New Combat System

The only problem I have is the concentration on the hot bar, I know the locked system is there but lets try to see if there is a way to overcome this.

Auto Attack Cards and Focus Attack Cards
This is to help minimize the need to glare at the hot bar.
Auto Attack Cards - Unlocked skills that when the card is drawn it will modify your auto attack for a short period. Can be attack and defense skills.
Example: Pole-arm - heavy thrust - For the next few attacks the player will attack with heavy thrusts. Chance of knock down.
Fire - Fire balls - Hurl small balls of fire for the next few attacks. Chance to ignite enemies on fire.
Difference: All other auto attacks have a cool down for a short period of time while it is activated. The cool down expires 3/4 of the time of the active auto attack.
Focus Cost - small, each auto attack will use some focus.
Focus attack Cards - These are the heavy special power attacks. High focus cost but also high damage.
Example: Pole-Arm - Leg sweep - Knocks down all enemies around you.
Fire - Meteor - A large fire ball impacts the ground hitting all enemies. It also creates fire on the ground that does DOT.
Difference: Long cool down for the next focus attack.
Focus Cost - High.
Other cards
Other cards like healing, and debuffing would remain unaffected.

Deck system is still used, less focus needed on the hot bar.


Old Idea

Spoiler

I gathered information from the complaints I have seen on the combat system and from my own experience and decided to make this suggestion as an alternative combat system. Please read it all before commenting.

Complaints of current system:
Random cards - no strategy, can't plan for attacks.
Looking at the hot bar more then what is going on.
Auto attack - making stealth attacks hard, people can AFK grind.

Goals for this idea:
New and intuitive but also more player control.


Setup

Auto Attack:
Why there needs to be one:A left and right mouse attack system just won't fit this game, as far as i see it. You need the mouse to target items, players, and NPC's so you can't remove the courser from the combat system. Players healing others need to click on the player.
How it should work:Slot 1 on the hot bar should be an attack/defend action. It will switch the player from defence stance (No attacks will be made automatically) to attack stance (auto attacks are enabled). At the end of every fight, the player will be switched to defence stance, using a skill or pressing 1 will take them out of it if there is a mob selected.

Hot Bar:
The ~ Key is the defend/attack action. Key - will be for switching between stances. Slots 1-0 are for actions/spells. Pressing - will swap the hotbar for the stance bar, where a player can pick a different stance.
Attack mode: The player does auto attacks, and can perform actions.
Defend Mode: The player defends it self and does not attack. While in this mode focus restores at a higher rate, and damage received is reduced.
Why: More dynamic fighting, and controlled starting. If the player gets into a tight spot where they normally couldn't win/survive a different stance and defend mode might allow them to.

Skills:
Skills gain a penalty point for each time they are used, every 3 seconds(or so) a point is removed from the skill. Every point gained resets the penalty timer for that skill. There is no cool down for skills but an overall cool down for all skills each time an action is performed, like a second or so.
Why: A person can perform the same action multiple times, but if they keep performing it the defender will learn from it and it becomes less successful.

Stances:
Each stance will have its own hot bar of actions assigned to it. Similar to how decks work. Each stance gives a pro and con to actions and the player. Switching stances in battle would cost focus (about 10). A player can assign weapons to different stances as well so they can swap from a range set up to a close combat set up.
Why: Different stances are used for different combat situations.


Please post anything you might think wrong with this idea or anything to add to it.

 

I don't think you entirely understand how to setup your deck if you think there is no strategy at all....you do know about putting a skill in more then once to increase the chance of it appearing? Not to mention you know exactly what skills your character will have because you gave the skills in the deck.

 

I think the trouble is that deck construction is crucial for PVPers, but of middling importance for PVE. Designing a single system that handles both cleanly is like trying to create a combat engine that works equally well as a tournament fighter and a brawler.

 

I really dislike the frequency and thoughtlessness of this response, I see it all over the place now. "I don't like the random card system" "Well you must not understand it!" As if anyone and everyone who takes the time to UNDERSTAND the system will automatically like it.

Well, I do understand it, and I find it limiting, distracting, and that it constantly interferes with my ability to plan.

I do not prefer this system. I will not prefer it on a plane, or a train. I will not like it here or there, I will not like it in my hair. Some of us just don't like the idea, give them some space.

 

Got a chuckle from this... Very green eggs and ham. (As I'm sure you were going for.)


EDIT: Changed image.

 

Indeed, and while the protagonist of that particular tale DID in fact eventually convert, I will simply move on to some other game where my UI is not random.

 

Shame about that but the choice is yours. I wish you good travels wherever you may end up.

