Combat Mechanics - a few questions.

Hi folks,

I'm not asking how combat works, I am pretty clued up on that. I have evolved as the game has evolved through the early simple fixed decks, to stacking of combos and power stacks, etc. I have my buff decks, my various specialist decks... and so forth.

Currently I have settled on the Heat Deck, I love it, its so simple, subtle and intriguing. I get the benefits of my skill point investments if I power stack, which also saves me stamina, or I can spam it, drain Stamina but get a powerful short burst of dps to deal with npc Zergs, or simply to dispense rapidly with low level mobs.

Using the locked Heat deck I of course don't get to play with Combos, but what I don't appreciate I don't miss and for me the latest iteration of the locked Heat Deck offers so many other advantages it is awesome.

It is important here that I add I am primarily (but not exclusively) PVE, I have no issues with PVP, I love structured Open World PVP such as Castle Defence or Realm v Realm.

...So why does combat mechanics get flamed so consistently? Does anyone know?...

• Is it to do with PVP? I have read comments, some quite old now where players complained that the manual process of power stacking or combo stacking required a third hand. I can understand this, the Heat System seems a way round this but I'm sure it doesn't offer ultra-max DPS for serious PVPers.

• Is it to do with Combo's being unavailable in the current locked Heat Deck?

• Is it all (or mainly) the direction or perceived imbalances of Buffs and Debuffs? Again, ive done enough PVP to appreciate how this can get super messed up; overpowered or under powered classes, stacked stuns and knock-backs, worthless or massive OP DoTs...etc.

• Is it to do with the balance or level of the Avatar's dps/ challenge versus the pve environment's current challenge? I see many complaints that it's all become too easy too quickly (the Devs are ramping up the challenge), I also see complaints its too hard (the Devs are doing stuff for newer players and on OW encounters to address)

• Is it more technical? such as angle of damage cones, range of weps, auto lock, healers struggling to lock target's melee struggling with keeping Aggro? lag or speed of combat reaction?

• None of the above and something else completely... as i'm such a casual and non PVP player I just don't get it.

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I am quite anxious to find out and understand the issues as I actually really enjoy combat as it stands, certainly in a pve environment. I was fairly 'so-so' with earlier complex deck models, though I found them intriguing, but I really like the Locked Deck Heat System and the tactical choices and challenges it offers.

I would hate to lose too much of this iteration of the combat system in the face of a groundswell of discontent with the system, more so if I don't understand why.

 

Combat was one thing i really love about the game.
I used combos allways , but also tried when the heat system was released and have some simple heat decks.

I really love the decksystem and combat in this game, but although i do i dislkke the grind the power disparities between players and how the sandbox is setup.

I actually tried to comeback, but ihave no home anymore , lot expired and tons of stuff in my bank, need to settle down again, move all my goods to start playing, but quest journal still bugged , no idea where to go and settle or what to do beside grind or be a lonely farmer sitting in front of his house smoking a pipe, reading books.

There is no sandbox gameplay imho, there is less to no RP imho, but only people exploit the elements of these key features!
That drove me away .

 

I can't answer your questions because combat is probably my favorite part of SotA. I don't get why people continually trash it.

 

I tank for my group and most of my problems come from the UI and the screen clutter and lack of options. I think this feeds directly into Combat. Check the screen shot link below... How many mobs are alive in the picture? Whats the Priority target? Do I care about all the corpses on the floor... etc etc etc...

https://media.discordapp.net/attach...38970009611/unknown.png?width=1208&height=677

I also spent a lot of time with the deck system and basically now use fully locked decks because of like you mentioned, no third hand, have enough to focus on already when I cant see whats going on and have a million buffs to maintain when tanking..

 

This is off-topic but I fully agree. The game needs more sandbox game-play components. Take a look at ArcheAge's trade-pack crafting and selling for an example.

 

ya sorry for ot - but the key was - i never had issues with decksystem or combat - in fact i liked it more than everthing else and it was one of the main features i liked to play the game

 

I think it might be just lack of knowledge of how to build a good deck. For me, most of my decks are 1 dynamic spot with 14 glyphs and 9 locked skills, mostly buffs and heals are locked.

 

do you use a buff deck @Mac2 ?

 

I do.

 

I think the combat system in itself is pretty elegant. Once you wrap your head around deckbuilding and such, you can really customize how you fight based on how you set your deck up. Like Mac, I tend to go for a single dynamic slot, two at most, usually to separate things by range, ie "this button is for things in melee range" and "that button is for things further away." There's many other schools of thought - all valid, and all allowing a lot more customizability and depth than most games "click button, execute skill, wait for cooldown" mechanic. I like the flexibility that we have and the 10-skills-per bar limit is generous enough to feel like you can cover contingencies but not so generous that you end up with half your screen being hotbars.

I think for me the main criticism would have to be the balance, as said elsewhere, the recent -significant- mages got is inexplicable from a balance perspective, as prior to it, melee was already far outclassing magic in damage at far less xp investment, gear cost, etc. etc. Players spend a lot of time levelling up, choosing skills and a build that works for them, only to have to turn around every month and rethink it due to pendulum-swing balance changes. This was acceptable during alpha, and even tolerable before specializations, but the reality is now that we have more permanence in our choices, and now that this is a released game, these drastic swings are no longer palatable. It has become exponentially easier to level up now, it is far easier now than ever before, and there are people who started at R52 release who have already blown by people who've been playing for nearly two years of persistence. Bearing in mind how easy it is to get experience in a group now, I think we really need to ease up on the 'high end nerfs' - make the fact that you've spent years developing your character count for something, even if that is only a marginal power increase. Its simply not necessary to flatten the curve at the rate at which new players can gain experience, they'll be at the soft cap where the curve turns into a brick wall in a matter of weeks.

