Changing attitude towards PVP...

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by queenbee, Jul 24, 2021.

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  1. SmokerKGB

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    I'm not making this about "me", but rather I'm voicing my sides(non-PvPer) opinion, most are not comfortable stating there opinions in a PvP thread, especially when it is opposite view points.... I re-read your original post and no where did you offer any ideas or solutions, and since there was already 5 pgs(I only read the 1st pg, sorry)... So, Yes, I still don't understand the purpose of this thread

    You are free to try and "cancel" me and exclude me from this thread and accuse me of "copping an attitude" when I don't agree with your views, that's your right... But I will be participating in the conversation, because I don't want a one sided discussion... Main reason: developers read these threads too and it's misleading to have just one side, all should be able to participate and not be excluded...

    Some one below accused me of "Trolling" this thread, not at all, but if you don't like my opinions, don't just make sh_t up...

    I played UO for 13 yrs and Yes, I applauded when Trammel was introduced and appalled at the changes the Dev did(as far as I know, resources were doubled in Fel and halved in Tram), trying to entice me(non-PvPers) into PvP... Everyone knows what happened next, many players quit, Fel was a ghost town... UO is still running, I doubt they will ever shut down...

    So, I guess safety comes 1st and the PvP conversation remains the same (BTW, 5 pgs the conversation is pretty much dead as threads go)....
     
  2. Time Lord

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    All too true.

    An Old Lord British PvP Idea...

    Speaking of new ideas, this is an old one from Lord British. Richard once did interviews where he would describe a player currier mission carrying contraband, where the player would accept just as a quest to carry it from one city to another, with all other players knowing this as it would be announced through the criers, other npcs and through a universal announcement. Then any player that wanted would be able to try and intercept, fight and kill the courier who could use no scroll or moongate for transporting the package.

    If such a package quest were implemented today, it's extremely likely that they would never encounter another player who would care to stop them due to majority player desires.

    My point in pointing this out, is that the "hunting players" aspect of such a thing has no place here due to such a tiny community of interested players. Currently, even if all active pvp players were rounded up and formed a guild (which is an extremely far fetched fantasy), the guild they formed would be a very tiny guild compared to many others.

    So the answer, however painful to the pvp interested, is that pvp must conform to the program, and the program can even offer some new area, but it's still nothing but a pacifier, because sota was never going to suddenly change into a wide spread pvp gaming activity.

    If I were to offer up an idea of something for such a small group as we have...

    We have allot of open lots all accross our map. There could be some special buildings/castles lots w/castle, which could serve as control points that 2 factions could fight for control over and have some reward inside as motive and reward for taking it over, even if that means having a timer on taking it over. There could even be NPC guards which could be really tough to fight in the absents of anyone to defend it. Enough NPC's so a small 1-2-3 players couldn't take it over.

    Cheap to program yet would serve a pvp community our size.
    [​IMG]
    ~Time Lord~
     
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  3. SmokerKGB

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    I remember when this was kicked around and your probably right, the participation would be low, so let's think of ideas...

    1st- what's the prize? How about 500 coto, I could sell them for 100k easy (and that's not inflating the games gold supply, just player to player)...

    2nd- the challenge, Yes it's risky to flag, but 500 coto is 500 coto right, you could limit it to daily or weekly and Yes, I'm sure in the beginning there would be no challengers...

    3rd- it's got to be easy to participate, you shouldn't needed to be flagged prior to the quest, receiving a package should temporarily flag you and anyone attacking you will temp flag as well....

    4th- I think there should be red/blue quests to raise lower Virtue, like smugglers hand out red packages and Captains give blue and it should make you obvious by turning you red/blue, in town and World map...

    5th- I think the battle should take you into a PvP scene for 1 v 1 and teleport to player should be allowed for groups, can't leave the scene until package it transferred... either by killing the carrier or role play them to give it to you... offer to be their body guard for half the spoils grouping with them turns you red/blue also... and flagged temporary...
     
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  4. Time Lord

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    Revisiting this Lord British idea...

    Our current courier package mission doesn't pay that much gold. I think it's somewhere around only 100g. If that price were increased and only flagged pvp players could intercept, I think that's something that has merit in encouraging (somewhat) non-pvp or the pvp qurious to take on such a quest.

    • All that seems would be needed, is for our NPC package delivery missions to require being flagged for as long as they have the package.
    • The PvP flagged intercept player, would then be given reward or booty for the kill.
    @queenbee , @that_shawn_guy , @Gwendolyn Obscuro , @Bridge Troll ,@Ysold , @Violet Ronso , @Brandter , @Scanphor , @Anpu , @CatDude , @redfish , @Vesper , @FBohler , @Vaentorian , @Cora Cuz'avich , @Mingo , @Coswald_Dirthmire , @Cordelayne , @Joe Zhudarak , @Tirrag , @Winfield , @Lord British , @Elwyn , @jrs99 , @Johnwick , @Morgathys , @Beaumaris , @Duke Gréagóir , @Virsago2099 , @SmokerKGB , @Ancev , @Sannio That's not a bad number of players in such a thread.

