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Seiges vs the Noob

Discussion in 'Release 38 Feedback Forum' started by liz_the_wiz, Jan 29, 2017.

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  1. liz_the_wiz

    liz_the_wiz Avatar

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    So, I remade one of my toons, but, i ran into a concern, so, picture this its your first time in sota, you've just gotten out of your starting area, in this case, i had chosen swords, and i needed to get into Resolute - but you get there and.. theres a seige. So your noob hints say press E to enter .. but you dont, you end up somewhere with lots of mobs trying to kill you.

    So, you die, run through (maybe you wont think you can?) ..

    you get to resolute, you find Brigid, you do that, you then get sent to Harvest

    Great.

    OK, there is no "North" route to harvest, so you look around.

    You can go through sanctus spines (its northish), oh wait you cant, its a control point the gates are locked, and everythings red, and kills you
    So you try Superstition Canyon (which is southish, remembering you have no map).. same deal
    So you go further south, Vertas pass.... Which if you find the right path you can get through, on day 1 though, definite death..

    I just feel that this would put new players off. Id forgotten how to get from Resolute to Harvest, I didnt remember, I knew I found a way, but, I couldnt remember how. So, today I was that noob.

    now dont get me wrong, I dont expect a game to fly me to the moon, and give me all the uber loots, but when every zone you can get to is 5 skull and you cant go round them even really doing long runs.. And of course, you then fill with dread when you get to Valhold cos it says its 5 skulls and you died a bunch already.

    I know this line is not polished, but it seems hard that because you picked metal over wood or magic, theres almost no starting out line, both magic and bow get to be sent to soltown... Sword users are the other side of the world, and its almost like the lava game, death everywhere you look.

    I would feel for anyone starting out first time like this right now.
    Im sure I'll get shot to bits and be told Im too stupid, or too baby.. but, Im thinking of how it looks as your first time in a game, when you dont know all the websites, and dont know where else and what else to do.
     
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  2. FrostII

    FrostII Bug Hunter

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    First impressions are often lasting, as it were, and what you described will not be a good first impression.
    New players should not be met with such hardships or deaths, at least not during their initial quests.
    But then, that's just my opinion..... ;)
     
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  3. runicpaine

    runicpaine Avatar

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    This definitely is a concern that should be addressed. New players finding themselves in sieges is certainly an issue.
     
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  4. Roycestein Kaelstrom

    Roycestein Kaelstrom Avatar

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    They design the siege in such way that the outer patrol mobs are often to be easier ones and get harder as you get into the middle of the siege camp.
     
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  5. Barugon

    Barugon Avatar

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    Maybe, when you're told to go to Harvest, you could be given a token that you could give to the teleport wizard in one of the control points.
     
  6. Alexander

    Alexander Avatar

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    This is true for the forest siege. After doing the Hill siege, it wasn't as clear concerning where the 'easy' mob may be located in order to pass through more easily.

    Edit: Resolute will always get the Hills siege.
     
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  7. uhop

    uhop Avatar

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    My noob experience with mountain passes was quite similar --- mostly scary + a constant adrenaline rush:

    1) I got to Resolute. Went to bank. Looked at the pledge items --- they were way cool! Just in case, I've put most of them back after trying and looking at myself and my stats. Later it turned out that I was taking them from a generic bank pool, yet placed in the bank of Resolute. I didn't understand that at that time.

    2) As ordered I went to Highvale. Accidentally I found a teleport (or whatever that huge construction is called). Ran into it chased by scary mobs practically dead. :)

    3) Now I am in Blood River (?). Even scarier. I tried to go back, but it didn't work. Talked to somebody, found a boat, and suddenly I am in SE corner of the map. With no supplies. To retrieve them I got to go back to the Resolute's bank. And now I have two problems: I have to get back to Resolute, and I need to carry items to the bank of my choosing, which is problematic for a weak character.

    4) It turned out that in order to get from Perennial Coast to the central area (~Brittany) I have to pass through various passes, where I am instantly killed. I had no idea that I can go through those passes as a ghost without major problems, and find an ankh on the other side. Instead I tried to open CP gates, ran out of time and got resurrected where I started but with no health. BTW, some passes had "magic sherpas", yet I could not afford their prices as a noob.

    5) Found a way to Brittany area without a pass (the overmap, along Perennial Coast, the west-most area). Major success!

