Lot deed selling....Is it just me?

I had similar views and tend to sell for only store credits. I work a JOB to make money. Yet the resellers do provide a valuable service as they gamble on reselling later at a higher price to those who decided not to buy or were not around to buy originally.

Even back in UO and EQ people profited off their fellow gamers. Prior to online gaming people profited off resale of items such as Baseball cards, comic books, and other collectibles.

Frankly your ideal is very ignorant and arrogant.

 

As usual, everyone is speaking past each other. Ethics has more to do with intent than practice. It is just as pointless to defend a general practice as to make conjecture about a population's reason for doing it.

And claims about sour grapes are even more ridiculous.

 

Wow, I stated several times that it is my opinion. Thanks for that.

I disagree. Arrogant? Passionate is more like it. Ignorant? Hardly. I'm not sure what I'm so ignorant about concerning RMT in gaming. I stated clearly what 'I believe' and even insulting me won't change it. I'm not alone. There are those of us who feel this is just wrong, period.

Sadly, I've liked a lot of your other posts on other threads and was about to like this one too until you blindsided me with your last statement.

Edit: I did state that it's not specific to SotA. I can't speak for items not related to video games. Physical goods vs. virtual ones that could be gone if the servers shut down tomorrow are two different things in my view.

 

I am in disagreement with your view on this subject. Absolutely nothing personal.

This subject is very personal for many. My idea on the subject has evolved over time. Neither side is entirely right. So long as the game remains healthy, I am happy.

 

You say you have several dozen lot deeds.... I think its pretty obvious what your motives are.

After this personal attack, you would be the last person I would ever buy anything from. You are exactly the type of player that I stay well away from. Because you have a LOT of spare cash, you go balls deep into throwing money at the screen buying as many 'things' as you can, knowing that the people who want them will buy them from you for a LOT more than they are worth. I don't deny that its cool to make a profit on something, but you are no better than ticket touts for concerts gouging people for everything they are worth.

Usually I would ignore this kind of butt hurt response, but I am too old and too cynical to keep quiet.

 

Kaledis,

You could not be more wrong about Sea Bear. Your ability to profile is severely lacking.

Investing for pure profit into virtual goods is extremely risky, no one with sense would take the chance.

Sea Bear has very likely given away more in game than most have spent. You did get the balls deep and throwing money at the screen correct.

 

We have a lot of capitalistic people who actually bought a ton of add-on store deeds to sell for a profit later. I was looking for a village deed, I had 4 people with clear market place web front ends willing to sell me one at $50 more then normal store lsiting (and they probably got it a lot less on sales days).

People just making money.

I hope they didnt invest to much into it! Im not sure the market will bare out.

 

*pokes her head in*
Lets remember to keep it civil and focus on the topic and not the poster(s) opinions.

 

Dose Berek have some kind of long weekend ;-)?

 

Ever bought Magic the Gathering cards or D&D minis? It is nearly the same thing (difference is random sets to keep initial purchase cost down). Portalarium already got paid the first time somebody bought the collectible - they already profited for their IP. The secondary market existing for obsoleted collectibles is what creates the primary market in the first place, people will only buy them if they know in the future nobody will be able to get them again.

For great example - I bought cases of last set of D&D minis, but despite spending a large sum of money did not get the ultra rare Shadow Beholder. It is out of stock at $60 despite it's purchase cost of $2.34. That 'profit' would not exist if there was not someone willing to buy. If that store ever stocks one even at $120 I will probably buy it. It takes sellers and buyers to create a market.

http://www.miniaturemarket.com/ddrd-055.html

Pixels vs. Plastic is irrelevant when it comes to collectible markets, they are both driven by the same desire of satisfying wants. If Portalarium created a 'Dark Gazer' pet of their own IP selling for $2.34 and I sell it to you for $60 later, how is that OK in the real world but not OK because it is virtual? Either way it is a thing that takes up space that I do not need to play the game but clearly some people most certainly want.

Lot deeds are absolutely a controlled market collectible by design. Nobody needs a house to 'win' this game, but everyone wants one. The initial investors in this game are getting paid back with small advantages (no tax no commission), and the right to sell these rare things. Nobody would have bought what they do not need if they was just buying an instanced house that had no advantage nor rarity nor resell.

BTW I have house deeds I did not need in my pledge for sale (on my knight marshall keep town lot vendor in Taenby Landing). At half the gold price of the housing merchant. I would like to recoup some of my investment in this game on decorations want selling things I do not need, but do not want enough to spend further real money on. Does that make me a profiteer if it means a deal for someone to get something desired that can no longer be bought?

Usually I am against RMT cash shops in games because they become pay to win, (and I think COTO are light P2W) But houses are just toys nobody needs and everybody wants. You wanting a cheap deal on an expired lot is just as much about profiteering as those who sell it high.

 

Never got into Magic myself nor used minis but I see what you are saying. I still hold the opinion that physical goods have a lot more permanence than virtual so 'selling' them or even some who are 'renting' online space just doesn't sit well with me.

No, nobody needs a house in this game. It is a luxury item, no doubt. However, buying more than you're ever going to want or need seems like there was no reason other than to sell later for profit. Who spends the kind of money it takes to have 'one of each kind' of lot type just sitting around? Someone who (regardless of who they are personally or what they've donated), invested money ahead of time to sell later for a markup. It doesn't negate your explanation and it doesn't make it illegal but I, personally, don't like it and that's not changed. This has less to do with trying to 'change' a system that's never going to change, it is money we're dealing with here and all, and more to do with showing my solidarity with the OP. He's not alone in his thinking and had the original response been better worded, I might have even just passed it by. As it was, I couldn't help it seeing the OP get a verbal lashing from someone with an obvious vested interest who then goes on the end his post offering to sell him any one of every kind of deed at a 'reasonable markup' and even offers him a payment plan option! No wonder the OP said, 'no, thanks.'

