Thanks for new character slots!

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Oyjord Hansen, May 31, 2018.

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  1. Oyjord Hansen

    Oyjord Hansen Avatar

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    I just wanted to give a big, big thanks not only for the new character slots, but also for making them reasonably priced ($10).

    This will prolong my life in SotA by an order of magnitude.

    Thanks, Port!
     
  2. Ryodin Stormwind

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    Wow, I'll definitely be buying one of these for $10. Awesome.
     
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  3. Anvar

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    Cool, thats a decent price point, anyone know are they, or will they become available for cotos ingame ?
     
  4. Anpu

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    That’s great to hear! I can afford that!!

    I know what I am buying for the telethon tomorrow!!

    Now just need to research some Ancient Egyptian words/names....

    :D
     
  5. Vyrin

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    Should this game have been called: Shrouds of the Avatars? When you can be an infinite array of characters, the avatar concept breaks down both in general and from a story perspective. Limiting characters was also one way to live up to the promise of "choices that matter", although that has pretty much been jettisoned from the design.

    It's simply a nod to typical sandbox MMO design again, further indication of the design direction of the game. For all those who enjoy that type of game, congrats.
     
  6. Feeyo

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    What is the difference in having an extra character slot and or buying a new copy of the game to have a extra character?
    I do not see the real issue here?
     
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  7. Rufus D`Asperdi

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    Multiple character slots... up to three... have been promised since the Kickstarter, so it's nothing new... This seems an odd time to raise objection. All additional characters will share bank, and virtue, just as they've always.
    Is it your position that extra character slots should be the exclusive purview of the earliest backers? How would that be at all fair? Just as with Heraldry, the implementation of Multiple Characters was a non-trivial task... To expect that the Development team put in that work, and NOT monetize it seems to me to be unreasonable and elitist and counter to the best interest of the longevity of the game.
     
  8. Brewton

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    Thanks!!
     
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  9. Vyrin

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    First, let's get the facts straight. Multiple character slots were not part of the original KS but added as a benefit to pledgers after that. I wish I could find the threads I commented similarly on there. Second, assuming my motive is elitist is just really poor. My motive is pointing to an original and deeply-held design principle of LB's games that has been slowly let go over time. The KS did say this: "The familiar psychological profiling used to create your character, organically derived game-play responses to player behavior and fundamental virtues and consequence of actions will all play a huge role in Shroud of the Avatar. Players will be free to choose their path, but must then live with the consequences of their actions." It is not indicative of any particular design but does echo LB's original concept of avatar-hood. Playable races also challenged the design principle.

    I was merely pointing out another decision that moves the game towards sandbox-MMO, and away from the concept of avatarhood. As long as character slots are going to be in the game, I don't care who has them. Not elitist at all.

    One is something you can't do anything about, the other is a baked-in design choice. Like I tried to explain, for those who don't understand the whole history here, this may seem like an excessively fine distinction. The great thing about moving in the direction of sandbox MMO for a game is design decisions are easier and simpler to make. They have large, widespread appeal. More can be monetized. I'm not saying these are bad things although people will probably assume that...

    Having your choices really matter is something that was promised, and really did not get achieved. Hard to do in MMO's admittedly, however, Shroud wasn't at first an MMO. But that gets into a whole other segment of history people don't care about anymore.

    In general, I think people sometimes forget that one of the original attractions to Shroud of the Avatar was the ability to witness in detail a game in development, to see and think about design principles and games in general. Now it may have moved on to just taking things as they are at face value. However, some may still recognize the old days... probably not many!
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2018
  10. hammadowna

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    Man, proof that people can be mad about anything!
     
  11. Vyrin

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    Please feel free to keep assuming my motives and emotions, even though people keep missing the mark here. What I care about is the interesting fault lines in original story/design principles and how subsequent decisions are made. They are very interesting and lead to a lot of confusion about what SotA actually is. (If you need examples of the many who have brought this up, please let me know.)

    I hope like me, we can share common ground in wanting the confusion about the identity of the game to be less. Someone in a video game university could do a really interesting project on how design decisions change over the life of the development of a game, especially because SotA started with a lot of LB design history. That would be fascinating with SotA.
     
