Update to the Darkstarr Moondial!

I anticipate marketplace activity rising on this one because of the new function and style. Well done and thanks.

 

Thanks so much Drocis! I really do try my best, though I don't always succeed... For instance (and I just went back and fixed this when I saw you quoted it,....heh!) when I said earlier... "Things absolutely will change in our game as we continue to do this, and this truth should be taking anyone by surprise".... what I actually meant to type was... "....and this truth shouldn't be taking anyone by surprise..." Heh,...oooopsie! But you got my point, it seemed...

We are still a game in flux until we honestly feel like we can "stick a fork in it and call it done" (and even then, there will always be updates and improvements, as long as we feel it won't "break" the game)... That's just the nature of this type of game... Currently we're in SO MUCH flux, in fact, that what seems to us to be non-consequential changes like this (to what's essentially a decoration that's merely being improved and updated in visual as well as fictionally-representative quality) doesn't even rank as something of such importance that it deserves any real degree of fore-warning and communication... Our assumption (and I say "our" even though I don't actually get to make those kind of determinations about what is and is not important enough to make an announcement about, since opinions about that can vary wildly, even in our own offices) was that most folks will merely view essentially cosmetic changes like this one as a "pleasant surprise".... I say "most folks" because there will always be a small percentage that take such cosmetic changes very personally if they are especially invested in the look of something particular.

And honestly,...I can speak to that to some extent, and lend some perspective that might clarify why that's an easy thing for you guys to think about us...and why it's no-ones "fault" per-se, it's just the nature of how we used to develop games, compared to how we're trying to do it right now for this one (which is a very new paradigm for us, you see, compared to how we once operated "back in the day")... We don't actually assume you know and understand, I promise you,...we're merely hoping you'll be willing to, based on as much information as we can offer, feel we need to offer, and have the resources to offer... And the circumstances we're in where this is even a "thing" to talk about is a very new world to most of us here at Portalarium, because for many of us old dogs in the industry, this kind of above board transparency and sharing of development details has always been a VERY HUGE corporate "no no" in the past... It literally just wasn't done! In our industry, employees were sometimes fired (or at least heavily reprimanded) because they accidentally got overheard at some party talking about confidential aspects of a highly-anticipated game they were working on in mid-development that ended up getting leaked to public forums.... Oh there were teasers and such,...and all kinds of "coming soon" announcements and demos at conventions that were very carefully discussed and sanctioned well in advance at high levels within the companies we've all been a part of in the past...

What we're doing now with all of you as witnesses and participants (in as much as we can feasibly incorporate participation and input from outside the core development team) is so new that we honestly feel kinda freaked out and overwhelmed sometimes by (what seems to us to be) the enormous amount of information we're sharing with the eager public and of course directly with generous and considerate backers such as yourself and others... So many hours (often not even "on the clock"), each week, are spent by those of us on the forums (like me showing off and discuss new content), as well as the managers trying to find new, informative, and interesting ways to deliver all this in-progress data to the public that we sometimes find it daunting...

Hopefully this helps explain not only why we don't always "get it right" from the public's perspective,...but ALSO why we find it somewhat flabbergasting from our perspective when the public seems surprised when something changes and they don't feel informed enough about it, especially after the overwhelming number of hours we spend communicating some degree of intent on as many of what we consider "the most important" game-related topics that we can... To us, the information we are capable of parsing to (and from) the public each week seems like an avalanche of data compared the extreme and serious yoke of secrecy under which we once operated while developing a game...

This is by no means an "excuse" of course,...it's simply the truth about the way things are for us, just as, from an outside perspective, it might seem we're never fully capable of offering enough information (or perhaps not enough focus on particular subjects of subjective "importance")... ^_^

Thanks again for the compliment about the new version's look! ^_^ One thing I think bears mentioning, though, is that the "quality" of the Moondial was never really in question (though we will always strive to improve quality whenever we can with anything we're tasked with updating in some way, especially now that the Unity shaders are so much better at rendering metals and such). We always felt the Moondial looked cool, bet we ALSO knew that it might need to change once we nailed down our cosmology to some extent. And who knows,...it might change again some day. We often don't have a handy answer to share about such things, and may not, until the day Richard decides he really wants a particular thing done. Sometimes it's as much a surprise to us (and even Richard) as it is to you,...and that's not because of a failure in communication, it's simply because that's a factor of the spontaneous creative process that has always been a part of game design and development, even when it was a secretive process that the public never got to witness directly like you do here...

