Why full loot? -- (Dev) Replied

@Ultima- Aye hehe, it is so funny to read how these PvE oriented players actually believe that PvE is harder then fighting a human in PvE. I mean take UO pre AoS and compare a skilled duels at farms with a fight against a balron, LOL.
I killed the balron with 5% of the skill needed as to kill the skillful PvP player.

 

@Ara I'm sorry but you aren't really acting your age then, enemies? Really?

 

@Ara:

Yeah, the compromise is often to give an NPC a lot more HP than a human player because the human players are always going to be better at manipulating game mechanics in their favor. An AI is incapable of manipulating game mechanics because they must play within a pre-defined set of rules.

 

@rune-74 - I call players that enjoy safe games carebears cause it is a name suitable as i see it. You cant demand me to change my thinking and i wont.
That doesnt mean i dont respect their gamestyle but it is a gamestyle i will never enter.

 

@UA - have you or have you not been saying that PvP provides a greater challenge than PvE? Giving AI unfair advantages is how you make PvE challenging. And as I said, it can be made as challenging as the dev wants it to be.

You can always name instances of poorly programmed PvE challenges, just as I'm sure you can name instances of poor opponents in PvP. Try arguing against my premise that a PvE challenge can be harder than PvP.

 

@Ultima - Yeah but those extra HP didnt mean anything actually. Just took abit more time.
What we in my guild did both in UO and freeshards was acting out of the by developers prefered actions. We lured boss monsters on to boats and moved them out of the area of the plot and took all the rewards ourself, it was harder but gave alot of rewards.
Our skills and smart thinking gave us all the rewards and the carebears got nothing, hehe.

 

I don't get why people keep saying Dark Souls is a difficult game. It is a game that punishes poor play (unlike most other games released these days) but it is by no means "hard". If Dark Souls had piss poor controls and unavoidable cheap shots than it would be hard. As it stands Dark Soul's difficultly can only be measured in relation to the players skill level.

Sirinan your AI versus real player argument is quickly going into la-la land. Obviously the computer controlled AI with millions of hit points and super fast reflexes in going to be harder to kill than a real player. We are not idiots. I can program you a game in 10 minutes where the IA is guaranteed to kill you in 5 seconds or less. The real test is when you put an IA up against a human player with all the same skills and abilities.

 

@Sirinan:

You argument is that PvE can be "harder" than PvP. Sure, if I want to create a challenging AI opponent I can create them so they have a much higher level, hp, or mana than a normal player would. That makes them "harder" per se, but superficially. If you think of giving AI unfair advantages over other players as difficult then sure. It can be difficult you create AI that has no "intelligence" but is hard because it is capable of killing you in one hit due to unfair modifiers for them then fine.

My argument is that PvP is more fun because you are on a balanced playing field. Each player has similar skills and statuses and the only thing that differentiates one player from another is the amount of skill they have playing the game. If your definition of "fun" is playing against an enemy who has ridiculous modifiers over you which makes them difficult to defeat and not "intelligent" then fine.

Typical WoW scenario:

You enter an instance with your guild and begin attacking mobs. There are designated roles each person plays based on their class. Every single lower level mob behaves in the same manner, one person kites it, and then the group right clicks it to death. When you finally get the "boss" of the instance you basically do the same thing all over again. It was NEVER challenging, sure you died on occasion but there were no consequences. You simply ran back into the instance and began doing the same thing all over again -- mind numbing and boring.

 

@Sirinan - Lets take an example then, you enter a dungeon with "hard" AI and top that with same time fighting human beings.
Is it harder to fight the AI with or without humans?
Answer: It is harder to fight the dungeon if you same time have to fight humans attacking you. I experienced that on a UO freeshard where they had a really hard dragon and same time i had to fight even harder PK:s in large numbers, it was a awsome experience and took my playerskill to the top.
PvE is easymode in any game, the real challenge in skillful fighting is fighting humans.

 

What I see in this discussion is that the carebears are actually trolling and insulting people that agree on full loot PvP.
rune_74 and Sirinan are bashing Ara. What for actually?

 

Lol, this guy is cracking me up. He keeps calling pvers carebears, even after they say they feel insulted, and then one guy comes along and calls him a kid, and he makes him his eternal 'enemy'. I would piss my pants laughing if that wasnt so sad in itself.

 

@ND3G - I played both Dark Souls game and they are hard for being PvE games.
But they is a walk in the park compared to fighting the best mages in Ultima Online pre AoS, that took the skill level to for me never reached levels and that is what i hope SotA can deliver also.
And you PvE and ******** players, i want you to have your game same time, really.

 

Oh and, if people don't want to lose there stuff because they will not be playing SotA that much. I think special 'zones' for those people would be an answer. But if you wander in a place full of danger, don't cry about it. I really think that makes sense.

 

@Lanatit - Well keep on pissing then, i cant call a certain playstyle anything else then what they deserves to be called just to please them, can i?
If you without knowing anything about the one you respond too and call him a child cause you dont agree with his name calling then i call him my enemy if he dont apologize.
I had a bad reply earlier and i appologized on some words that offended some forum users. That is being a grownup.
If we very different playstyles, trammel and felucca players should discuss this SDotA game then we need to raise the bar abit, grow out of the names and discuss the game.
A trammel player is a ******** and themepark player that want less risk and as i see it less rewards.
A felucca player want a more skilled and more risk vs reward game with full loot.
2 completely different games and the challenge here is to deliver a game that suit both playstyles.

 

******** is an insult. you insult people. and you are obviously not able to understand it. this means you are childish. you act like a child. especially calling people your 'enemy' that you dont even KNOW. That is beyond ridiculous. What will you do now? Call a vendetta against me? Will you make me an enemy too and come invade my house?

 

@Attrib It is weird how one side sees people who don't agree with them as trolling, I have given many suggestions in here to get a system that works. But no one i s actually looking for that here, they want their way or the high way. It is telling how you don't find an issue when someone inults someone and is asked repeatedly to stop but continues to do it becuase he knows he is offending them

If I have to play what you guys consider "easy" mode to avoid dealing with some of you then I guess I will, however you never enticed me to give PVP a chance you just made me not interested at all.

 

@Ara: I agree with you, but I haven't heard anything of you how you can satisfy both party's. You have any solution?

 

@rune_74 That sounds reasonable.

 

yes. i feel insulted by it. so does rune. and others. and they have said it again and again and again and STILL you psychos (thats what we call pvpers here, i hope you dont mind) keep insulting them.

 

Lanatir: No problem, as long as you are happy.