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  12. hammadowna

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    Sure, provide some examples. The game has always been an MMO first and foremost, which has been verified by @DarkStarr.
     
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  13. Vyrin

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    Here is a quote from a Forbes review that sums up a general impression:
    "Shroud of the Avatar is confounding in its duality... It looks like a game that’s trying to be all things for all players while it will probably appeal to a niche audience. If you can put up with it’s limitations, which are many, you may well find yourself intrigued by its many strengths." I thought that was a good, fair line.

    Many others have made similar comments over the confusion about MMO/Single player - modes - Ultima Online vs. Ultimas - and more and more.

    All the reviews found after release were posted here if you want to read about some of the confusion... https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...-any-post-launch-reviews-news-stories.117636/


    And ugh. I don't have the time to unpack the layers of what the game was called originally, subsequent modifications, and then subsequent reinterpretations of original statements. Like I said, it would be a fascinating history. There are very few who are even interested in that, like me. But please don't make statements about the game being a certain way from the start without knowing the details of the history. If you need verification, just start with reading the KS page.

    Anyone who sees my posts as criticism and not discussion of game design is really hugely missing the point. I don't see why people consider it a criticism to point out how the design principles of SotA have changed over time.
     
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  14. Jens_T

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    Starr only joined after the KS (announced in May 2013) but the term MMO was used only much later. Also this doesn’t contradict @Vyrin statement about the Avatar concept being fundamental to Lord British games.
     
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  15. hammadowna

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    Agree to disagree. It was obvious going in on the KS that this would be an MMO.
     
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  16. rpgmaniac82

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    YES!!! thank you port for ading these for us non kick starter players /bow's deeply :D:D:D
     
  17. Gorthyn

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    I think the additional slots are great. I realise that many in game like the idea of one Avatar able to do everything at a drop of hat by flipping decks like some sort of demi-god.

    Others of us like the idea of different characters with different skills. I will certainly be getting several additional characters established in the near future. It will allow me to play the game in the way I prefer with multiple characters, will give me excellent reasons to return to the lower tier scenes and will put a few extra coppers in Ports piggy-bank so all good to me.

    If it's a feature that trends towards one "with widespread appeal" then I would say that's exactly what this game is in need of right now...
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2018
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  18. Vyrin

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    Wow. I guess you didn't follow my suggestion to read the KS. Consider that this was in the FAQ:

    "Though Shroud of the Avatar won’t be a massively multiplayer online role playing game, it will be a multiplayer game."

    Kudos to you if you could read the future in that statement as saying exactly the opposite. That's a level of insight I just don't have. I realize the facts and discussion may be lost on those who weren't here from the beginning. Like I said, those interested in the design from the beginning are probably a dying breed, like me.
     
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  19. Rufus D`Asperdi

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    I actually don't disagree with the point of your argument, @Vyrin... However Multiple Character Slots are and have been for years a promised feature of the game now Implemented for Early Backers, and now made available to all. Those characters will Share Virtue (along with banks, and property, etc.), which at least addresses one of your objections partially if not adhering to the letter of LB's vision.

    But it is a reality, both for early backers, and now for anyone that wishes to purchase one or more extra slots for their account... What is the point of complaining about it now? The decision is not going to be reversed... Extra characters are not going to be taken away. Your objection is noted, but it's "Settled Law" now.
     
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  20. Vyrin

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    I don't think I'm really complaining about is as much as wishing the design decisions were a little more consistent and clear. There are shifting sands in development all the time, but always trying to straddle being all things to all people (character slots while holding on to one rating of virtue is a good example) just makes all the accumulated weight of design decisions very confusing. I'm sure most of the people happy about the character slots (and again I'm not complaining) would just as well have different virtue scores for them too.

    Serious question: so if your different characters go through the main storyline quests, the virtue scores will be cumulative among them? And how would that make sense from the story? Again, maybe I'm the only one that cares about such things haha, but I haven't seen a description of that anywhere....
     
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