But yeah, the system itself - no issues - one of the better combat systems I've seen, honestly. Just need to stop messing with it.

 

Probably because virtually every part of the combat system is broken. From the basic interface to skills to equipment to practically anything relating to combat.

Since you mentioned you use Heat, here are some of the problems with Heat.

1. Charging skills for DPS
Horrible dps
Fully stacked skills don't provide anywhere near enough dmg after holding a button for 5+ seconds. You can do more damage with an instant cast 1 stack crit.
For classes without auto attack, you stand around doing nothing while charging
Cannot stack more than 1 skill at a time
Cannot cast multiple stacked skills in a row
Charge times are ridiculous

2 Spamming skills for DPS
Huge focus cost
Global cooldown means a far slower rate of attack
Less skills you can cast. A Heat user can put 10 skills on their bar. A Drawn user can put 10 skills in 1 slot.
Once all dps skills are on maxed CD you might as well go make a sandwich or take a nap.

3 General Combat
Getting Interrupted while charging loses all charge time. A 1 second stun can have you doing no dps for 10 seconds.
Committed to casting the charge skill. Cannot cast a quick reactive spell otherwise you lose all charge time.
Fun factor - charging 1 boom skill for massive damage is fun. Charging all skills repeatedly for competitive dmg/focus reduction sucks
Far less skills compared to a glyph stacker

4. General Ergonomics
Holding a button down vs simple click / key press
Holding down 10 different Keybound skills
Click holding a skill on the bar / skills slide off bar


This list is laughable and does not even begin to discuss some of the problems with Heat.

The Drawn Glyph system is even worse.




Considering also that

1. Almost every skill tree is incomplete, unbalanced and broken in some fashion
2. Individual skills are in the same shape.
3. Basic defense is dependant on a variety of factors, many of which are broken
4. Basic offense is dependant on a variety of factors, many of which are broken
5. Anyone playing this game could easily add a category to this list


I would say a lot of the "flames" are warranted

 

That's why I'm liking playing with an unlocked deck.

All skills are min focus cost, and can stack 'em all in a fraction of the time to "charge" them.. if you play your cards right, and the odds are in your favor.. which you can streamline your deck to influence You can even stack your combos if you cards come out right

Some fights every skill I fire off is a 2-3 stack with 0 charge time.. some fights I'm just peppering them with singles (with a much reduced focus cost).. depending how lucky I am, and my deck setup.

Trade offs either way, and no "best" way.. I love it

-Met

 

Actually playing again, but havent fought that much until.
But what i like is, i see i have some decks and dont know why i had setup them like they are atm
I had a lot of Experiments and it was not only efficency i was looking for when i made decks , it was more a Kind of finding Skills and a combat style that is fun and immersing related to the RP i want to do with my char.

 

I like the options the deck systems allows. I mostly play with 3 unlocked slots for my range decks and 1 or 2 for my mage decks but there are many ways to play it. My complaints for combat are not with the deck system.

 

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...k-building-cards-or-heat-why-not-both.126507/

Don't know if you guys have read this guide I made, but could give you lot some ideas. I won't say it is perfect, as Others can do things I can't, but I think it can help you get a grasp of "fun" deck building, so you can make your own experiments. i wrote that up as a general guide and I don't always follow it's rules, but the base "core" is pretty much the same, and it is easy to add your personal touch!

For me, I have never had issues with the combat system, I love it and have spent countless hours theorising decks and builds. My only complaint is the combo system is lack luster, as I would love to be able to do more combos!

 

To overcome the need for a "three-hand" card stacking, I've re-mapped all of my combat keys to be accessible by my left hand. I have my first three slots unlocked, fourth is a range skill or AoE and 5 is usually a utility. The rest of the slots are heals, defensives, and charges / roots.

I am actually curious to see some other people's builds, both decks that are 'class' based (I have a few) and just efficiency based (DPS, tanking, healing, etc.).

I thought there used to be a website you could submit your decks to, but now I can't find it.

 

I agree with this. When I ask people who are frustrated with combat why, it almost inevitably gets discovered they are using an unlocked deck with WAY too many skills in it.

 

The combat system is pretty amazing in this game once you learn it. The problem is that they allowed people to play this game over the past 5 years in alpha which of most of it combat was still being worked on interactively. Read many reviews 3 years ago and there was mostly complaints. Today the combat system is vastly better. Is it perfect, no but I think the vast majority of new people who would play right now would be "ok" with it if they actually played the game more then 2 hours before they threw a negative review up of it and the game as a whole.

 

Some how I was hoping this thread was about wrench wielding ninjas. That being said, I like the combat system. I typically use 2-3 unlocked slots and keep the rest locked. I picked up a lot of good information watching/reading great content from @Mac2 and @Sara Dreygon . I think the complaints maybe due to the wide range of player expectations from the almost all automated combat in u7 to the super twitch mapped combos and attack sequences in your fancy keyboard/mouse combat. That or not being able to find good examples of game tested decks/techniques. After a point you have to stop assuming you know best and see what other people have done that works.

 

I think you're going to find just about everyone on the planet who enjoys our drawn deck / Heat system right here in this thread.

Aside from that, in a thread basically asking why there are 1000's of threads complaining about various issues with combat,

We get 90% of posts extolling how much they like, how great it is or how really it's just a matter of people not knowing how to build a deck.

The only flaws pointed out in 20 posts are

1 post dealing with Ui / screen clutter issues
1 post dealing with a few combat balance issues

lol