Clearly losing to greens was overpowered...

Seriously, I was already getting my ass kicked by green archers regularly, now it happens about 4 times as fast. As predicted, as light armor melee, I now have basically no protection from archers. The one change that's supposed to be in here that MIGHT have helped a little, the AI change to make them not run as much, is completely AWOL.

It's questionable how much I'll be bothering with this release.

 

Once you reach a certain adventure level everything will be green (or most things) It doesnt mean they are no longer dangerous. Its more of a reflection to hit/miss/dodge/avoid

 

@Chris I know that you fixed a bug with archer critical hits which were too low on the first release build. Lastly, I saw screenshots of unusually high crits from archer players on the last build.
As the NPC probably use the same rules as us, maybe there is a small chance that archer crits are too high now.

 

Once you get to that point, your skills are high enough to make a pile of green mobs an interesting fight... until then, you're being murdered by what the system calls "something you should be able to handle".

It's all based on your adventure level and what level the RIGHT skills are. In order to get those up, you need XP and you need to do that on the easiest enemies you can find... aka: GREEN.

 

You're missing the point. These changes were, allegedly, supposed to make archers LESS OP, but they went from being a large problem to being an insurmountable problem. I went from being, while not being great against the exact same (green!) archers in the same area, at least able to hold my own, to not lasting 30 seconds.

All they did was nerf ME into the ground, and archers are just as OP as ever (more OP, relatively speaking). This happened because the problems with archers AREN'T how overpowered light armor is (light armor isn't remotely op). Archers aren't actually using their light armor abilities most of the time, because they're continuously kiting. I'm not even talking about PvPers, that's the NPCs!

If archers are OP, nerf archery, not a tangentially related skill.

 

So you are melee
wearing light armor
and getting wrecked...

That is weird.

 

That WASN'T happening before. I wasn't completely ripping things up one side and down the other; it was usable but challanging and pretty fun. Now it's not. If the goal of this change was to completely eliminate a potential loadout: congratulation, there's now one less build that went from at least somewhat viable to completely unusable.

If Port thinks archers need nerfed, NERF THE ARCHERY ABILITIES. Don't screw the ONLY ability in light armor that gives you a DEFENCE AGAINST archery. Hell, they could have changed ANY of the OTHER abilities in light armor, and it would have affected being attacked by melee, but not archery, but they choose the ONE that that gave an archery defence.

 

Pvp :To All guys who think that archers are op. Try to shoot to fighter in plate... my best charged hit to a mob near 380, my best charget hit to a guy who was 20 levels less than i, was 85... it was crit btw. You wouldnt get reasonable ammount of crits if target is under fortify defence. So usual charget shots will make 30-50dmg VERY OP.
Pve: archer in leather is most hard to play class, every lag will kill you if you are involved in high level pve you cant tank as fighters and your healing not so good as mage, its is just endless running with half of the deck fulfiled with lightarmor tree. I have really great armor and weapon (3x3-3x4) and 7 obsidian wolf can kill me easily if I wouldnot be care. My friend in plate with same level can go smoke and wolfes would not kill him. Yesterday i get a shot from 600 hp green archer for 240 hp btw.
P.s. Also I'm pretty sure that rapid fire was nerfed this release i saw significant diference in dmg of rf against daemon today and in r43, around 30-40%... (i see it after critfix in r44)
P.s.s Yes bone armor could help but bonearmor with exact properties 3x3 is extremely hard to obtain.
P.s.s.s So when you say that archers are op pls add imho becouse there are way to make both npc or player archers not a problem at all.
P.s.s.s.s sorry if understand this topic about archers wrong.

 

Except for dodge.

 

By "Rend and other skills ..." I assume you're talking about anyting that is a dot, even spell dots?

 

You think archer in leather is hard? Try melee in leather.

Remember: you can kite, melee can't.

 

If you use leather in melee, you should try to use offhand or shield. It's a good way to get protected while using light armors skills. Light armor is ok for speed, not for protection. Melee rarely need speed, but need a lot of protection. That said, offhand and shield are here to compensate.

Thank you Chris for the answer. It was just a guess.

 

I won't say it's a nerf because maybe it wasn't intended but I share your feeling on this. My rapid fire is doing something like half the damage it did once.

 

There is epic video from Vallo Frostbane daggers + cotton armor i think but not sure. Sure something like this works great in PVE too.

Maybe be it just broken. I`m not a fan of rapidfire so I can live with it

 

You're talking to a guy who melee blade with light armour and using a shield as an offhand.

... it's far from "fine".

When is the bug for [Evasion] and [Dodge] being removed before the timer runs out going to be looked at? I've reported it several times already and i don't think it's being noted. Re-applying it at every hit or so is draining on my Focus.

 

Maybe @Chris could answer this (please)?

 

I don't see any mention of a shield in his posts so, I couldn't know.

Listen, I learned to use dual wielded swords with leather armor in this game (founder gear to be completely honest). I can't say I didn't die here and there but I didn't feel any difficulty with it. For many situations, it was even more efficient than bow. All of this is about personal perception : If he think it's not "fine", he should try heavy armor. He's free to do so. I had to make this reminder as he seemed to complain about leather armor not being "protective" for melee fighters. Of course it's not. When you use leather, you has to chose how to engage your opponents. Often right in the back and swiftly if they are harmful. You has to parry and to dodge when you are in the middle of the melee (as for shields, they allow to block... arrows).

Now, I can't say that he don't make a point about the archers behaviour and the dodge change. But that's something that has to be tested for days, at least.

 

I use dual swords. This is why, no matter how you look at it, I have to take an entire new tree (either heavy or shield or just give in and be an Archer) and a bunch of my skills are now worthless (either all of light armor, or the offhand abilities in the tactics tree and/or the entire blades tree). I've been running (essentially) this build since before persistence. My complaint isn't that I should be able to take anything in the game. I know a lot of people that hit a lot harder, and are a lot less squishy at the same level. I haven't much cared, because as far as I'm concerned, I'm not competing with them. What I have liked is that it's been challenging the whole time. I'm good with that, I was really in a good place balancing the excitement of being on the verge of death most of a fight with actually being able to pull it off at least as often as not. That was fun. This change puts me well outside of that, and as character over Adv Level 80, having to try and gut my build, unlearn a host of skills (which I can't completely do), and pick-up entire new trees trees just to make myself part of the three standard meta builds, rather than a build few use, is depressing. Do you really think limiting the viable builds is good for the game?

Ostensibly this change was suppose to give melee more of a chance. The reality is, I'm just as strong against other melee as ever. What it's made me weaker against is specifically archers. This change does not do what it was supposed to do and limits variety of viable builds (which I would say is VERY bad for a supposedly classless system).

 

So I'm confused. I thought the change to dodge was basically something can't dodge a hit from behind it. Did I miss something when it comes to arrows? Are arrows no longer dodge-able now?

What I can say is you can get sufficient avoidance with light armor if you run Shield of Ice and Fortify Defense along with the *off-brand* glancing blow you have in light armor. Let's be realistic here, you're running a squish setup, you need proper defensive skills to make that work. Takes 180k experience to get each of the skills I mentioned up to 80. That's extremely doable and if you're still having problems after that... well... at some point what one considers a "viable build" has to come to grips with reality.