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Sorry to draw comparisons but SotA should look to Bards Tale IV for visuals

Discussion in 'Release 18 Feedback' started by Lord_Darkmoon, Jun 4, 2015.

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  1. Earl Atogrim von Draken

    Earl Atogrim von Draken Avatar

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    I can pretty much agree with that.
    But what i am trying to say is that i don't think we have thje ressources to be AAA in both parts of the game.
    There are 3 ways to deal with that.
    Get more ressources in.
    Deal with it.
    One part falls short.

    I am drawn between 1 and 2.
    That's the reason why i am getting alergic on topics like that.
     
  2. TantX

    TantX Avatar

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    Personally, I came for the MMO, but after months on these forums, actually would rather just play this game by myself or with some of the people I've met here after launch. I'd like to do guild war stuff and PvP, but it's all contingent on the PvP elements.

    However, from a business standpoint, Port's in a pickle; they can't give up their single player focus. Option 3 isn't an option at all without getting slammed heavily in reviews, killing off any chance for Episode 2 (and putting the MMO aspect in an early grave). Likewise they're not putting all this effort into community features to make it entirely single player, so there's that hurdle, too. "Getting more resources" isn't an option, either, 'cause of the circumstances they're currently in (a highly controversial combat system, a year behind schedule with no chance of releasing this year either, dated graphics, limited/unknown PvP mechanics, highly competitive market and genre, etc.). We've been hovering around $6.5m for a long, long while; the money just ain't comin' in anymore, and the longer the game is in development, the slower that trickle becomes.

    That really just leaves option 2, "Deal with it." A lot of people are, obviously, but there are some pretty thick rose-colored glasses here, thinking it'll all just "work out" in the end. I don't think they get it, personally, but come launch, they'll have to.
     
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  3. redfish

    redfish Avatar

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    I don't think the single-player and MMO elements should be in competition with each other; we can meet high standards for a single-player game and high-standards for an MMO and those two aspects of the game will complement each other, and the game all around will be better for it.

    Although, I think Atogrim was just talking specifically about graphics, which is naturally going to end up being more difficult to have perform dealing with the complexity of multiple players and lots. Its just something I think the devs will have to do their best on.
     
  4. TantX

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    Sure, that'd be nice - if they have the money and time to do it. There are external factors that keep games from being "the best" no matter how skilled the developers are, after all.

    I thought he was including the depth of more "realistic" combat (hit detection, real time reaction and counter-attacks, binding, etc.) as well as graphics, aka, not just cooldowns and hotbars a la standard MMO fare.
     
  5. Floors

    Floors Avatar

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    Game companies do the same thing over and over. They release some "wow" graphics video way before the game is ready, just to build hype. The finished game never lives up to that hype. See : The Witcher III
     
  6. TantX

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    ...wait, are you saying The Witcher III isn't living up to its hype?
     
  7. Floors

    Floors Avatar

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    Yeah I'm not that impressed. Don't get me wrong, it's a great game, with probably the best graphics out right now. It's just that it was hyped so far to heaven that I didn't quite get there :)

    I have very specific ideas about what a great CRPG can and should be. And nothing out right now quite gets all the elements together to make it happen. Witcher III does many, many things right, but a couple of big things wrong.
     
  8. TantX

    TantX Avatar

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    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    You're a hard man to please. I hope you didn't spend a lot of money on SotA.
     
  9. Floors

    Floors Avatar

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    I spent about 2,250 dollars on it. But that's not a big deal for me. I wanted to support my childhood hero.

    Yeah. I know everyone else thinks it is the best thing since sliced bread. There is still no computer game that can match how much fun tabletop is when you have 30+ years of experience running games and have the right tools.

    I'm coming from a place of trying to get to closer to that. Most people who play video games have probably no experience of that.

    And I mean, come on - how can you give any game a 10/10. That means no game can come along ever that is better. I know for a fact Witcher III isn't that great. The NPC's are generic and the quest marker map system is uninspired. That alone drops it to a 9 for me.

    Still, it's a fun game. I'm playing it now.
     
  10. TantX

    TantX Avatar

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    You can have a game that is perfect for what it's trying to do, though, compared to other contemporary games of its time. Obviously Super Mario would have been a 10/10 for what it was trying to do, but measured today? There are a lot better games in that genre, but it's still a great game for what it was designed for. Maybe 10/10 is higher than it deserves, I dunno'; I just beat The Witcher II last night and I'm absolutely in love with the series, was after The Witcher I.

    But "not living up to the hype" and "not quite being the most perfect game to date in its genre" are two separate beasts.
     
  11. Floors

    Floors Avatar

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    I mean, we don't have to agree. I didn't get *that* feeling from the Witcher III yet. I got it from playing Oblivion in 2006. Especially on the PC where the player community was amazing in the early days.

    That felt like a real step forward in games. And that's kind of how the Witcher III was pitched to us, so from that aspect I felt slightly let down.

    There's also the fact that there are a lot of bugs, weirdness in the Witcher III that is unfortunate. I've run into a couple issues where the game just doesn't trigger it's quest correctly or something weird happens. I think they're still patching it so hopefully that will improve.

    Still - it's solidly up there. It just not quite the next step in the evolution of fantasy computer games I was hoping for and they set it up to be, that's all. YMMV.

    I mean - let's get real we're still using "crazy taxi" quest mechanics in games. Follow the dotted yellow line !!! :) Where's the NPC with the ! over his head - I know I can ignore all the other ones because they have one word answers and don't have an !. Gross.
     
  12. Floors

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    Things the Witcher III does well :

    1.) Time of Day
    2.) Environment - birds, bugs, overall environment graphics
    3.) Sandbox
    4.) Backstory and Character design and lore is good
    5.) Items and Gathering System

    Not so well

    1.) Character customization. What if I *don't* want to play as Geralt of Rivia ? Or I want to be a female ?
    2.) No Party system.
    3.) No Moral System / Alternate Quest system. "The good way/The bad way"
    4.) Combat & Movement on horse. DAI did mounts better.
    5.) Immersiveness with NPCs.
    6.) "You've reached the worlds edge" Are you kidding me ? Already ?
     
  13. Floors

    Floors Avatar

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    As for Bard's Tale IV, I'll definitely play it. Please tho - focus on gameplay over graphics.
     
  14. Lord_Darkmoon

    Lord_Darkmoon Avatar

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    I agree with no CRPG getting close to pen & paper RPGs. But for a game to get even remotely close, it could never be an MMORPG. There are so many things MMOs do wrong imho. For example the story which never matters, never getting the feeling of accomplishing something due to permanent respawns and many other things.
    So for a CRPG to even come remotely close to a pen & paper experience yes it would need to be multiplayer but with very few players in the world so that not every single person you meet is a hero. The stories need to matter, you need to achieve something (killing the dragon should result in it staying dead forever)... MMORPGs are very far from reaching this experience, imho.
    SP RPGs at least get the story and achievement parts right, mostly...
     
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  15. TantX

    TantX Avatar

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    I'd argue you can do with a system like UO, where there aren't ways to just "turn off" the world and how people interact. I have a harder time playing single player games because of UO simply because the stories and plots and drama and wars and everything else under the sun I experienced on UO are never attainable in other games. Problem is the people who want to play in those types of storylines and deep plots tend to be sissies lol. Can't roll with the punches so they quit instead of going on a quest or adventure to gather parties, build political relations with allies and so on.

    If it was a P&P game, the DM would have them go figure out a way to overcome their adversary; as soon as you put 'em in front of a computer screen, though, in identical circumstances, they whinge and ragequit.
     
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