As to whether something like the look of the Moondial is "important" compared to other things that need doing, we've got a LOT of moving parts on the table at any given time, and the process we use to smoothly schedule and divvy out tasks often requires "fitting in" smaller tasks to fill out someone's particular schedule and get things done... If something's been "kicked down the road" long enough from one milestone to another, it often gets its priority raised eventually in certain circumstances so it doesn't get overlooked forever... In this particular case, I'm betting that the Moondial fit nicely into my schedule because of the theme of "celestial" things I've been working on recently, such as the Astrolabe and the updated constellations (and because this particular task has been "kicked down the road" from one release to the next for nearly a year!)... "Important" or not in the public's opinion, it was simply time to get this relatively small task done... I assure you this level of scrutiny is applied to every single task placed on every single employee's schedule, and it's touched by, and often commented upon, by our managers before Starr himself determines whether it needs to be in the next release's task list... Believe me, I constantly see Starr in there all the time managing and updating these tasks... It's a thankless and frustrating job for him,...I know.... And if we were actually to try and share all of that data with you fine folks, all the time, it would drive you as insane as gazing directly on the visage of Cthulhu!

All your points totally make sense, I assure you... And I can also tell you (whether it's reassuring or not) that we're actually still trying to figure out what place (if any) things like the Moondial will eventually have in relation to all those other systems you mention... Richard has some ideas, I'm sure, but they won't trickle down to folks like me until they have proven to be potentially feasible in the minds of the other managers...Will such things interconnect with other such systems in-game? ...Possibly... There's always "room" for such speculative communication, but there's not always time on our hands to deal with it in the kind of "formal" fashion the public might desire. We have to pick and choose how we use our time very carefully,...and we won't always settle on decisions that can ever possibly hope to satisfy everyone, so we must remain hopeful that we'll satisfy as many as we can... ^_^

Patience and understanding, my friend... In good faith let's continue giving these gifts to one another, the developers and our public, as this journey of creation continues, for as long as it gives us joy to do so...

Scottie ^_^

 

That's a good question! Though each of the moons currently have "working" names attached to them for the sake of creating assets we can refer to internally, I don't know yet whether Richard considers these names "official" or not... Despite the fact that there are several folks on this forum who are very passionate about having our cosmology and astronomy relate to the lore from "the old days" (cough, cough), we certainly can't make our stuff "exactly" like it for obvious reasons... As such, these names become a "thing" that must be considered by folks like Richard and the rest of management before they can be included in the fiction as a more "publicly known" feature... I'll ask them when I get back to work Tuesday if they're ready for the names of the moons to be shared (or any other cosmological fiction/data, for that matter)... I'm sure we can all agree that it would be nice to see this all written up in a design document somewhere in a more complete and accessible fashion!

Scottie ^_^

 

I hope so! Thank you so much!

Scottie ^_^

 

The celestial mechanics system is one that seems to have a lot of promise for affecting how other aspects of the game behave. Things like crafting, certain NPC behaviors, the Cabalists, etc.

Having a devise that mirrors the heavens is very cool, and I really appreciate the work on this.

 

Thank you for the very thoughtful reply, Scottie. It's great to see all of this in print and communicated clearly. That really goes a long way towards keeping my mind from going off the tracks and filling in the silence gaps of information (i.e. why are we doing this?) with imaginative speculation. Like I said above I know it's not "cheap" to perform this type of communication, and I should've said that I know it's not reasonable to expect it all the time (especially for something as mundane as updating the look of the moondial) but I hope that we can find more valuable and efficient ways to do this in the future because it's greatly appreciated (by me and I would assume many others) whenever it happens.

Thank you!

And since this sounds like something that is still in flux, I will take this opportunity to pitch an idea.

