people left and jtbs UO was sure not that succesfull especially well known for balanced pvp because of your meritocracy approach without caps and limits.

Because of this Pvp in SotA is dead and will never rise until they do significant changes.

Proof me wrong!!!

 

Especially this is the biggest bullshit i allways read in this forum.

 

I say it is dead (and never lived) because there is no penalty for ganking (no red name, etc.), and nobody (nobody sane, at least) wants to be a sheep. Until even the merest something is done about that, many people will never flag.