Soft Wipe for Episode #2 ? ?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Weins201, Mar 4, 2019.

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  1. Brass Knuckles

    Brass Knuckles Avatar

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    Been brainstorming on this excuse the musings but could this work like diablo does seasons? They have it where your original character is well untouched and the new season you have to make a new toon that is separated from the original game but has sole access to the new season content once the espisode ends the seasonal char moves to the original game.this will allow them to make catered content to a new character.

    Idk thoughts it works well in Diablo?
     
  2. Nomalice

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    Don't think so. Diablo III is currently a play, then forget that character after the season is over in my experience. Also, it only takes a day to grind out the level requirements … or just minutes to be rushed. The time comes from picking up the additional chapters for the gear rewards. Nothing like spending a couple of years developing a character and then trashing it.
     
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  3. Almar

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    I would hope Episode 2 would have a better, more intuitive feel to it. Also a much better quest system. If that is the case, forcing new players to go through Episode 1 would be counter productive (and almost cruel!:D) . Especially if they had already tried it, hated it but now liked the look of the new episode. If the episodes are truly standalone, what's the problem with that?
     
  4. Sentinel2

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    The challenge is we would have 5 characters in 5 different games with 5 different crafting economies. At least that's what I gather so far.

    No?

    IMO, that's a hell of an investment in time. We have boats (which eventually will work). And they cannot visit the other lands?

    Why not?
     
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  5. Brass Knuckles

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    I’m almost prefer over a wipe soft or hard cap each episode be a complete stand alone. seams odd to me each episode have a dedicated toon to that episode but what do I know also the vendor situation would be weird under that senario. I see a lot of awkward moving parts but who know maybe they have already trouble shot all this out.

    Another idea someone had was cap each episode idk about it but might be ok. Eps 1 unrestricted eps two 120 cap eps 3 13o etc

    I guess there are lots of aviable paths they could take.
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2019
  6. FrostII

    FrostII Bug Hunter

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    I'm not saying that someone new to SotA - that comes into Ep2 when it's released - would HAVE to spend any time in Ep1, but that would allow for building chars in lots of lower tiers here and remove most of the obstacles to having higher tiers in Ep2, would it not ?
    I mean, all this talk about "soft caps" or "scaling" in Ep2 is so that the new wouldn't feel so far behind, right ?
    They have free access to Ep1 where they could build their chars just like we've been doing here, right ?
    I mean, I have 2 homes in Ep1 with zero intent on moving them to the new lands. There'll still be LOTS of people living, shopping, and char building in Ep1 after Ep2 is released.... right ?
    If it's been fun for us here in Ep1, then why on earth would it not be fun for them ?
    And if the "story" is continuous, then certainly they'd want to start at the beginning wouldn't they?
     
  7. Brass Knuckles

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    Good stuff ^^ and to me seams most logical.
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2019
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  8. kaeshiva

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    Trying to reinvent the wheel for Ep2 just doesn't make sense.

    Stop this talk of capping, scaling, and resetting. Not only is it going to earn a lot of outrages, the technical challenges of trying to create standalone character clones and pocket dimensions for gear and belongings, the backpedalling on global banking and zone teleport, etc. is going to push actual delivery of ep2 way out of timeframe if none of these issues are even decided yet.

    Ep2 will have new lands. They should be varied in difficulty and tier giving a new player the option to go where they like, including the islands, to explore, quest, and do suff.

    Add a new quest path, Path of the Whatever, that, like the existing paths, can be done in tandem or separately from the other quests without dependency (kinda how you can be working on all 3 of the love/truth/courage paths at the same time). My understanding that Ep2 would be bringing a GLOBAL quest system fix, which is likely going to involve cleaning up a lot of Ep1 content. This is essential.

    Ep2 launch, like Ep1 launch, doesn't need to be feature complete on day 1.
    Make the new lands. Let us explore them. Fix the quest system. If you want to add more stuff month by month, great. Just get the functional stuff functional.

    You then have potential to add a special Ep2 system. "Random Example" > A third advancement line called say, Explorer XP or Islander XP or something that unlocks parallel character augmentations based on objectives completed, monsters killed, etc. in the new lands. These don't all need to be combat related. There's no need to throw up arbitrary walls here or restrict travel/inventory/xp from one area to the other. If someone goes and farms an item on ep2 island, and brings it back to ep1 island to sell it, look, you've made a player economy. Someone might then be enticed to buy ep2 to go get said things themselves if they don't wanna keep buying it.

