How good is SotA compared to ultima online?

I don't feel the 'Ultima' vibe in this game at all. Npc's have virtually zero personality and I don't care for any of them.
I don't feel the UO vibe either. (I played Trammel exclusively for 5 years so don't even assume I'm talking about ffa pvp)

My sentiment atm is one of extreme disillusion.
Why do I need to be a super hard-core warrior to harvest? There is no harvesting/gathering in this game without fighting through endless mobs.
Why does crafting cost a gazillion gold which can only be obtained by... killing stuff? There is no way for a crafter to make a living with his craft.
Why does everything act like I have a big target slapped on my forehead as soon as I enter a scene? There is no exploring/adventuring in this game without fighting through endless mobs.
Why are npc's so ignorant? Talk to them about a neighbouring city and they act as if I'm talking gibberish.
Why are some map areas blocked by 5 skull scenes? Noobs aren't be allowed to visit Port Graff for example?
Why is there no skill cap? So that people keep on playing? UO surely didn't need that incentive.
Ugh...

 

I don't say sota is bad. But one thing is sure its really far away from uo.

- No skill cap
- Paywall for housing ( but no subscription on the other side )
- no pvp ( or really low number of pvp player , and no full loot )
- xp farming for raising your skill
- lot more instance ( most main quest dungeon are solo only)
-no boat , no horse
- really different combat system
- You can't play as a crafter only , you gonna have to raise adventurer if you want to gather ressource and got gold for some reg required for crafting ( like coal).
- ressource gathering feel more like world of warcraft than uo.

The only thing i see that remind me ultima online is the ''roleplay potential'' and the deep housing system.

Those are really 2 different game.,

 

My buddies tested for UO when people still payed people to do things like QA they got me into it started when it launched. Started in Britt had to figure out how things worked equiped my starting dagger smashed a rabbit in the face with my dagger skinned it ran farther into the east Britt forest got killed by 7 pks. Instantly fell in love with the game.

Sota never even come's close to even this most basic of experiences. Every system in Uo was superior other than that 11 and 56k modems and the isometric 2d graphics.

 

I beta tested UO and played if for the first few years (until ~2000), left and came back a few short times.

I loved UO and played it a lot. I have not been playing SOTA non stop for 10+ months and I still enjoy it.

People for some reason view UO with rose colored glass's. The game was actually fundamentally flawed and almost failed in the first 6 months with probably 75% of its user base was run off by red murders. This is a psychological thing, it was many peoples first MMO when they were young so they are sentimental. Its like your first car in college, you absolutely love it to this day right (even though you know it was probably a cheap tuurd)?

SOTA is already doing just about everything better.

I played all the Ultimas as a kid starting with 3. I sure feel that it is more "Ultima" then "UO".

 

All of that is hyperbole unless you provide examples. I'll show you what i mean. "All of these people that love SoTA just have rose colored glasses on, the game is fundamentally flawed and they are so enamored with the dev's and the promise of a great game they can't see how linear unfinished and grindy it is."

1. Risk vs Reward > UO pre-tram "Heart pounding and intense" || SoTA "Optional and basically non existent".

2.Harvesting > UO "Encumbrance and time investment reward felt balanced" || "I've gone to farm and literally just logged it was that tedious".

3.Crafting > UO "You felt great when you got that first GM" || SoTA "You felt great when you got that first GM".
^ Major differences in this one though that need to be elaborated upon. In UO you could be a crafter and a self made one at that. SoTA basically requires a guild or a group of people force feeding you materials to ever reach the upper tiers of it. In UO you could build your exceptional gear and hawk it at the local smith shop people gathered at for repairs and socializing. In SoTA you just have x billion of +5 what ever that had to be grinded on to reach GM so you can make actual good stuff for your guild / friends. In UO if you had a vendor to Hawk your wares at you were doing grrrrreat. In SoTA you need to LOL and throw money at pay walls. (And by Gm for SoTA i am clearly talking about the ridiculous mastery system not an actual gm.)

4.PvE > UO "Amazing enemies and locals, the first time you try to face tank a Balron on your MIGHTY WARRIOR splat welcome to being a ghost".
SoTA"I have no clue this game literally has the worst AI i have ever seen its almost like they just use the built in Unity LookAt(); function.".

5.Pvp > UO wins this one hands down but i know SoTA is not a finished product yet and that many checks and balances still need to be done... if they get done.

