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We do not have a classless system

Discussion in 'Release 45 Feedback Forum' started by Poor game design, Sep 4, 2017.

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  1. Trihugger

    Trihugger Avatar

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    Not to be offensive, but you outlined how only one facet of this game benefits from having GM skills. I agree with you attunement does help with my original want of selfish reasons to GM skills, but I don't play a mage. What about melee? Archers? How about my armor abilities? Outside the very specific and special case of avoidance (which easily is covered by me saying 90% of all skills), there's really very little reason to GM any one skill, solely for the benefit that one skill provides, relative to what it does at 80 skill.

    If every skill tree functioned like a magic tree with attunement, you'd have a more solid argument, but ultimately it doesn't. There is no *real* benefit to me for GMing, say, thrust or any other active abilities in blades vs leaving them at 80. Please don't just cite magic and tell me the whole game is just fine... clearly a lack of understanding of "how the game works."
     
  2. Elwyn

    Elwyn Avatar

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    True, but it doesn't mean that everyone does min/max the same thing. They just end up being under-powered when they don't. Meanwhile Chris keeps cranking up The Hard all the time, mostly from bringing new stuff online that makes mobs harder to survive against without a min/max build. And those that do go for the min/max just gain more exp faster and faster.

    I guess I'm mostly the glass cannon fire mage type (spam damage real fast with some heals in between), with a sword so I can still do some damage when I run out of focus. My biggest weakness is being attacked by multiple mobs, that's the "glass" part. Maybe you could say that I am specializing, because at adventurer level 75, I only recently got my first non-crafting GM, in Searing Ray. Sure, if I wanted to be The Best I could go easy mode by wearing plate and shooting a bow, but I don't want to do that.

    But that's just solo. I also have a half decent healer deck and know how to use it. Yesterday I was stuck on getting into Grannus Colossus, when I teamed up with someone who came by. I didn't expect such a flood of enemies while waiting for those doors to open, and couldn't have handled anywhere near that many alone. At first I tried to just fight along, but that didn't even last five minutes, and he kept dying too. So I switched to my healing deck and then he was able to mow them down.

    But I didn't stay "specialized" in the same way all the time. I kept my normal deck as alternate and switched back to it when we didn't need so much healing. The only trouble we really had was when an archer would sneak up behind us. It was great to not be playing solo, and it was a good change from the Love/Truth/Courage paths, where the big fights were solo-only. I could not have gone through that solo, but I did just fine duo. And we did it all in multi mode except for one point at the end where I switched over to make sure that something wasn't messed up.

    So maybe you could say there is a "best" build... if you only ever play solo. (Or "group solo", where everybody in a group plays like they were solo.) Right now the player base is much smaller than will be expected after "release", and there isn't much group content outside of grinding, so not much chance for a healer build to be useful, and thus I don't get much chance to go healer. I'm not big on grinding; I was adventurer level 70 a few months ago, so not advancing very fast.

    So maybe the way things are right now is partly due to a lack of players?
     
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  3. Antrax Artek

    Antrax Artek Avatar

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    I'm sorry but the base of the thread is false, i've seen hundreds of different and competitive pvp/pvm classes in game.
    I have some build, and all of them works in pvp pretty good, if you want test, my ingame name is the same as forum.

    Some examples:
    Pure Death Knight/Mage with 2h axe
    Leather air staff mage
    Ice/Air Mage double wand
    Moon Thief dagger
    Subterfuge Ninja 2h sword
    Air Thief wand+sub
    Dual wield Plate warrior
    Fire Halberd fighter
    Mace+Shield Sun Tank
    Crossbowman Plated
    Holy Archer
    Halberd Subterfuge rogue
    Elemental Mage shield/wand
    Earth Warrior with plate
    Cleric Plate Healer/ vs undeads with mace+shield
    Earth Pugilist

    And these are only combat classes tested by me, in the game there will be many many more combos i think and not only releated to combat.
    You can create your dream character and be what u want, that's the point and if you're a good player, you will rock with it.

    I'm a powerful mage i think
    Pure Fire and Ice/Air Build in action
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2017
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  4. Odyssey2002

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    I understand your point and agree with you.. There should be more distinctiveness between characters other than just clothing...It would be cool to have a TOTAL of 4 skills that can get unlocked at 150.. this can be done now with little effect on the players and would add distinctiveness to the players.. So that way GMers would have to choose which 4 skills and out of which tree would they like to unlock. they still can their mind by unlearning the skill back to 149 adn start another but only a total of 4 Wizard GM skill can be active at one time.. This skills will be crutial in certain areas..
     
  5. Sakarisei

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    Well, one of the things which I've hated completely from this game is about warriors or archers practising magic for not being overcome by that thing, for non-talking that the Healing Spells (Especially Healing Touch/Healing Ray and Healing Grace) are completely a mandatory for basically every build excepting for necro users who carry the Necro Artifact ring. That thing makes sometimes uncomfortable for those people who have used to play classes like those ones without the support of the magic.

    But I completely disagree that anyone is basically the same because I don't have guys in my guild who overcome my Chaos Attunement (which is 75 without Warlock's Chain), or... for example, I don't know a guy who uses Smoldering Shiv for combining it with Rend and Ignite Weapon (At GM atm), giving bosses a huge ammount of DoTs. In PVP, I've got two builds. One with main swords with the support of Ice and Stone Arrow, but mainly swords. Another build is composed of Earth/Chaos, which can annoy...
     
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  6. the Lacedaemonian

    the Lacedaemonian Avatar

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    This might be a good place to toss some ideas in.

    I wondered if it would be reasonable and fun/challenging to allow stacking past 5x. Say, another card can unlock at GM and another at 120, even one more at 140 if someone decided to level that far.
     
  7. Jezebel Caerndow

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    If there was going to be another card unlocked I would say level 160, to follow the pattern already set out of doubling. 10 20 40 80 160.
     
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  8. Barugon

    Barugon Avatar

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    I'll bet that you would get another at 160 but I don't know of anyone who has a skill that high.
     
  9. the Lacedaemonian

    the Lacedaemonian Avatar

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    Why not have the pattern be at 0, 20, 40, 60, 80, 100, 120, etc?

    The benefits of taking a skill past 80 drop off so sharply, it just doesn't feel good when I take a skill so far.

    I feel like I'm wasting XP, then I realize I don't want to put it anywhere else. I think what I'm attempting to accomplish with this idea is to have a continuation of achievement past GM.
     
  10. Jezebel Caerndow

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    Because 9 cards of one skill is just to much 2/3rds of the dynamic deck could all be the same skill. Im sure if we did get another card at 160 someone on single player would have said something.
     
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  11. StrangerDiamond

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    I agree completely with BDF, and this is becoming a classic, getting your threads derailed and people ignoring your nuances right @Baron Drocis Fondorlatos ? :p

    To me this system is anti-ultima and pro grind.
     
  12. mike11

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    It would nice if they would fix how so many abilities can't un-learn and be forgotten..I've sent so many bug report and FR for that.
     
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