Obsidian Trials - Revitalization

Discussion in 'PvP Gameplay' started by Fruck, Sep 12, 2018.

  1. Fruck

    Fruck Avatar

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    I will preface this with I love the Obsidian Trials (OT), the map is fantastic and the work put in by many shows. The only major problem with it is, well, no one goes there anymore. Well, not exactly no one - some guilds farm it and people with multiple accounts. I stop by the zone very often and its always empty, this prompted me to make this post and give my opinion on what happened and how to help.

    Why is it empty?
    • There is very little to no reward for most players. The kill coins are essentially useless besides some potions usable only in PvP zones. The good stuff comes from medallions which only comes from winning a trial with 5+ people. This is very hard to do and I would even say near impossible for the casual player.
    • There is cost to the trial but no tangible benefit. Durability gets hit and regs/pots get consumed and you get no loot, no good, no XP for your troubles. Sure its a lot of fun, but I think fun is relative if all you do is die a lot and get nothing in return.
    What can help?
    • Daily Quest similar to Sieges - Let players trade in 5 kill coins daily for 50k XP, 1000gp and 1 medallion. This is not a lot and I intentionally made it very low as to not piss people off. I think it should be higher considering the time investment versus just going and doing PvE. The things people really want from the trials take medallions and there needs to be another way to get them.
    • A queuing system - I understand this is much harder to implement but would help immensely. If I could use a function similar to group finder that when 5 people join I get a pop up to teleport in I think we would see a lot more people in there. At least Id probably see the same 5 people in there I always saw before hehe.
    I just want to try to kickstart OT back up, its a great fun thing to do for me and many and we need to encourage others to try it out on a regular basis. I believe in order to do that we need to increase the rewards for participation in general.
     
  2. Roycestein Kaelstrom

    Roycestein Kaelstrom Avatar

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    If I could quickly jump into the game like Fortnite, I would be more willing to spend more time participating in it. Right now having to wait in the wait room just suck most of my free time that could be put into something else.
     
  3. 2112Starman

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    I went in the trials the first day they opened and all the time ever since and not seen a single person. All the PvP'ers are now truly gone from this game.
     
  4. kaeshiva

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    I'm not really a PvPer - but I did have a load of fun playing around at the trials when they opened it up, even if the wall of poison is an evil menace.
    I'd absolutely do it more often
    .....if I could actually make meaningful progress toward a goal, which at the moment, it does not do.

    I think linking the cosmetic unlockable stuff to "winning the whole thing" is a mistake, though.
    People who aren't really into pvp or who aren't good at it aren't incentivized if there's no way to work their way up to the cool stuff.
    Like, if I could go to obsidian trial, maybe kill a couple folks but ultimately lose, but get 2 coins closer to something I want - fair enough, I'll go do it.
    Requiring me to win the whole match? Might happen? If the poison doesn't get me? But not often.
    Atm, going to the trials feels like just lining oneself up to be "fodder" for other people to meet the min. participation limit to get cool rewards. Thanks, but no thanks.

    I do like the idea of the pvp currency, but having the only desirable items linked to "top winner" doesn't give anyone else any reason to go.
    I accept the fact that as a non-pvp player I'm never gonna "win" the thing - and that's absolutely fine by me. But if you want me to even go poke it, theree needs to be some worthwhile reason for me to do so. Potions/consumables/etc. do nothing to entice me.

    I would suggest:

    Take everything that's on there now and make it buyable for the coins. The top reward can be expensive, and should be. But I don't think you'll hold anyone's attention span past 500 kills. A weaker or lower level or less skilled player MIGHT get a kill every so often, could still work toward this over weeks/months and has a reason to actually go there. They have no reason to go currently with the 'only winners get things everyone else just helps them do it' system.
    Come up with a value on how many coins a medallion is worth and allow it to be traded in -(winners still get more.) But gating all of the reward behind "best of the best" means anyone who isn't "good" has no reason to even bother. Other games have done this sort of 'pvp minigame' thing but added objectives that must be completed within the scene, done incrementally over days/weeks/months, in order to eventually get rewards. These minigames were always full of people - the rewards were enticing but you didn't have to be a stealth-ganker to access them (although, that was one viable way of course). Fruck's suggestions above are spot on.