 

Nubelite,

Not a bad suggestion although I'm not sure it's any better. You did, however, pretty much sum up the majority of the complaints re the current system that were posted by people.

 

You do know you can use the locked glyph bar. you miss out on combos, but to me it has been worth it. I am also not a fan of the random glyph system. I find it distracting and difficult to work. I haven't been able to pull off a combo yet and I just watch the glyphs not the combat. I don't think being able to move the hot bar is the solution, it will still demand too much of my attention. While I commend the devs for trying to make something different and better, sometimes the status quo is the best solution. No matter how many times I try the random system I just can't get into it.

 

You start the game with a locked bar / traditional hot bar. While familiar, I get the impression a number of backers were hoping to move away from that (I know I for one am not a huge fan of the traditional wow like hot bar).

 

Wouldn't it be better to try and suggest an improvement to the 'locked/Dallas'-deck mode instead? If the choice between random and locked deck is meaningful but on par (read as in 'I don't want them to be the same, but I want non of them to be a better choice than the other') it would seem you could easily get what you want out of the game.

 

You write about a "new" combat system yet propose a WoW-type hotbar combat that has been done to death over the last years?

 

See, that works if the two are roughly comparable, but they aren't. To make the locked system comparable in performance to the random system, HUGE cost penalties and cooldown issues had to be introduced.

To be utterly clear, I played WoW, and did so rather skillfully, if I do flatter myself. On each of my primary two characters, I had FOUR different toolbars, with several of the major powers on macro'd buttons, that combined multiple minor functions along with the power involved. I had keybinds and alt-configs that let me access a host of powers and tactics instantly, as I had personally designed it, so the UI worked so well for me that I could pull of super-trick-combo moves, like one sees in the movies.

The locked bar in SotA is pathetic in comparison. I cannot have more than ten powers. Each has a heavy cooldown, even when fully specced into. Each has a heavy cost, even when the appropriate talents are taken fully. If I try moving while using it, even shifting my position to face a new enemy, I burst the little buff bubble that keeps my costs manageable. It's like waging war with a paper sword.

Now I KNOW that my character isn't the same heroic awesomeness that I had in WoW. But I had more control, more ease of use, and more comfort in playing than the current locked bar OR random deck offers. I am willing to see what else they will build, and I am willing to contribute to WHATEVER design comes up. It's just that as it stands, I won't be here after release.

This is my opinion, and I'm not asking for permission or approval. It's just how I see things.

 

Ahem.

 

Are you dissing fishing?

 

I read them all to my kids when they were young. It looks like you are really looking forward to fishing in SotA though.

I think we are straying a little off topic however, this thread was started by Nubelite to discuss an alternative system of combat. We should nudge it back in that direction.

 

If they changed everything anyone ever complained about, this game would never get made. Since no matter what the subject is, there's always going to be some people who don't like it.

 

Both cost and cooldown are simply figures and as such subject to the balancing process. If that's your only grudge, I personally wouldn't give up hope yet. Chris keeps working on balance, why not help him with constructive feedback and suggestions?

Maybe the character in SotA is supposed to have a more drawn out combat, removing some of these super powers you're used to?

Sorry if I came across as if you'd need my permission, that was certainly not my intention! I was simply trying to encourage positive, constructive criticism with suggestions on how to improve (which doesn't include saying blunt out make it WoW, there hopefully are other ways to achieve something to get you an equal feeling) the current locked deck mode, since I fully agree that currently balance is off and needs work.

 

I'll agree with MalakBrightpalm on at least to the point that the current system isn't ready for primetime. As it stands, the raffle system requires a brutal amount of attention, preventing you from actually seeing the results of combat. The static system is brutal enough that it represents around a 10 lvl penalty for PVP. Personally, I think a hybrid of the two would be worth a shot, throw a fixed hotbar on the bottom of the screen and let each ability charge randomly (or sequentially or synchronously with some penalty/skill) up to a maximum number of charges determined by your deck. For combos, add a semi-transparent combo "template" when "R" is pressed or an ability is dragged out if its position, creating an additional temporary UI element until the combo is used (map them to ctrl+number by default). To discharge a stack of charges instead of a single charge, you'd right click on the stack or shift+number on the keyboard.

To be clear, I doubt so much mind the randomness, as I do that managing the deck is a game unto itself which I believe draws too much attention.

 

This thread kinda got a bit carried away there. The point of it was not to complain or try to force a change, I was just summing up the issues I have seen people post about and some I experienced as well. It is just constructive criticism with an idea attached because I believe that if you don't like something then don't just spam for change but propose a solution as well. If anyone else has any ideas that would be helpful I suggest to post them not so they can be torn apart but so the community and devs can help build on them to create a wonderful game.