    6) Found that there is no way to Resolute without passing a pass. Bummer! :-(

    7) Found that the less scary pass is Nightshade Pass --- 3 skulls. Went there. Got killed instantly by the mobs camping at entrances.

    8) Tried to go through Nightshade Pass fighting --- got killed. Tried to run ignoring everything as much as I can. At some point I was able to find a place, where nobody hits me, and I can exit to the overmap --- still on the wrong side, yet at some point I went far enough, to appear on the other side. Major achievement!

    9) Now I am stuck in South Paladis. :-( I have supplies, but no way out. Spoke with practically all inhabitants. Somebody said that fauns know how to travel using underground caves, but it requires special keys, and I have to go to Kiln (outside) to investigate with local fauns. BTW, that quest went nowhere. At least fauns didn't help me.

    That was a span of several weeks, which included me visiting Soltown, Solania, Ardoris, and so on. I know it was my fault (who told me to teleport?! or to look at pledge items?!), yet I was majorly frustrated. For example, looking at new stuff at the bank seemed natural, operations "took it", and "put it back" seemed symmetrical. In any case I had no idea that Resolute is mountain-locked with passes unsuitable for a noob for a long time.

    At some point I figured out that I can travel most (all?) passes as a ghost, and carried my belongings to a different city, which I decided to use as a base. It took me a long time. Maybe it should be explained as a "folk wisdom" during the "orientation".
     
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  8. FrostII

    FrostII Bug Hunter

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    Great feedback, @uhop !
    Thanks for taking the time to write it up... ;)
     
  9. Arya Stoneheart

    Arya Stoneheart Avatar

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    They need to do something about the catapults. It's like getting hit with an RPG.
     
  10. uhop

    uhop Avatar

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    YW. Now it looks funny to me, but ultimately it is about unknowns, like geography, and how stuff works (e.g., banks, passes, sieges). Of course, there is some initial hand-holding, but one big issue is when we could/should deviate from the tutorial, and start on our own. Clearly I did it too early.

    For example, as soon as I was in the game, I was effectively sent on a quest, with various people asking me to do something urgently. Is it really urgent (e.g., time-based?) --- how do I know? Could it wait until the avatar matures somewhat?

    Some quests (like visiting Necropolis) sounded uber-scary. And involved selecting a guide (I got the wrong one initially , and couldn't get rid of him afterwards). Nevertheless Necropolis' spiders killed me every single time, until I figured out to run past scary places, which helped to get through after numerous unsuccessful attempts, and figuring out the exact way to run.

    The bank conundrum was especially pressing. Imagine that a noob knows how it works exactly. But could they make an informed decision what bank to use as an operational base? No. (Establishing multiple bases simultaneously is even more daunting task.) Or where should a house be established? It took me several weeks just to figure out where I want to be geographically. Is it really fair to tell a noob "You have new shiny cool things in the bank, but you cannot look at them, because they may end up in a bank you don't want to use."

    All those things should be explained to noobs, a simple geography orientation is a must, time-limits (if there are any) should be clearly spelled. When the tutorial part is finished, and an avatar can be on their own --- should be explicitly declared. Common "folk wisdom" should be delivered somehow (e.g., "run and avoid rather than try to fight, when things are scary", "you can run a pass as a ghost, and get resurrected on the other side", and so on).
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2017
  11. Numa

    Numa Avatar

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    Usually that's true. Last night though I tried to sneak around the perimeter through the siege scene only to find out that the liches had overrun the defenders camp (all friendlies were dead). Died then rezzed near the start of the scene. Then ANOTHER lich came up , chased me to the very start of the scene then killed both the guard there and me. After rezzing a second time I RAN out of the entrance and found myself in Ardoris somehow.

    Now crafting some necromancy warded battle gear. It was brutal - can't imagine what it'd be like for a new player.
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2017
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  12. Quenton

    Quenton Avatar

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    Sieges are basically a dungeon barricading the entrance to towns.

    Why are these in the game? They seem to detract from it a lot more than they add to it.
     
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  13. Toadster

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    If they gave a reward for freeing the town they would be cleared pretty quick by a few teams of adventurers but with no real reward people just skip them and they are an annoyance for new players.
    They should make the side route a little longer but a lot safer.
     
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  14. Damian Killingsworth

    Damian Killingsworth Avatar

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    [​IMG]
    from imanewbie.com
     
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  15. FrostII

    FrostII Bug Hunter

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    Best idea I've heard in a while.... ;)
     
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