6.Overall Experience > I played UO off and on and did upkeep on my vendors for pretty near 11 consecutive years. I can still log on ICQ and talk to some very hardcore in love i will play UO till i die people to this day.

I played SoTA for over 300 hours it was a grueling grindy 300 hours, is there potential there absolutely. Can SoTA succeed, yes it can
financially as a kickstarter game it already is a success. As a game though i am not sold i have played game jam games that have better responsiveness
and enjoyable playability. (In case your not into game jams or programming they are games that are made in less than 24 hours with 0 budget by passionate people that really love programming and game creation.)

And on a side note just let me say this to you. I respect you i respect your opinion and i respect your love and enjoyment and admiration of the game. I as well love RPG's i always have i probably always will. I am not trying to belittle you or anything truly, just i see too much of what you just did in your post on these forums trying to censor and discourage any negative feedback about the game. As a super programming and development master wizard when someone comes to me and respectfully says > "Hey, this feature in your program or game is really not working so hot you probably should fix it" > I don't curl up into a ball and cry or ask people that like my work to battle my enemies. I say "Hey, lets take a look at it. Yep you were right AI is bad I better get after that thank you for your input.".

And that is what will help this game start to grow in more positive ways, positive negative feedback. The game has made strides in housing and graphics and load times and desync which are all good things. There are a lot of ways it hasn't grown though since like R8. Be objective and i do see your side of it i want SoTA to be the best it can be as well.

 

Your examples are opinion, I disagree with most of your points, you mention being objective after that post.

I think you may be blinded by sentimentalism.

I beta tested UO, at this point 6 months before release it could take you 5 minutes at times to take 1 step. the thing crashed and dumped ever 5 minutes. I remember one time they were clearly plying with reagent respawn and messed it up to the point that there was a good 1000 of them on one screen. It was a sloppy mess. You logged into the game (even after release) and most noobs just stood around the bank (having their stuff stolen) because they had absolutely no idea what to do, couldn't make money with no cloths and a dagger and when they did leave, they were immediately PK'ed. The first year of UO was a brutal experience.


I believe I am having funner in SOTA in 6 of your points then I did in UO.

 

I agree,
most of us has a sentiment to UO and Ultima, but I haven't seen nothing better since late 90s.

 

Again I say, i have respect for you're opinion. But you're using conjecture and hyperbole style arguments. I have played both games extensively and i am basing my opinions on that. I try and be as unbiased as i can be even when dealing with matters that pertain to myself. So if you make some valid points i will have no issue saying "You're correct, good points you've changed my mind.".

 

I love UO most of us do.....

I like Sota been here since Kickstarter. I have spent a lot more on Sota than i ever did in UO. And that includes 18 years of monthly payments.


2 different games UO is freedom in everything and its a MMO the first and the best of all.

Sota beside being still Under construction No endgame or Pvp(good at least) yet. Is a game with a lot of restrictions. And this is a MMO and it isnt.... hard to explain. But you will never see 200 guys in the same screen not because they are not playing right there is just that you wont.

So hard to compare but no this is not UO2.

Its the beginning of a good game named SOTA

 

You keep saying "conjecture and hyperbole style arguments". Aren't you doing the same thing? I just read your post again, 1-6... yup. I guess thats a neener neener neener?

Besides the fact that the thread I posted tells you *exactly* what happened in UO beta. Im really not sure how you can claim "conjecture and hyperbole"

This may of may not look familiar to you, but you are pulling a:

 

My opinion hasn't changed.

 

The uobeta was a sh!tshow, but oh so fun. I remember trying to make 1 piece of armor at the minoc forge and it was literally like the 405 @ 5:00 on a Friday. It took an hour+ just REACH the forge. But here we are comparing the pre-released version of SOTA and the pre-released version of UO.

I believe this as well!

 

The other thing is, this game isnt finished yet.. so, while they have been good about handing out the directions etc, the actual honest finished item.. we dont have so, right now, no we dont have horses, and crafting is a PITA.. will it always be this way? probably not.

 

The game you have now is the game they made. It's not pre-alpha its not beta its gone persistent. The reason they say well you know were not really ever going to call the game "released" or "that really doesn't fit the development model of the current game to call it released." is because they know it does not stand up to the standards of a lot of other games in the category and many of these "indie titles" had a fraction of Shrouds budget to work with.

 

Nailed it.

SoTa is on the right path. if your largest complaint is story or npc atm, then your in luck! 6 major patchs before they consider releasing the game! then.. get this.. months to years of more tweaks and additons!