    Most people who are invested in the game are not going to want to start over.
    Most people who have invested in their characters are not gonna wanna play some neuered, gimped, downscaled version of them for months to try to get back to where they are now.

    Treat this expansion like an expansion - new places to go, new stuff to do, new things to get, and potentially new character progression that can only be advanced in that area. Alongside this, bring promised refinements to the base game ( crafting FIX, quest system FIX) - don't undo all the QOL progress you've done.
     
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  9. smack

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    I didn't get that as the primary reason based on the two times Chris spoke about this.

    The real concern is that Ep1 content is horribly broken. They want to start fresh with Ep2 and not carry any baggage over but have to deal with character / item movement between the two in some way if they don't fix Ep1 first.

    Clearly, they can try and fix Ep1 instead but every time they fix .. nerf .. change any Ep1 content, the community raises their pitchforks and torches and rants and rage quits. Chris even mentioned this and how it presents a problem for everyone because they aren't allowed to move forward.

    Fun is relative and it somewhat shows the disconnect between what the community perceives and what the devs see internally. For them to even entertain this idea just shows how broken Ep1 content is to them.

    I bet if the devs could get away with it and not piss off everyone, they'd just as soon delete the entire continent of Novia.

    Just like you can start any of the three Love, Courage, Truth quests in any order before doing the final Oracle quest, it looks like they might do the same with each Episode. Do them in any order, and then some ultimate endgame quest is unlocked. I think that might be cool and present new ways of storytelling and questing vs a strict linear episodic progression.
     
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  10. Weins201

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    Those three words are not interchangable
    Fix = something to correct an identified problem, such as arrow hitting Bunnies when there is a viable target.
    Nerf = adjusting somthign that is way out of whack i.e. arrows and poison hitting every time with thing like multi shot and rapid fire, Pitchforks poison x3 . . . .
    Changes = placing some soft cap on loot because one player seems to just farm something.


    SOO stop using them interchangeably
    Fixes - are not complained about when they fix a known issue, never have been never will be, it just appears they FIX things that are not real problems . .
    Nerfs = well too bad players are never going to like these but they are needed. sadly things like loot and rare items they come out with way to many drops then they "nerf" then to rarer (back donkies)
    Changes are needed and accepted when they make sense, like decay or 2x exp, or . . . .

    There problem is they do not really fix things and keep adding things and with every 10 added on more is "Broken" as it is now the Bug list is out of control, as well as the incomplete list.

    That is why some players say , hold on take a break stop moving forward and fix, finish all that is out there now.

    Once that is done tweak them and THEN move forward. It will be easier when the core (EP1) is working solid and stable.

    Honestly they are not allowed to move forward because they do not have a solid base.

    using the players as an excuse is just that an excuse, I bet if you really got down to it and asked the player base, THE ENTIRE BASE, not just the extremes of the bell curve or the financial backer who have given the most, or just the PvPer, I wll bet 100 to 1 that they will agree.

    Complete, correct, refine, what is out there now (EP1) then balance some other issues like PvP and THEN move on to ep 2. This is not a company that is forced to hold to some timeline it is all self imposed, the players are the backers.
     
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  11. Earl Atogrim von Draken

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    Yeah but that's just wow ^^ not the scaling system.
     
  12. Brass Knuckles

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    Pitch forks or no they need to fix eps1 what every that entails. Can’t leave the root of the game fed up reguardless of eps2

    The game has a very small player base atm NOW is the correct time. Personally I don’t see it as bad as other people are saying it is. People would be less upset with a nerf than a wipe .02

    Remember card combat, middle mouse move, decay, armor slugs, upfront commission on vendors, all big issues all forgotten.

    For @Chris do the big fix-in while you have a small player base.
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2019
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  13. FrostII

    FrostII Bug Hunter

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  14. smack

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    Oh I agree with you. I think fixing Ep1 first is the right thing to do. But clearly they are not doing that for whatever reason. Perhaps they’re afraid to, like what Chris mentioned. Perhaps Ep1 is too fragile and hard to fix, perhaps even beyond repair.

