Standup Commentary

Discussion in 'Developer Depot' started by Kilhwch, Oct 30, 2013.

  1. Kilhwch

    Kilhwch Avatar

    Messages:
    595
    Likes Received:
    729
    Trophy Points:
    75
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    I've been meaning to do this for awhile.


    Wednesday
    October 30th, 2013

    Bill Kirkman: Dragon cave, quests, and replacement tool
    Hopefully we'll see a new Unity kit!

    Bob Cooksey: Baron city home, ctd.
    Looking forward to some pics.

    Brandon Cotton: Inventory, onboarding Finn, crafting
    Does anyone else think B should get a parrot so it should be named "Mr. Cotton's Parrot" ? No?

    Bren Wilson: Polearm animations ctd., placeholder skills for testing
    'Summon Taco' would make a good placeholder skill. I would use it daily.

    Chris Spears: Video montage finalizing, project planning
    Montage? (ctd below under Starr)

    Dallas Snell: General business, UPGRADING OUR INTERNET! (w00t!)
    Cool. maybe now we can see Daniele in crisp 720p!

    Erik Touve: Obstacle avoidance ctd., group collision
    So, obstacle avoidance... like JUMPING? Colliding with objects which are grouped? (rug, table, cups, etc.)

    Finn Staber: Welcome & Setup ctd., destructables interactivity
    Is that an intro tutorial kinda thing?

    Isaac Oster: Chain boots ctd., glove, and ranged leather
    What exactly is 'ranged leather' ? Ranger leather? Leather that can be thrown?

    Jason Yenawine: Server work
    Item databases? Pipelines?

    Joseph Toschlog: Spoony, customer DB, social media
    Someone has to manage Spoony.

    Justin Gilbert: Shield, polearms, and bug squashing
    Polearms are so dope. And almost never in games. Like flex weapons. Really looking forward to these.

    Ken Pfile: Inventory and Finn onboarding
    So, I think the big takeaway here was a miss on the opportunity to write 'Inpfintory' and 'Pfinn.'

    Kevin Wells: Female augmented plate armor ctd.
    <insert obvs joke> <remove obvs joke> What's augmented? Spikes? Say, Legion of Doom-style shoulderpads?

    Michael Hutchison: Owl's Head camera rigging and sky
    Is this a specific camera used in town? Or an intro video upon first entering the town? Like a cut scene?

    Richard Garriott: Voice & Story & Spoony ctd.
    Tis my worst fear.

    Rick Holtrop: Leaving his delicious ribs out where people can mistake them for community food
    Oh, wow man. Like, really?

    Scott Jennings: Conversation keywords, story, and quests. (also enacting a royal vendetta against vegetables)
    I'm a bit bummed that the words will be highlighted. Lum came in chat yesterday and said he was bummed people playing the game missed like 90% of the keywords. I may or may not turn this feature off. Remains to be seen.

    Scott Jones: Secret doors and prefabs
    Cool. Again, more possible assets makes me happeh.

    Starr Long: IT, video direction, and merch store stuff (also giving excellent dental advice)
    "Always floss before bed." Heck, even in the middle of the day. Especially after pilfering ribs, IMO.
    Wondering what video direction and montages they're cooking up. Are we going to see a new in-game demo?

    Stephen Daniele: Map edits and icons
    Yes! Let's see some new maps!
     
  2. vjek

    vjek Avatar

    Messages:
    1,162
    Likes Received:
    1,639
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    ̣New Britannia
    I just want to say, based on all the updates so far, that Jason Yenawine is my hero.
    Every one of his updates is something I want to know more about. You da man, Jason! :)
     
    Time Lord likes this.
  3. Freeman

    Freeman Avatar

    Messages:
    885
    Likes Received:
    1,537
    Trophy Points:
    105
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Superior, WI.

    Of course they missed the keywords, they've been hand held so long, they aren't really looking for them.

    Leave the highlighting off, and they'll figure it out... or turn it on only for a tutorial conversation, then explain to them they won't be on the rest of the game.
     
    Theonetheonly, Time Lord and Kambrius like this.
  4. Ao Soliwilos

    Ao Soliwilos Avatar

    Messages:
    678
    Likes Received:
    982
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Europe
    I do not want to have the conversational keywords highlighted, that would reduce my enjoyment a lot. If anyone, myself included misses something, then we just need to improve ourselves. Give the players the chance to get better rather than pamper them with easy ways out. At least, that is how I feel about it.