I'm a huge fan of DragonLance and can't help but see many parallels between New Britannia and Krynn. I always hope that it's not just a coincidence but that Tracy Hickman has perhaps influenced Richard's thinking. Anyway, in DragonLance the constellations were actually the celestial form of the gods. And based on their proximity to one another, their prominence in the sky, or their absence, they might have an impact on the strength of magic or signal a cosmic event. What is also interesting is that whenever a god would take the form of a Avatar and visit Krynn, the constellation would disappear!

It was all very cool in the books because most people wouldn't be paying attention but the magic users always knew what was up.

So my suggestion would be to copy that. And for important figures like Lord British and Darkstarr, maybe when they are in-game (live) they might have their constellations disappear, and when they are NPC's and not actually in-game their constellations would be seen above in the sky. Or maybe it would be better in reverse? (I don't believe they currently have constellations, but that seems like something cool to do so I wanted to mention it)

I'm hoping that overtime we can have more than just virtues and anti-virtues shown in the sky and there will be representations of magic, melee and crafting related "stuff" too. One of the most interesting parts of DragonLance for me was the idea that the moons were actually the celestial forms of the Black, White and Red magic, and the Black moon in particular was invisible to all those but the practitioners of black magic. (There's another idea I'd like to pitch)

 

It has long since been known (to at least some of us) that the actual names would not be the same as "the old days".. Richard had talked about using latin roots this time for example.. Last time the question came up he wasn't quite ready for the reveal. I don't know that any specific fiction is planned. I don't recall that ever being discussed. I suspect, Richard wants to drag it out for as long as possible for some reason. Why is anyone's guess.. or he really just hasn't made up his mind yet and keeps putting it off.

As for having everything relate to old lore.. there are so many tie ins/easter eggs everywhere else, including the existence of the moons in the first place.. it would just be funky to not have that consistency. They're already arranged in the specific order, color coded according to the virtues etc.. it's all there. May as well 'finish the job right' and take it as far as you can. Otherwise it'll feel like a flop. (Now if only the constellations rose and set in the proper order )

 

Now if they made a scaled up version of this for city decoration in which towns would i see it?

 

I think I support this idea @Baron Drocis Fondorlatos , but I figured you would have seen these ... our frums are way big I guess because I know I too miss allot of stuff all the time around here ...