    Perhaps they should start Episode 2 from scratch with a new engine and leave Episode 1 in place for anyone that “enjoys” that game. If they say they’ve learned so many things and think they can do it right if they had the chance to start over...sure why not...provided you believe that they did learn something and aren’t just going to repeat Ep1 again.
     
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  15. Brass Knuckles

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    Interesting points, I for one don’t see any major unfixable problems in eps 1 if that’s the case they should post what the “real problems” are as they see them. If their solution is to scrap eps 1 just to start all over that’s a nail in the coffin if I’ve ever seen one.

    I for one would like to hear from portal in a state of the game post and maybe allow real conversation to what we want to do as supporters and in my case FANS of the game.

    This silence does have a ominous feel to it. if things are as you say they are then we should know, I realize that you maybe speculating with some of what you have said and I’m ok with that. You obviously don’t speak for portal maybe someone who does can share some real insights. Has eps 1 failed so badly that it needs to be scrapped ? If that’s so it’s a surprise to me.

    Are things really this bad ... un fixiable to require such a huge move? I don’t see it but I find happiness in playing the game as I’ve come to know it.


    Example
    I would have used exsisting mechanics to help the economy vrs making new ones like lich essence. For example lich skulls combined with ancient essence woulda fixed two problems with one stone vrs creating a new item to use as fuel for the totems. 25 skulls and 2 anchient essense and boom you fixed the over abundant artifact problem and used a item that already exsisting people could farm lichens for.(rough idea coulda been 20 skulls 5 anchient essense)
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2019
  16. Arturius Magnus

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    I play sharoud a lot (over 2,000 hours) and invested a lot of $, if you “soft wipe” for episode 2, THAT’s it for me! I,ve grinded, A LOT!! what do you care where Ive done it, I am NOT GOING BACK TO ZERO... if I fly trough the new ep 2 contente is becouse I DESERVE TO!!!
     
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  17. Brass Knuckles

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    Chris said highly unlikely yesterday he would do any wipe (this does not sounds like a true wipe some modified version of it anyways) to me that’s less than 30% chance Chris is the super optimist. If it were darkstarr who said that I’d say it’s less than 3% chance.

    If his idea for rested worked like how deep xp pools works now I.e u can apply 4x of the xp depending on the skill and it did not count agains attenuation who would want to exp for 8 mins or 4 and rest for 52+? I’m not sure I’d have such a huge beef against it my self. Each eps doing this would turn me off to it again though and I’d want all this xp applied to my original toon.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2019
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  18. Mishikal

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    My understanding of what Chris said (which could be incorrect) was that for every point of XP you spent on a skill from your "ep 2" pool, you would also apply an equivalent amount from your "ep 1" pool. Essentially meaning you learn all skills at GM speeds by default (even past level 100 for that skill). Guidance potions & being with someone else who was a GM would add to that. So all Ep 1 players would level up twice as fast as normal as the default, and much faster beyond that if they use guidance potions, etc.

    That idea seems interesting to me. Is it a pain to have to rebuild an avatar? Sure, but you'd get to do so a lot faster and have operating knowledge of what skills you've found to be the most important. So you come out ahead in a lot of ways. Better than having skills capped etc.
     
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  19. Brass Knuckles

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    It took me 2 1/2 years to build this one of heavy and hard play don’t take what I said as in I’m interested in redoing that ;)
     
  20. Astirian

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    Could not agree more. :)

    Perhaps Ricardo Del Garriotto is pushing for stand-alone episodes hence the silence? I say let single-player mode be a reset then. Keep online keep.. uh keepin' on?

    I think what we're seeing is another challenge with creating the world's first proper MMO/SP game here. The way I see it, I'd absolutely hate to lose my online avatar's crafting progress (unless it was an entirely new crafting system? Adventuring skills would need to stay too content-wise) but I'd fully expect to start from scratch in a single-player context such as in the latest Witcher/Assassin's Creed/What Have You.

    Having said that, I don't know how SP crafters would feel... Because time invested crafting in an MMO > Time invested crafting in a single-player game. (Caveat: dunno if they've balanced that already like difficulty/economy and spawn rules)
     
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