2 Big Picture Questions

Folks that hit 85 in the first month exploited a bug to earn far more XP per hour than can be achieved these days.

 

"I dont want to blame or accuse people, please play as you like, but if we think of more people would be able to partake in competetive content of the game, wouldnt that be good?"

Yes, this is why I made the suggestion of having pvp zones that have a level cap.

"Why reduce competability in any case to the ability of time investmemt?"

That's how mmo's are. You don't just start the game and start killing dragons, you have to work your way up there.

"It would be more interesting in all cases to have a wider playerbase competing with everybody , or am i wrong on that?"

I think it would be more interesting to have cooperation over competition. There already is a constant competition, not just in the game, but is so many aspect of life. Sadly it is this competition that drives people into ego insanity. Ever see a friend buy a bigger tv then someone else just because they need to have the bigger one?

"Wouldn't it be cool and more challenging to have a lot of casualgamers who are willing to compete in crafting, selling and pvp to be part of it?"

They can, I don't know why you are not able to see that.

"But they cannot because they haven't the time to become competetive?"



If they don't have any time to play, what are they selling? You see how it does require effort? Mind you, they can just buy stuff from the add on store to sell, and many do, so right there, they dont even have to play to sell things. For crafting, what do you want? You want everyone to be making top end gear with no effort required?

"Why have Moontree then? For the dex and a magic resistance buff ?"

Stealth, nightstep and now fireflies and meteor storm. Moon is more of a add on magic school then it is a main skill magic. It would need more damage skills to become a main skill magic.

"Why have Polearms if blades are better in any case."

Blade deal more damage but have absolutely no cc, and in comparison to polearms, can be blocked with a shield. Ever see a blade guy chase an archer half way around the map, while the polearm guy can skewer them. Seen some people do really well with polearms in pvp and pve.

"Sure there are exceptions, but do you disagree that this is the most effective method to grind mobs?"

It depends on the mobs you are fighting. Honestly though, you cant expect the knife wielding maniac to have the same chance as the gun toting psycopath can you? Do you use a spoon to open mail, or a knife? There comes a time where you need to use your brain and find the efficient method to do things.

 

Not everyone who is high level exploited. Once you could aoe deep ravenswood, before raavenswood got changed, you could make 600k an hour. You can still make good exp with aoe build in deep ravenswood. And lets not forget, many of these people were playing over 12 hours a day, like me. Level 80 is like 16 mil exp I think, so it not really that hard when you know where to go, and in what way you want to build your character to achieve these levels.

 

fotm + grind = win = yeah or meh

 

You have to expect to put in some effort. You can't expect to do nothing and have it all. When you get a job, do you expect the same pay from putting 1 hour a week of really slow, crappy work as someone who works 50 hours a week doing high quality work? Whatever, I am done with this conversation, success being able to see thing from another's perspective as well as your own is completely lost here. You just want it all, but don't want to work for it, sorry but that is just not how things work on this game, nor how it works in life.

 

@Vas Corp Por once explained me why not - AoC was a good example for that this doesnt work well because of gear.

This sounds like: This is how Hooligans, Thiefs, Murderers... are... i dislike it for ... wait... ever

agree - cooperate but lplease don't pull or push me - sort of hunt the head and craft the trophy or buy it at the vendor

ok - agree, i do as well good with my build - at least i want to believe it

thats true - i stay a mage, things i cannot do i dont do and i dont want them to do - like tanking a dragon or a troll for example.
And to me it would be more authentic and interesting groupplay if tanks would tank dragons and not the Master of Everything who can Tank, heal and deal the damage to kill it solo.
But this is just what i would prefer.

 

thats black and white - no one is talking about doing nothing and want it all.
Measures, Balance.

A Nurse earns 1600 Euro/ month, a Manager earns maxbe 16.000 Euro/ Month - Balance? No!!!

 

Yeah, you might want to rethink any analogy starting that way... Last I checked SotA hasn't started cutting me a paycheck, until then can we please avoid turning this game into a job.

 

Mac, I see your point about effort and time = results. Got it. But go back to the point you made about the right build and the halberd vs the sword. That is what needs to be fixed not by nerfing one but by enhancing the other to the point where time+effort = results regardless of your build. Only skill and time invested should give the top results.

 

Sword has no crowd control at all, and can be blocked by shield, but does top dps. Polearms has a knockdown, and a root for cc, cannot be blocked by shields, but does not do top dps. Bludgeon has a stun, knockdown, and knockback, can be blocked by shields, but does not do top dps. You get a trade off of dps for cc and blockablity. Do you think its fair to have the same dps on weapons that have cc abilities to do the same dps as a weapons that do not have cc abilities? I do not use polearms so I cannot say for sure whats its dps is like. I did hear that polearms was getting a buff so maybe it is so much lower that it does need a buff. But I do not think it should do the same dps as a sword, and have cc abilities, and be unblockable.

 

Mac, That was not the point I was trying to make. I understand all those melee skills have their particular strenght and weakness. The point is more about buffing vs nerfing skills to make all builds viable to the point where skill is the overriding factor.

 

Well, if one seems way underpowered, I would say buff, but of one seems to powerful, then it might need a nerf. Like many things, there are variables, not one simple answer to complex questions.

