Stretch Goals: Why are you hiding them? (and) Why I likely won't pledge toward them.

Yup, looks like I touched a nerve.

Or something.

 

The stretch goals are exactly where they wanted them to be: out of sight and out of mind (sorta...). To wit...

Well, yes and no? Yes, in that it does seem overpriced but it likely include tons of ample buffer not just to iterate on changes / feedback but how it may affect other systems they haven't thought through. No, in that they said they aren't going to work on these until all other commitments are completed:

But even then, it's ironic they had to include these as (non-functional) "immediate rewards" as an incentive to pledge which caused them to do work on stretch goals now before other commitments.

I mean, it's not like the KS goals we all pledged for were immediate rewards...yet, these are getting created (non-functionally) first.

 

They really aren't. They are already creating those items anyway; elven NPCs are going to use bows and need their outfits, there are going to be ship captains as NPCs, and the structures will be used on NPC land. The only questionable item was the spyglass, since it added actual functionality, but that was implemented before they even announced the item, so they were likely reusing something they already implemented.

 

And I didn't even make one post on here yet...just imagine where it could have went to

 

Well, to be fair, I am proof that having a large post count, and/or large amounts of likes, is meaningless to the troll argument of picking on low post count/liked people.

Some get overly invested in the message, rather than the product, and hate to hear any truths or logic that could sway that message. Sometimes it is how you say something, but honestly, that is not the majority of the cases where someone is called out or labelled a troll. It is typically just what you are saying they dislike.

Its not locked into games obviously, it is just the human condition; zealotry abides, and I will just continue to speak my thoughts, like everyone, who were told to do so, by the project creators.

My favorite thing is when people consider you a troll, yet continue to answer over and over. If people just stopped replying, to what they consider a "TROLL" (aka FEEDING) then it would go away.

They really make their own monsters.

 

I like these conversations. It is very healthy for the community and for the developers. Even if some might get a little crazy with their passion! I just really don't think anyone should be put on "ignore" though. You are just limiting yourself and not being very open-minded. And in a sandbox, you really do need to be open-minded. Especially as a community!

 

You both need to "kiss and make up." You are both doing yourselves a disservice.

Now to play devil's advocate correctly. Joviex. Can you please show us a list of what is that the dev's have not or won't be implementing that they have promised from Kickstarter or anywhere else?

Something simple like:

Kickstarter Promise Dev Promises Canned Promises

 

I like being a backer for SotA. I really do. I just don't have the capital to fund all the projects and I DO have ideas for my character play that I would like to promote, so I spend my meager money in those things that I see I cannot get ingame after launch. A tax free lot would be next if I get the extra cash. I would think that others would do this as well. A player town would be awesome for me and I have a really good idea for one... anyway...

Portalarium's statement in the "Stretch Goal Store" bothered me to a degree. Here is the store quote.

"Welcome to the Stretch Goal Store! These are stretch goals with immediate rewards. When you purchase an item, you will receive it as an in-game reward, even if the goal is not met. If a stretch goal is met, all of the items in its respective category will receive additional functionality related to the stretch goal. These rewards are completely unique and will not be sold in the add-on store, in-game, or given as a pledge reward."

This is hard to believe. In the case of the horses I think these will be in the game. Period. The horses Portalarium wants to sell us in the "Stretch Goal Store"? Maybe THESE won't be sellable again BUT most likely others WILL be and the current ones are plane jane looking and NOT fitting IMHO for early backer material. Set us apart from the regular player base.

I can sell the horse stretch goal for you by a simple change and almost ALL early backers will pay for this. Style these on the foundation of Team British and Team DarkStarr.

Special horses for early backers:
Similar to the veteran reward in UO sell SotA backers a spell that will summon special steeds. The mechanics will be the same as a regular horse but early backers will have something that sets themselves apart from non early backers. I'm not trying to slam Portalarium for their business practice but you want $250,000 dollars as the goal for horses you ARE going to put into the game anyway. I see your at $11.5k a few months after releasing this stretch product. Enough said. This is another subject like fishing and boats. UO got us use to horses and mounts. They cannot get away from it in this game or suffer the flame speak from the player base. You know it will happen.....Set us apart from the regular player base.

Team British:

A Large Warhorse: A huge warhorse with 3 different styles of Barding and tack consistent with varied ranks.


Team DarkStarr:

A Nightmare (similar to UO): Big, Black, full mane of hair (hollywood style), red glowing eyes, maybe a bit of flame around the hooves with awesome barding and tack to boot. The age old phrase will be spoken to Portalarium "Shut up and take my money" You cannot deny this.

A Spectral steed: A large horse that is ghostly and spectral with barding and tack to match. When the rider is on it he/she looks ghostly and spectral as well.

A Skeletal Steed: A large skeletal steed with appropriate barding and tack. And when the player is on it they are undead looking as well.


WE WILL ALL BUY THESE. We wanted things like this in UO. We tamed them or waited years for them as Veteran rewards. We will want them again. Let your early backers have access to this. The current horses are very plain jane and in the future as more updates come out, these early backers horses will not be impressive compared to the new ones that follow. Let us ride the horses even if a goal is not met. I feel like this goal is being dangled over my head as if we all need to buy the stretch goal horse or there will be no horses at all. Sillyness. Set us apart from the regular crowd and make some money.

NOW PICTURE THIS... As a player I am sitting in a crowd of players on MY WARHORSE representing LORD BRITISH OR sitting in a crowd of players on MY UNDEAD STEED representing DARKSTARR. Now I feel like an early backer of SotA.


You can't have THIS game without putting ships along side fishing. You just can't. The flame speak from thy customer base would be endless unto eternity,"There will be wailing and gnashing of teeth". Want to sell ships to early backers? Of course you do. Then sell us these based on Team British and Team DarkStarr. Actually the current house boat, not being sold or given away in the future does set an early backer aside from the rest but give us a choice between these two choices and sell more.