I've stated my opinion clearly enough. It's not going to magically change or evolve over time. This is my last post on the subject as it'll just go back and forth until the thread has to be closed because it's devolved. This opinion doesn't make me feel any less about the game itself, quite the opposite. I just tend to enjoy less real life seeping into my gaming time more than most I suppose. I welcome your responses and will read them but if it's just to berate me for the sake of berating me, it most likely won't get read.

 

Digital goods actually have more permanence than physical goods, my mom just scanned in her photo albums, I lost the physical pictures long ago to a storage place that was not as weather controlled as what I was paying for. I am more than happy she was able to virtualize them.

Of course if I buy the D&D minis I buy more than I want (nobody needs them) for the very reason that I can sell them years later and reduce my overall cost of the hobby. I also bought more SOTA support than I initially wanted to with the justification I can sell it later for a profit, to lower my actual cost, or even sell out entirely if the game turns out poorly. Something I cannot do with most STEAM and Kickstarter games that left my hobby money wasted.

Portalarium understands they will sell more and make more money to do more IP if they allow it to be resold at a profit for this very reason. You should not be upset that a market is created with those who want to sell more than they paid and buyers that want to get it for less, so that those buyers can also sell it for more than what they paid later. Anyone selling now is taking a loss of future profits when these things are much more valuable than they are now just a week after unavailability, so why should they enable you to recoup that future profit by selling even lower?

Virtual or physical collectors market, it is the very nature of the beast.

 

Oh so he bought 'several dozen' lot deeds because he wanted houses all over the place for himself?.... Yes of course he did.

No one would buy that many and give them away. He is the kind of person who would buy all of the bottled water from a store during a drought and sell them to thirsty people for more than what he paid for the as people cant go anywhere else. I despise that kind of person and I hate people who support people like this even more. The human race is all about greed.

Yes I spent the $90 for the Royal Artisan pledge, but I could afford that, I didn't throw (obviously thousands) at the screen so I could have 'several dozen' of something.

Think what you will about me, I honestly don't care. I play a game to have fun, its not serious because I actually have a life. When a game stops being fun, I move onto something else that is fun.

I'm out

 

People that play SotA 100% for funzies and people that play 100% for profit are both pretty small groups I think. Most fall somewhere in between and enjoy playing games but also like the fact that there is some potential for a return on their investments. I dunno how anyone can get mad at people for making calculated investments in a game that depends on people to do exactly that in order to exist.

 

When you buy out the bottled water at a store during a drought you're killing people. When you buy out the lot deeds you're not letting a player go into a house and store virtual items.

 

*Stands up from his viewpoint*

It is funny to see that the rich are in defense now. Some months ago they told everyone "we are a big family here and love each other and that wont change". It did. Mixing reallife-power and ingame-power is a bad design-decision. Do you hear Portalarium? You trespassed a line which won't pay back for you on the long run. There are only some rich but there are many many others who are not willing to pay the price. You should have tried to comfort the second category ...

*Sits down and enjoys the show*

*Popcorn anyone?*

 

Where are the mortgage lenders?

 

My friend I believe you are taking this a little too far for this forum. I made a general statement about a general observation. I would caution you about making political statements on this forum, next time I will report.

 

Honestly, sometimes it feels like people have nothing better to do than complain. I specifically say that because you referenced ArcheAge <shudders>.

In ArcheAge, the land grab (for those who don't know) went something like this:

1. When the servers started on day ONE you RAN to stake your claim on your land. Literally...the...whole...server...at....once.
2. CRASH.
3. CRASH.
4. CRASH.
5. Some people were able to get land without a CRASH .
6. It took weeks for the server to stabilize. I bought a piece of land for 750g in-game gold (which was harder to come by; and Trion sold coins that went for like 250g for $10 USD I think - it's been a while).
7. UPROAR - because some people got in and staked claims (some multiple claims).
8. Several months later, you had an upgraded version of the game with MORE land open up.
9. Repeat steps 1-7.
10. About a year later, you had a new version of the game which WIPED all previous land so you could have a new land rush - which went a bit smoother but you still had problem #7, because, you know, the internet.

This is NOTHING like SoTA. The reason is real simple: people who purchased land WERE FUNDING GAME DEVELOPMENT. What's interesting is that your argument would basically take that element out of the game (i.e., the funding)...and then there would be no game. This is the fundamental problem with this argument.

If people are selling their stuff, that is their prerogative. And, remember, the flip side of that is people are buying. How is that not healthy? The only way it is not is if you think this game is a utopian version of life and should be absolutely and unequivocally fair. Which it never will be, just like RL is not.

I can understand some people missed out on the pledges. I can understand some people could not afford a pledge when they were active. If you really want a home, now you have something awesome to play for. I have guild mates who spent the last month grinding gold so they could (if they win a lottery) afford a home. Just saying...

 

Folks, please don't ever, ever treat virtual property as an investment. Even short-term. Interest in SotA is high now, and so there is lots of demand. Every virtual world game has declining player-bases over time, and so prices will drop. It is quite likely that 6-12 months after release, prices will be lower than what people pledged.

Only buy lots if you want them now to use yourself, and will feel no sadness if their price drops later.