    Just provide an example of how it works, and people will figure it out. :)
     
    Time Lord, TEK and Freeman like this.
  5. vjek

    vjek Avatar

    Messages:
    1,162
    Likes Received:
    1,639
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    ̣New Britannia
    The highlighting is optional. You can turn it off or on, as you wish.
     
  6. Freeman

    Freeman Avatar

    Messages:
    885
    Likes Received:
    1,537
    Trophy Points:
    105
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Superior, WI.

    As may be, but it puts a different vibe to the whole game. Less old school, more guide the player through it. If there's no quest markers on the map, why will there be quest markers in the conversation?

    Part of my support for this game is to show people that such crutches aren't needed to make an enjoyable, dare I say, even fun game. Something like this takes us a step back from that end.
     
    Time Lord and Phredicon like this.
  7. LoneStranger

    LoneStranger Avatar

    Messages:
    3,046
    Likes Received:
    4,776
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Petaluma, CA
    I'd be fine with certain keywords highlighted for certain NPCs. Shopkeepers, perhaps. Those who are distributing game or story information, however, shouldn't always been forthcoming what is important and what is not until prompted.
     
    Time Lord likes this.
  8. Poor game design

    Poor game design Avatar

    Messages:
    18,208
    Likes Received:
    35,522
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Gender:
    Male

    I'm really hoping that the devs (at some point) explain in full why different kinds of weapons are important. I know how they work in real life (conceptually) but in EVERY game I've ever played they're basically just stats. SPEED vs. DAMAGE

    What I really want to see is that Polearms can't be used in tight spaces and daggers can. I want to see that Bows are not being shot underwater or where there are 5 foot ceilings. I want to know that if I use a two-handed sword, I'd better also know how to use a secondary weapon for different situations. I want a shield to work in the front, NOT IN THE BACK. I'd like to know that if I work my way inside of someone with a spear that I can obtain a better advantage than if I stay at weapon length.

    I really don't think I'm asking for much here, it's very basic logic. But I hope the devs feel the same way and are as commited to combat as they appear to be to decorating.
     
  9. smack

    smack Avatar

    Messages:
    7,070
    Likes Received:
    15,226
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Optional keyword highlighting folks. Let's not ignore the word optional, so don't get the pitchforks and torches yet.

    There's going to be an optional minimap as well, as part of the $1.7M stretch goal -- so just FYI now before you see that in a future standup and start sharpening your shivs to gank the devs. Again, the keyword being optional.

    :)
     
  10. Kilhwch

    Kilhwch Avatar

    Messages:
    595
    Likes Received:
    729
    Trophy Points:
    75
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    I did read that the polearms would have reach. I'm not certain if they'll collide in tight corridors or what...
     
    Vladamir Begemot and Time Lord like this.
  11. Freeman

    Freeman Avatar

    Messages:
    885
    Likes Received:
    1,537
    Trophy Points:
    105
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Superior, WI.
    As I've said above, it's just not part of the experinece I thought I was buying when I was promised an old school game. Is it an atrocity on par with the combat system? No. I'll get over it, as I expect will most of the other old schoolers.

    I thought the reason we were kickstarting this is because they wanted to put out something that wouldn't fly with a modern publishing company because it would behave more like an old school RPG. These crutches, even when optional, are telling me "We don't believe old school will fly anymore after all..." Every time we step away from that, we step away from what I thought I was funding.

    As for minimaps, I can get behind that due to camera angle. I could glance arround with a quick turn of my head in real life, in a way I can't in the game. It makes sense to me. Old school games were essentially played in the minimap.
     
  12. LoneStranger

    LoneStranger Avatar

    Messages:
    3,046
    Likes Received:
    4,776
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Petaluma, CA
    Is it known for certain that the highlight option is even something we have control over changing? Or could it just be a testing tool Lum put in there to see which way they prefer it?
     
    Time Lord and Freeman like this.
  13. Vyrin

    Vyrin Avatar

    Messages:
    2,970
    Likes Received:
    7,645
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Minnesota, USA
    It's not a stretch then to use this line of argument for key word highlighting. In real life, you don't have to hit precise words to trigger a response, can ask clarifying questions, etc. And like you said as well, old school games were played in a limited set of keywords.