    Add some coins in there scattered around in there, that you can pick up, but it unstealths you to do so (ie like getting a node).
    One of the big frustrations in there when I went, is I'd run around and see nobody at all, everyone's hiding waiting. When I did see someone, I spent 95% of my time chasing them as the poison walls got closer and closer. By time we actually started to get a couple good fights happening, its was pretty much down to 2 mins and I didn't see the wall coming from behind me and splat. Having coins (or a metal to smith the coins, even) to gather in there would both a) allow people who aren't as good at pvp who still want to come play something to do in there, and b) unstealth those people potentially making them yummy targets while they're fiddling about.

    I know this is meant to be a 'last man standing' thing and I don't want to de-value the glory of being the ultimate winner - but if the person who can mop the floor with everyone is the only one who gets anything out of being there, then why -should- anyone else come simply to be mopped?

    I don't particularly see the need to add an xp/gold reward component to this if the coin rewards are made more accessible but the values Fruck suggests as a once-per-day turnin would probably get me there once a day. But if nobody else is there when I have time to go, then its just a wasted trip.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2018
  5. Spungwa

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    I agree with a lower reward for participation.

    Archage had this, there was scheduled PvP events that you got a reward of a token for participating and being on the losing side and more tokens if you participated on the winning side (was group up to 100 vs 100 combat). Was actually about goals rather than just killing.

    This token was used to level up a necklace that was best in slot (once levelled high enough). So if you wanted to level that slot item you did the event as you had nothing to lose and at least a small gain.

    If only the winners get reward they will have no one to fight, so it does not help either side.


    Regards
    Spung
     
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  6. CatweazleX

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    You can use the skull coins to repair your stuff.
    It would be good when one is able to buy a medallion with skull coins. May 50 skull coins = medallion.

    But:
    Make the things you can get with medallions meaningless.

    So, go in there if you want to have fun or some training...


    There is also an option to add some unique _and_ valuable loot to the PvP zones.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2018
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  7. kaeshiva

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    50 skull coins = 1 medallion at the current price of rewards in there, it remains completely pointless to go unless you are the overall winner, which by definition, only a few people can be.
    I'm ok with it taking a few weeks/months to earn something cool but pricing the rewards completely out of reach results in exactly what we're seeing now: nobody bothers.
     
  8. xadoor

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    Obsidian trials is just more of Portalarium trying to tell us how to play. PvP is DEAD DEAD DEAD. EVERY penny they spend trying to change that is WASTED WASTED WASTED. 9/10 times I go into a PvP zone to farm stuff I don't see another sole(and I don't want to).

    How about some group content(and I don't mean hard solo content)? variable loot to hunt for(like diablo)? jut new loot? reasons to progress crafting past 100? find waldo world events? *knock* *knock* this thing on?
     
  9. Lars vonDrachental

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    Just want to add some ideas as I guess @Fruck could be right.

    I think some daily quests like “kill 5 avatars” would be nice too.

    Maybe the stronger avatars need some appeal. For example before joining you can choose to make the match harder for yourself by accepting a challenge. E.g. you have just 50% health but get 50% more coins

    Maybe there could be also some kind of trial-system. E.g. a set of monthly changing task (kill 100 avatars, accept a challenge and still win a match, …) and if you are able to fulfill all task within the timeframe you to get a reward.
    Maybe even divided into 3 difficulty categories you can choose from at your first visit in a month. The chopper trial is the most simple one with the least number of tasks (e.g. 5 tasks like “kill 10 avatars”) but also the least rewarding one, silver trial is more difficult and has more tasks (e.g. 10 tasks like “kill 100 avatars”) but more rewarding than the chopper one and finally the golden trial is the most difficult one with the most tasks (e.g. 20 tasks like “kill 1000 avatars”) and the highest reward.
     