For the Team British side:

The current House Boat:
Fog: Rolling fog around the ship. We get to control the density of the fog and circumference around the ship.
Ship pets: pay for add ons like crows, Sea gulls, wandering crewman etc.
Guards: Guards to protect the ship



And the following for the Team DarkStarr side:

A Ghost ship: A derelict looking ship comparable to the current house boat.
Fog: Rolling fog around the ship. We get to control the density of the fog and circumference around the ship.
Ship pets: pay for add ons like crows, wandering undead etc.
Undead guards: Roaming undead guards to haunt the ship that will guard as well.

You want $500,000 for the current ship to be sailable on the oceans and your at $7.5K a few months after releasing this to early backers. Set us apart from the other players by allowing this to be sailable on the oceans regardless if any goal is met. Set us apart from the regular player base.


You have Elves as an stretch goal why not...

Satyrs and undead?

Your early backers will most likely be the ones to play the most... So allow them to be a bad guy in appropriate style not just a red name like UO. Limit it to one or two character slots.



Extra tall or extra short characters. Sounds too simple an idea but people like the idea of being taller or shorter than others.


Special spells for early backers. Something that all could benefit from and not be a game imbalance.


Pack animals.......
Once again the "Stretch Goal Store" disclaimer implies to me that if the $100K is not met there will be no pack animals to store things on or we will have the animals but not be able to store things on them. Silly. UO alone set a standard by which many are relying on to become a reality in pack animals.

How about a clockwork machine in the form of some 4 legged animal that we can use to store items on AND we can use it regardless of a goal being met. Leave the mundane to the regular player base. Set us apart from the regular player base.


These are but a few ideas to set us apart as early backers.

 

Nice ideas TCL!

 

I completely agree!

I fear what is going to happen is that in Episode 2, we'll get mounts if the stretch goal isn't met for Episode 1. The people who bought these horses will have unique horses, but these are also very plain looking horses. Later there will be more unique, cool looking horses available for sale and the ones in the stretch goal store currently may be rare, but few will want to use them because of how plain they are.

Give us exciting horses for the stretch goal store!

 

This is a good argument for Team Osturd and Team Giant Beetle?

...Yes, I added the last one. What can I say? I liked rolling in Neon Blue.

 

You realize that was two months ago?

That is kind of the problem/discouragement with getting people to pledge more.

New people are like, well, nothing seems to be coming out often enough.

And they are not wrong. That post in itself, was the first time, ever, a team artist decided to "interact" with the community (other than Stephen who obviously was put into that role since the start).

And the time since shows the lack of any plan to have a continuous feedback with the community.

Its just too organic.

 

Since when was that a requirement? Yes to community funded and community supported, but if it was truly continuous feedback with responses, the game would never be released. The community can't even agree the most trivial of gaming features. This is not a non-profit venture nor a democracy. Chill and have a brew on me my good friend.

 

Nice post.

 

The stretch-goal campaign should be more effectively marketed

Elves please

 

Do they not have the money to pay for more and/or more experienced staff? Do they need a more "up to date" staff? I'm just coming in and just trying to get a feel of the situation. Thanks

 

This is what's written under "Stretch Goal Store".
===================================
Welcome to the Stretch Goal Store! These are stretch goals with immediate rewards. When you purchase an item, you will receive it as an in-game reward, even if the goal is not met. If a stretch goal is met, all of the items in its respective category will receive additional functionality related to the stretch goal. These rewards are completely unique and will not be sold in the add-on store, in-game, or given as a pledge reward.
(NOTE: Stretch goal items cannot be turned into Add-On Store Credit unless the stretch goal is not met by launch date.)
===================================

I understand it as this:
- if you pay for a stretch goal item you get an in-game reward, even if the goal is not met (thus a reward item is put in your bank)
- when the goal is met, the item is then activated (thus the item is created and active now)
- if the stretch goal is not reached by launch date then you'll get an add-on store credit (thus you get store credit $ to buy something else)

There's nothing about hiring more people and the launch date is far away (note we're still in PRE-alpha). As far as advertising is concerned, I found it the first day. As for the website settings, I have no issues with it.

The stretch goals are "additional" items that would be nice to include but not top priority to include at the moment unless the stretch goal is met. They still need to finish putting the game together (maps, combat, spells, crafting, npcs, towns, content, graphics, storyline, etc.). I consider stretch goals "put to the side" type additions until the MAIN game is created and working well enough, then they'll get to it. In other words, you'll have to wait for these so be patient, everything will come in time.

 

Small correction. No refunds.
There has never been any mentions that you'd get credit if the goal is not met.
You will still get the item, although not with the added functionality.

So a baby llama will be a pet, not a pack animal.
A boat will be a decoration, not actually functional on water.
etc

 

Also as a reminder and to clarify again for those who are new and for those who have forgotten that in a recent hangout the Devs told us that the stretchgoals will happen eventually so they are not a waste at all. Some of the items are a big deal, like the greenhouse, shed, the Elven House which is in game now, these are a bit more than decorations and we get many of them now, not to disagree with Spoon, he is correct about some things at this moment in time. True some stretch goal items will not function yet if the feature is not yet implemented in the game like boating. The devs have said that boating will be in the game eventually. So perhpas for now the boat when it shows up in the game it will be a decoration, but then later you would actually have your functioning boat and yaaaay to that day.

 

I never said you'd get a refund, but my understanding of the line above is you'd get store credit IF the stretch goal is not met by launch date. I agree I believe all the stretch goals will eventually happen, but perhaps in the unlikely event it doesn't, the store credit part should be made more clear.