 

There is a very good reason for this, i was raised to show people courtesy and respect even when i do not agree with them or do not believe what they are saying. The reason i didn't rebut your statements is because i didn't want to call you and exaggerating liar, but you clearly have not had enough of facts vs fictions.

1."At this point 6 months before release it could take you 5 minutes at times to take 1 step. the thing crashed and dumped ever 5 minutes".
Your right, the game in beta had major issues 11k and 56k modems and a dev team that was basically pioneering this brand of online gaming its to be
expected. Did it have these issues though 3 years after being accessible to the general public ? No, no it did not.

2."I remember one time they were clearly plying with reagent respawn and messed it up to the point that there was a good 1000 of them on one screen. It was a sloppy mess." You are correct this was an issue i remember it well this wasn't in beta though and it was patched and fixed as soon as possible.

3."You logged into the game (even after release) and most noobs just stood around the bank (having their stuff stolen) because they had absolutely no idea what to do, couldn't make money with no cloths and a dagger and when they did leave, they were immediately PK'ed. The first year of UO was a brutal experience."
Your right pk's and thieves were rampant but you might remember this little macro if you even played UO much at all let alone beta tested for it. "Guards! Bank! Vendor! Buy!." There were many very helpful guilds and community members and people that would take you under their wings. It's how i learned and it's how many many people learned and grew a community up from a very very very small thing into a game that has been going for nearly 20 years. If things had gone down in the way you seem too think they have gone down with UO in your imagination i agree the game probably would have crashed and burnt. And its ironic and fitting that you would link something about straw man fallacies. Do your own thinking i am well aware of my own opinions try forming some of your own based on critical thinking.

I could literally sit here and list a plethora of bugs and broken game play mechanics in Shroud but i have so little interest in the lack of progress its made i no longer even have it installed.

 

How can you call it persistent when for example, theres a new release planned for tomorrow, changing a number of things, when work is actively being made to complete and work on the game? I only got here at the end or R33, and Ive seen plenty of change already, I see a game with a lot of potential, a lot of work gone in it. Is there room to fix and improve? sure,. but then they dont claim to have finished it either..

 

No. the reason they don't call it released is because the features and promises made during Kickstarter are not complete. By their own words "Release is when we have completed the promises we made during Kickstarter."
You may presume whatever nefarious reasons you like but I defer authority to the Devs who have consistently demonstrated integrity and truthfulness.

To the topic at hand. I played UO for years, beginning a few months after release. I've played SotA every release from the chicken room forward. I'm not falling for the fool's errand of comparing the details of a fully developed game to an incomplete one. I will compare concepts.

- SotA's instances are dynamic, allowing rapid changes to scenes. UO's map details did not change.

- UO's "Risk vs Reward" was nothing of the sort for me, a non-PvPer. It was meaningless sacrifice. I spend a good deal of my newbie life terrified to walk the open roads. SotA allows me to choose when and where I wish to experience PvP risk.

- Reputation in SotA will be carried across all characters. UO characters were separate, allowing someone to be a jerk one day and a nice guy the next.

- Both UO and SotA present a rich immersive world where trivialities (like placing and eating food) are integral to the world.

- Skills in SotA decay so must be maintained. Skills levels in UO remained whether used or not. The result is that in SotA, 1 char or 5 chars, the effort to acquire and maintain skills remains the same. There is no advantage to building and playing multiple characters. In UO one could GM as many characters as wanted.

- SotA has a deep and meaningful storyline. UO had no story to speak of.

- Both SotA and UO attract many roleplayers. The depth of player stories are similar.

- The difference in development methods from SotA to UO could not be greater. We know whats coming in SotA and can watch it develop iteration by iteration. New features are released each month. UO built things behind closed doors then dumped it all at once, often for a price.

 

Clearly... now we are stuck with your insistent negativity (probably defined as trolling judging by how you are so quick to attack people).

You probably are not well suited for beta testing games if you dump a game in the middle of its heaviest development process saying such things.

Id suggest you check back in after release (and probably the first real service pack one), things should be a lot different by then bud. If you still have complaints about the game after its actually released, then I'll give you a little credit, but at the same time I will blame you for it. This is your opportunity in beta/alpha to be constructive to the devs on things you want fixed and all you want to do is troll extreme negativity about issues that everyone knows exist... because the game is still being built.

 

Good job exhuming this thread.

For the record, I like SotA, even in its unfinished state, much more than UO.