https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...gems-what-do-they-do.48157/page-2#post-641210 (Time Lord "Ritual magic through books, scrolls, planets and emotes" Sep 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/gems-what-do-they-do.48157/#post-641166 (Time Lord "Gem value modifier when made into jewelry" Mar 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/hey-look-up.51145/page-2#post-582014 (Time Lord "planets and Highlander Moment" June 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...ed-astrology-seasons.52687/page-2#post-577111 (Time Lord "Disappearing cities and other effects" + early quotes from "RG", June 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...ed-astrology-seasons.52687/page-2#post-576948 (Time Lord "An all inclusive astrology" June 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...s-needed-astrology-seasons.52687/#post-575892 (Time Lord "Multiple effects of singular planets" June 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...s-needed-astrology-seasons.52687/#post-575683 (Time Lord "Algorithms creating more fun in gaming" June 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...s-in-our-skys-needed-astrology-seasons.52687/ (Time Lord "Enhanced game play through planet effects" June 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...make-1-month-1-month.52391/page-5#post-574148 (Time Lord "Combat balancing issues and planets" June 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...make-1-month-1-month.52391/page-4#post-573485 (Time Lord "Effects of gravitation waves on Novia Time" Jun 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f.../hybrid-magic-system.40197/page-3#post-552926 (Time Lord "Scrolls, Book Magic and Planets" May 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...gestion-for-crafting.48201/page-2#post-552849 (Time Lord "Global effects of planets" Mar 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...gestion-for-crafting.48201/page-2#post-552777 (Time Lord "Response to GREAT and Important Portalarium Feedback which everyone should read Mar 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...gestion-for-crafting.48201/page-2#post-552767 (Time Lord "Planetary Algorithms and Effects" First Ever Portalarium Feedback to Time Lord with great thx to @GingerLoaf , I thought I'd provide a small library for Portalarium with my thx for their feedback. Mar 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f.../hybrid-magic-system.40197/page-3#post-552563 (Time Lord "Body movements, book and ritual magic using planets" May 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f.../hybrid-magic-system.40197/page-2#post-541009 (Time Lord "Book Magic and connection to the passage of Planets" Apr 2016)
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https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/fishing-hot-spots.47390/#post-521625 (Time Lord "Planetary effects on Fishing" Mar 2016)
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https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...tronomy-101-spoilers.36696/page-3#post-519241 (Time Lord's returning questions, "nothing done yet, Portalarium's continued silence" Mar 2016)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...crafting-discoveries.18021/page-2#post-283210 (Time Lord "Special Quests and planetary timings" Dec 2014)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...nt-with-random-bonus-stats.18175/#post-281179 (Time Lord "variable weapon effects by our stars" Dec 2014)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f.../holidays-in-new-britannia.17694/#post-280217 (Time Lord "Elegance of planetary patterns and the Darkstar Moondial to glow during events" Dec 2014)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/enchanting-items.17748/#post-280022 (Time Lord "Planets effecting SOTA skills and enchantments" Dec 2014)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/observatory.10451/page-2#post-176245 (Time Lord "Events, and personal magic effects in the planets" May 2014)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/observatory.10451/page-2#post-175529 (Time Lord "Crops effected by the planets" May 2014)
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https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...s/tracy-hickman-story.3711/page-2#post-129090 (Time Lord "Tracy Hickman's actual Astrology chart" Feb 2014)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...ring-the-old-ways-of-virtue.7408/#post-127552 (Time Lord "The History of Virtues in the stars" Feb 2014)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...ct-to-effect-in-consequence.7211/#post-121073 (Time Lord "Luck in the stars" Feb 2014)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...w-britannia-astronomy.3867/page-3#post-110193 (Time Lord expanding on @Cryptomancer 's "Eye of the Moons" conjunction)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...w-britannia-astronomy.3867/page-3#post-109992 (Time Lord "~Pentalpha~" and Astrology in Architecture Jan 2014))
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...w-britannia-astronomy.3867/page-3#post-109735 (Time Lord "The Kolisko Effect, or Morphochromato" aka myths of magic connection to the planets, Jan 2014)
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...on-possibilities-and-wonder.6103/#post-109573 (Time Lord Jan 2014)
~Time Lord~'

 

That's a fun idea!!! Assuming it would be possible, having a giant one in town could almost feel like visiting Aughra's Observatory in the Dark Crystal!

 

Oh man, please do this! A city-lot sized Observatory would be so awesome, and put the Dragon Statue to shame!

 

I need this object to go on living.

 

I had thought about building a giant orrey but since they aren't accepting assets I just never go around to it.

 

Wow this is absolutely beautiful artwork. You guys and guys at Portalarium continue to amaze me. Keep up the good work. Let me know when you get those lifelike knight statues made tho I want to be the first to buy a few of these! If you need an example of what I'm talking about, send me a PM

 

Sold! I have no idea where I'd put it, but...well, that's a heck of a pitch! Maybe with a large enough arena basement...

And since I don't think I've said it before, I'd also like to echo the appreciation for the grace and insight with which you answer our questions. While I understand the game hasn't arrived yet, it's a comfort having some narration for the journey.

 

Beautiful work, Scottie!

 

Thank you so much, Wayfarer... It's not really my job, but I try to resolve concern and consternation whenever I see it (especially if a post of mine seems to cause it), because I know seeing it from either side of this kind of creative "fence" can be frustrating if one feels uninformed or unheard... And even though I can't always provide satisfactory answers to resolve frustrating situations, just being able to talk about it, while shining a light on it to broaden perspective, sometimes helps... I just hope everyone is as easily forgiving when I might stick my foot in my mouth on occasion.... Heh! ^_^

 

Thank you Sir Frank! ^_^

 

I'm really excited about this. The Darkstarr Moondial is one of my favorite pieces and is the centerpiece of one of the rooms in my house.

 

By the way, what's the relationship between DarkStarr and the moondial, given that its named after him?