 

No, but when i get a job and do my work i would like to have a reward what makes me satisified living, no matter what job that is!
And if it comes about competition in this game - playerdriven Eco, PvP Areas to have fun, yes i like PvP - then i should be able to get to that point and be competetive without putting 12hrs a day grinding and cherrypicking skills

If you and these people are the measure what it is needing to be competetive in the game?
Then have fun competing among each other and dont wait for a lot of more people playing in that liga.
Dont expect a lot of more players willing to accept that a small "elite" (the bad word again) make it worse to the majority who also want to compete, but on a modest level.
this attitude is bad for the game and bad for the community. May there actually the majority fine with all this, but where are the growing numbers?
Where are the new players, although we had already 2 free trials and the 3rd running?
Where are the players accepting this measures, not to speak for the prices in the addon store.
Maybe you consider that the hardcore grind and the gap between players prevent players to begin with the game?
Please play 12 hrs a day, thats not what i want you hold on from. But maybe cap some total GM what can be get or maybeadd some diminishing returns about xp per hour so that you earn 1hr 100% , for the 2nd 80%, for the 3rd 60% of the XP so that its not about min max grinding XP, but gameplay and sorry to repeat that over and over roleplay a roleplay game?

suggestion - if it needs 5000 hrs to be somewhat ready to be competetive in this game (i know its less, but just lets take your numbers) than that would mean, i am competetive in 5 years, because i put less than 1000hrs into the game since persistance and not 1hr.
I dont ask for doing nothing and be competetive, i ask for "normal" measures for normal players who have a job, and a family and maybe some other interests but only gaming - normal people you know - not people who can play and play 12-16hrs a day.
You can and you want that? Fine i am in no way against that. I already wrote if you can manage to play 25hrs a day do it
But then please have diminishing returns on investet time, to match ALL PLAYERS and make everybody competetive in a moderate amount of time, maybe a year. You will then be ready in less than 3 month what others need a year for, but then this it was and not unreachable, because you drive it further and further.
Its not against you in the end, its for the game and for a moderate and healthy economy, pvp and community.
Or are you that guy having fun put down others, because you have the time and the power to do it?
The Distribution of Power need to be balanced and all content, also competetive need to be more or less available to everybody in a reasonable amount of time and "work".
12hrs a day its not!

 

Allow me to channel my inner @Berek and suggest that with posts like a certain someone's here that are full of personal attacks and hostility, that you simply report them and ignore them in order to keep the thread on topic.

No need to engage with it as that will only result in the thread being locked.

 

Hi,

My thoughts on death penalty and skill cap:

One of my favourite game was Tibia, which I played for for 16 years. What I liked about this game was the death penalty (sounds strange heh?). The higher lvl you where, the bigger was the penalty, it was a constant % of ur total exp that you lost (also on your skills). I remember dying and had to play 2 weeks of grinding a few hours everyday to take it back. The game had no skill cap, but you needed more exp for every level/skill level you took, so at the end it was merely impossible to atleast level skills up anymore, taking levels tho was never impossible, it just took a longer time each level you took. In pvp the balance where fine, because there where not that many people who could actually get to those insane high levels (which could take years) and they could still be owned if they sucked as a player. But I never heard anyone whine that it was unfair they where higher level, in fact it was the other way around, they deserved that high level because they fought really hard to get there!

These unlimited advancement made Tibia a great game, what ever you did, you always advanced and I tend to see a lack in many new games when it comes to this and the whine about everything having to be perfectly balanced for pvp or people saying they would never catch up where the people that never stayed long, the others grouped up instead to take out the stronger player, making the world very interesting.

Just my 2 cents.

Best Regards
Glopton

 

I do not think this is a good thing.

Some people like me can only play an hour or two each night, so two weeks of grinding (grinding was supposed to me minimal in this game according to RG by the way) a couple hours a day seems like a net loss.

 

It was a risk vs reward getting that high level it "hurted" so much to die. Not saying it need to be that drastic in Sota tho.

 

I do understand. I think that kind of game would be or could be awesome. I just do not have time to catch up for 2 weeks to be where I was 2 weeks before that lol. If I was retired or jobless I would probably love that but its not the case here. Do you have a link to the game, I never heard of it, or I guess I could do a google search haha!

 

All I am saying is, asking the game to be built around your playstyle, and to nerf the playstyle of others, is a selfish way to think. Everyone paid for the game, everyone has a right to play they want. If someone wants to play a ton, that is their right, if someone wants to play a little that is their right, but to ask for things like, after the first hour, only 80%, second hour 60% exp gains, Why am I going to be penalized for playing more. I don't go asking for 20% exp increase every hour because they way I play would benefit from it.

 

If you play a lot, you're still going to be much richer and ultimately have more/better equipment than a player who plays casually. Nothing is going to change that. Ideally, time played should play a factor in how fast one gets to the estimated end power level of an avatar. What some people are suggesting is that it shouldn't be the only factor.

If there was a way to cap progression through skills, that'll allow for an upper limit of power between characters. Limiting the effect pure game time has on content. Whether this is through the use of the skill caps (limiting the total number of skill points available) like in Ultima online or SWG.

An alternative to this skill cap, is by only selecting a fixed number of actives which is what we're currently doing via skill hot bar. However, I think that this selection should also extend to selecting a number of fixed passives that will affect your current deck.

That way, players who play a lot still has the advantage of flexibility by being able to swap active and passive skills to create certain Decks and "builds" consisting of a maximum number of active and passive skills (and their resultant attunements). Casual players might be able to make 1 good deck, while players with a lot of time will have a number of different good decks they can swap around.

There are already systems in place that are supposed to help with this (skill death decay, XP curve benefiting lower level gains more than high levels) but there are still players who feel (whether warranted or not I don't know ) that these systems put in place aren't as effective in bridging the inequality. Which is why the OP suggested in his 2nd point about combat.