    • So, what if Lord British's idea took the place of our "NPC Crier to Crier Package Delivery Quest" took on such danger?
    • How much would that be worth, or should be worth for both players involved, the Courier vs Interceptor?
    • Could this be very easily implemented without too much programing involved?
    • Would this be a fun or attractive thing to place in our game for the Pvp flagged and Pvp qurious?
    • Would this impact anything to change an attitude towards Pvp?
    ~TL~
     
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  5. Adam Crow

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    With teleporting and the overland map, I'm not sure how this could even work. How would a flagged player know someone is on a courier mission? Would every flagged player be alerted every time one is accepted? Time limits to deliver?
     
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  6. Ysold

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    Sounds like a fun idea at first glance!
    I see some issues with it, though. I'm afraid a reward of, say, 10K for completing the mail mission would appeal mainly to newer players and that would suggest it's not a PvP-quest but rather a RvD-quest (Rabbit versus Destroyer). Could be fun too, as long as players are very much aware of what they're getting in to.
     
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  7. Johnwick

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    The courier could come up with a flag on him actual flag notifying he is a courier, when someone interceps that player they are pulled into a pvp scene like a field with a road. Also if the player who's courier makes it from one side to the other they get a minute lead before they reappear to everyone on the map. And if they get caught again it starts over. Think of the random bandit or skeleton scene. You appear on one side if you make it to the opposite side everything refreshes again.
     
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  8. SmokerKGB

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    -I would not want to see the "Mail delivery" quest changed to this because it's still a viable quest for new players...
    -I am concerned with pre-flagging, I don't think it should be a requirement because it opens the door to open PvP... I can enter a shardfall and become flagged, but when I leave I am no longer flagged, so why can't it be that easy to participate?

    Well, I envision it to be much like "roving" encounter, in town or World map... The carriers should stand out like a sore thumb, be highlighted red/blue(indicating package virtue) and when battle begins, both are transported to PvP area (new or existing)where both are trapped until 1 dies(it's the package that's important), without pre flagging... Teleport to player should be allowed, so that carrier can call for backup or interceptor can call for backup to gank the carrier (or they can fight 1 v 1)... Once battle is finished, exit opens... Your dead, you lost the package, so you lose the flagging too, flagging move to interceptor(they become the carrier)... Teleporting can be turn off when engaging in this quest, for the challenge...

    Yes, exactly, but if it's too easy to exit the scene, there's no battle, no PvP...

    The prize should be large, I suggest cotos because it doesn't increase gold in the World and they can be used for other things too... If prize and flagging were done correctly, I might even consider doing a quest like this, why not if all I can lose is the package and flagging is temporary and there's treasure at the end if I try and take the package back...
     
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  9. Adam Crow

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    Ok... so after they set all that up, what's stopping anyone from just doing these quests over and over again for the reward? You really can't give cotos out for something like this, it will be exploited like crazy.

    While it sounds cool, that's a lot of dev time for a pretty weird way to duel. Building a pvp thing like this with the overland map isn't going to bring pvp players back. Allowing guilds to actually declare war on each other (and not just flag everyone involved for open pvp) would be a nice simple change. I'd like them to spend their time on a castle seige capture the flag pvp scene, or something with control points. Or make the banners more functional so that we can use them for player made pvp arenas. With some small tweaks to already existing game features they can start to build the groundwork to some meaningful pvp.
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2021
  10. Time Lord

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    I was thinking about this as well just last night. Those delivery missions only pay out a very small amount of gold, and even if teleport and scroll travel were prohibited, there's still a matter of fast travel ships which are how anything gets from one land mass to the other. There's also the actual running distances involved, because catching anyone between point a to point b, needs to be a distance which an interceptor could catch a courier.

    • Land travel distance would need to effect payout.
    We have an amount that players should be able to make per hour, so whatever time it would take for that mission to be run over and over again for one hour should equal that average amount. In this way it wouldn't matter if they were intercepted or not, they are still going to make the same as if they hunted for an hour in (let say) a level 2-3 skull area, yet the mission may not even have exp to offer from it, while actual hunting would.

    (Slightly off topic: I think the payouts of our current delivery missions need adjusting and also scaled for the land distance the delivery requires.)

    I was thinking on this too as it was a good question as well. The US Post Office didn't begin parcel delivery until 1913, with all mails delived before then being only letters.
    So maybe there should be a split, where letter delivery and parcel delivery could reflect either Non-Pvp or PvP flagged. Such a split could also get a newby or anyone ready for accepting such a Pvp delivery challenge.

    In both cases here, each needs to have their delivery land distance scaled for their payouts upon completion.

    For reason of how our game is developed in stages, I have encountered 3 issues which reflect some dust left on our development shelves which all were left in much the same level of developments as when we had cloned hunting areas, where we once had construction signs posted.

    Those three issues:

    • Public Venders (highly under used or should I say always empty).
    • Crier delivery missions (I think they are in the same amount of use as our public venders and they certainly don't pay enough).
    • Pvp anything (I know one or some of our developers are working on or thinking about working on a new area, but I also think there's other things we're missing which could better blend or sprincle some more pvp flavor around without imposing it on anyone or taking anything away from anyone, somethings that would have some form of alure for everyone, audience and pvp participant). When I buy something to decorate my walls with, I like it to match or complement something else within the room, and I think our game lacks that quality, leaving pvp the lonely plaid shirt in a wordrobe full of stipes.
    We have allot of developed bits and pieces left over from early development which could be sewn together or resurected into something that could share a pvp motif, or even things completely new.

    Sewing competition around Disneyland aint easy, but it sure is possible.
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    ~TL~
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2021
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