This Flag System is disincentivizing PVP

I like that one - it is lore friendly and makes it less exploity... Nice thinking.

 

So if it isnt a case of who hits first wins, then I cant really see too much of an issue? The current system stops gankers/griefers picking on individuals who dont want to pvp (UO learnt this lesson the hard way), and if it isnt a case of first hit wins, then if some pve'r or non flagged char hits you first, they then become flagged and you can pvp to your hearts content? I like pvp, happy to run around with the flag on, or fight anyone who wants to fight me, win or lose. To me, gankiong helpless players isnt PVP, its just bullying. Theres no skill in it.

To me its risk vs reward, the risk here is that the person you ganked/want to gank, friends might come help him and overpower you.

Imagine this scenario: everyone is flagged for pvp. So-called "pvpers" continuously attack and abuse people who arent interested in pvp or very good at it (and this has been the case in every online MMO that has PVP from UO through WOW etc). Those then quit reducing the population of the game, the developers give up because it isnt worth it. PVPers no longer have anyone to pvp against!

 

I agree there should be a time limit on unflagging and not just zoning out. But you will soon learn who the flag exploiters are and be ready for them

 

It is not really different from people using stealth to get initiative. Either you like PvP and are ready for a fight anytime or not.

 

I believe its the principle behind it. If the stealthed player is flagged then they are risking as much as the flag player they are engaging. Where the non-flaged player isn't risking anything but has the same chance of victory. Although... a non-flagged stealth player would be the icing on the F*** it cake.

 

Flagging for pvp isnt because you want duels, even if pvp can only be attacked by pvp that scenario would still occur. The only difference is that an agressor can let himself be know and take his time waiting to strike, and the defendor cannot preemptivly engage.

Being unable to preemptivly engage a known target removes the ability to eliminate the known threat before it becomes an issue.

Its kinda like you're in the matrix and everyone is an agent but they arent agents until they are agents and you cant kill anyone until theyare agents.

 

I never said that striking first didn't give any advantages; it's just not the main point. Let me put it another way: the current system doesn't stops ganking, while it protects PvEers, it also turns them into potential gankers.

I don't want PvPers to attack anyone who doesn't want to be attacked. But if someone is playing under the protection of a non-PvP flag, then they should not be able to attack anyone.

It's very clear and simple: if you want to fight, you need to signal the other players that you're a participant.

I have no idea why the only alternative you believe is available is that PvPers would attack anyone anywhere.

PvPers fight PvPers, PvP can't fight PvErs and PvEers shouldn't fight PvPers. There should be a delay to switch between the two modes. If a friend of yours gets ganked, you should still have the ability to switch; just not immediately.

 

Sounds like fun, real risk, isn't that what the hardcore PvPer wants.

 

Think of it like this every mob in the game turns blue you can't attack them anymore.
You'r gathering herbs you see a troll well nothing you can do about it. You leave the area because you don't want him to engage on you, in the new area you head to another herb suddenly your rooted and there's a troll throwing a boulder at you. Unfortunately the troll followed you and was waiting for you to walk near a group of archer's and mage's. now your out numbered and out gunned. If only you could of killed the troll when you noticed him the first time you could easily of dealt with the rest.

Same Scenario - changed troll to non flagged player.

Although Hardcore PVPer's want's a fight knowing of trouble and being helpless to do anything isn't the same as being ambushed.
Being ambushed is more along the lines of "I F*** up" or "Dam I didn't see that coming"

Were as seeing a player walking up to you and you know his a non flagged pvper you can run away go to another scene and hope they don't follow or make sure your full hp and be ready with a way to brake the root. But other than that you cant do anything to this person that can walk around you all they want knowing they want to kill you. That person isn't pvping his making use of a mechanic in the game that will offer him the best advantage of getting a clean kill and never having to risk a thing.

If all you had to do to kill a dragon solo was stand in front of it and wait for it to go to sleep so you can stab it in the head would it be as much fun as actually having to sneak in to it lair knowing that if you make a sound it will wake up and roast you alive?

But like I said earlier:

I feel this is the easiest way. It doesn't do anything to PVEers. It gives PVPers a reward for being flagged and it stops non flagged pvpers form harassing flagged PVPers for easy ransom rewards.

 

It's no different than seeing a flagged player and not knowing if they will attack. You can't attack first but you still must position yourself in a way that you are prepared in case they do.

Attacking them first doesn't fix the situation. 1 attack from them doesn't give them a win.

 

I don't get how the OP is not understood.

It's a disadvantage to be flagged because those who are not flagged and choose to attack you will always get the first hit.

Right? Am I missing something?

 

Its different because even if you know they will attack, you cant do anything about it because they arent flagged. If it was another flagged player, you could initiate the attack on a suspected agressor. You cant do that if they arent flagged. And there's no hope of retaliation if they never decide to attack you again. One of the most irritating things is having someone use game mechanics designed to protect them to kill you, then boast behind their protection with zero fear of retaliation

 

Thing is we need to provide sth so ppl afe encouraged to set the pvp flag. Ofc I can be ganked as flagged person.. but the risk I take needs to be rewarded. I still recommend to use star wars galaxies consent pvp flagging system pre nge as example bere.

 

No that is correct. I'm at a loss at how this is a confusing subject my self.

 

And I thought players PvP for the fun, not the rewards

I would not mind if players could be looted from everything they gathered in the scene in addition ot ransom. Including stuff they looted from other players.

 

Agreed, If you want to adapt the reward system take away don't add on

 

This part is heart of the issue. Irrelevant to me that people feel the need for retaliation. You lost, so what, back to the goal at hand before being attacked.

There is no need to attack anyone and everyone. Unless the only goal is to attack anyone and everyone. If that's the case a person with that intent would go to the places where attacking anyone and everyone is possible. Revenge is possible there.

Besides, avoiding the revenge will always be possible. Run to town, log off, and now with SPO/FPO/MPO finding your target could be impossible.

Then when they add the moral system. Revenge doesn't sound like a concept that fits well.

 

If getting the first hit translates to a win then PvP has bigger issues.

 

Well as I said risk vs reward needs to be balanced in every aspect of the game. Right now in PVP it makes no sense at all, not even Lore wise.

 

That I can agree with. At least for the open PvP part. It was added as an after thought because enough people asked for it and at some point they found a lore connection with the Oracle.

The purpose of open PvP hasn't been established yet.

The problem with rewarding the perceived risk is the probability of the perception of forcing PvP to gain the reward. Else, incur a penalty.

Reward success in PvP and not the act of flagging is a must.