    Speaking as one who doesn't like to have to tweak what I say 1,000 times to hit the right keyword, I (and I imagine most people) would use this as a lifeline if I got stuck, which can ruin the gameplay experience. Some hunting for the right word is fine.

    I'd actually rather have people stay in the game and get help, then go out and google for the right thing to say. Because if there isn't a highlight option that's what a lot of people will do.
     
    Nhili Dragon, Heradite and Time Lord like this.
  14. LoneStranger

    LoneStranger Avatar

    Messages:
    3,046
    Likes Received:
    4,776
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Petaluma, CA
    All of the keywords have alternate words, so the person doesn't have to hit that exact keyword to trigger the next conversation text. They are also recording words the players use, especially if they come up empty. If certain words come up often but are not in that person's convo tree, they can figure out if it should be an alias of something or if there should be another natural offshoot of the conversation.
     
    Time Lord likes this.
  15. Vyrin

    Vyrin Avatar

    Messages:
    2,970
    Likes Received:
    7,645
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Minnesota, USA
    True that. I'm sure the conversation trees will have some depth, but there will still be cases of getting stuck and my preference would be for people to stay in game to figure it out rather than to go to google.
     
    Time Lord likes this.
  16. Freeman

    Freeman Avatar

    Messages:
    885
    Likes Received:
    1,537
    Trophy Points:
    105
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Superior, WI.

    When did I say old school games were played in a limited set of keywords?

    I seriously doubt you're going to have to 'tweak' what you say to hit the right keyword. If they guys talking about chairs, and you ask him about chairs, you're going to hear more about chairs. If he mentions a dragon, or someone tells you ask him about the dragon, they're not going to tell you to ask him about the drake, and you have to figure out the secret keyword dragon.

    All highlighting does is allow you to skim the text and just enter keywords until the quest pops out. Identifying the subject of a sentence and parroting it back to the NPC, isn't the height of difficult gameplay. So what does not highlighting do? It allows side quests and sub quests for people who explore other topics that might have been hinted at. If he says "When I was young I was told the red dragon sleeps in a cave over by the tomb of the Lost King...." You have several topics to read through... tomb, lost king, cave and red dragon... maybe tomb leads you to other quests in other tombs, etc.

    But, if I ask "when you were young" I might get a whole different tree of dialog. One with it's own quests for those who chose to do more than just go for the obvious, and who took an interest in the NPC and the Lore. Highlighting is a way to let you skip that digging. It lets you skip paying attention.

    And no, it's a huge jump between minimaps and highlighted words. One overcomes limits of the computer interface, the other plays the game for you.

    As for google, someone may do it once or twice, until they get the hang of it, and learn the basic system... then they won't need to.
     
    Time Lord and NirAntae like this.
  17. Kilhwch

    Kilhwch Avatar

    Messages:
    595
    Likes Received:
    729
    Trophy Points:
    75
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    Where's this been stated?
     
    Time Lord likes this.
  18. LoneStranger

    LoneStranger Avatar

    Messages:
    3,046
    Likes Received:
    4,776
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Petaluma, CA
    Lum.

    The first part was here.




    As for the second part, I can't find the source, but I am almost 100% positive it was Lum. I looked in the forums and in the transcript thread, but no dice. I suspect it could have been one of the Rustic Dragon hearth hangouts.
    X
     
    Time Lord likes this.
  19. smack

    smack Avatar

    Messages:
    7,070
    Likes Received:
    15,226
    Trophy Points:
    153
    How are you still not getting the experience that you want if these keywords are optional for that experience? Are you afraid you'll turn it on? Do you not like knowing that they guy next to you is a casual who has it on because he needs more guidance than you?

    Are you speculating that now every single keyword that an NPC knows will be revealed, even secret / hidden / easter egg / quest-chain locked / etc ones in a wall of text that he'll spout the very first time he talks to you?

    Personally I will leave this optional keyword highlighting off and will play the game as originally intended.
     
    Time Lord and NirAntae like this.
  20. Phredicon

    Phredicon Avatar

    Messages:
    877
    Likes Received:
    1,840
    Trophy Points:
    105
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    I will as well, but I hope that in order to give everyone the greatest chance at playing the game as it was originally envisioned that all of the optional features are off by default. People tend to stick with what they are presented first.
     
    Time Lord and Freeman like this.