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  10. Arkah EMPstrike

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    I like that but for that suggestion in particular you would have to make the same kinda limitations on earning coins that the medallions have.

    It would also open the door for people with lots of accounts to earn 2 medallions per map \o/

    So i would add that overall winner no longer get a medallion. Just award skullcoins for kills. If you cant beat the alt swarm just level the field instead
     
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  11. Gaelis

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    I think it might help to have a range where it is worth to kill or not. ( maybe even penaltys if you do so unless the lower person attacks first )
    So you get good rewards killing people your lvl or close to yours, less for killing people lower than you and none if they are way out of your range. ( maybe penaltys if you do so unless the lower person attacks first ...stay with the virtues ;D )
    Maybe this way you get all kind of lvl in the zone without some beeing just bait and you can get at least some more players to try PvP ( not sure PvP will ever work in this game...but who knows)
     
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  12. Turok64

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    uh how about a level cap first off?
     
  13. Fruck

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    I dont think a level cap will help as much as most people think.... While we can all acknowledge aLVL matters to some degree, just capping it at 80 isint a magic bullet.
     
  14. Spungwa

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    This is also something Archage had a fix for.

    The battle arena (1 v 1, 3 v 3, 5 v 5 both scaled and absolute) you could enter from anywhere and get put into the queue until enough people were available. When enough people were available you would get a pop up that you had 1 minute to click that would transport you to the arena. Meaning the waiting could be done anywhere, while you were doing anything. If you said no (because you was in the middle of something) or timed out, it just re-added you to the queue something like 5 minutes later automatically.

    Regards
    Spung
     
  15. Proteus Tempest

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    I'm not much of a PvPer. Arena fighting just does not hold my attention too long.

    If there was more purpose to it than just arena fighting I might be persuaded to try it more often. Though the premise of OT as a new style of arena battle is fun I don't see it being a lasting thing unless we can bring more PvPers to the game and it still won't be a thing to keep players attention.

    @DarkStarr

    A couple of questions.

    Is this a good time to introduce the PvP machine that we gather parts for that was talked about long ago?

    and

    As a idea, would it be possible when a player entered a shardfall zone that all the shardfall zones would load so it would be possible to have an instantaneous teleport from one to another? PvPing and having that ability to teleport from one shardfall to another in battle would be fun and expand the "arena" without load the times. It might get non PvPers to enter the zone for another type of fast travel.... if they can survive.
     
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  16. Arkah EMPstrike

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    They are making castle sieges and stuff (and blood bay) cap your skill levels at lvl 80 effectivness.

    And power differentiation is just an imbalance between builds and gear in these areas
     
  17. Silverti

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    Anyone else notice that there has not been a single word uttered about castle sieges since the obsidian trials rolled out (and failed)? gone, all talk about it.
     
  18. Cordelayne

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    This sums up my feelings on this as well. I just don't enjoy PvP, even when you remove the ransoming/item loss aspect. For me the enjoyment of Shroud comes from grouping up and tackling monster bosses, not each other. So even though there are no negative repercussions to the Obsidian Trials, it simply doesn't hold my interest; which is why I haven't been there and don't plan to.
     
  19. Vladamir Begemot

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    Overwatch, Battlefield, still get XP even if you lose.

    If that were the case in the Obsidian Trials, I'd go in and die enough times to get the Highlander emote.

    But wouldn't it be nice if I weren't going in with 100% certainty that I'm going to lose?

    And no, I'm not going to sit in an empty lobby waiting no matter what.

    At this point the only functional way for this to work for me is to get 4 friends together and get in there when no one else is in, fight and hope no one shows up, get everyone their Highlander reward, and then stop wasting our time.

    In bullet points:

    • Rewards every time, win or lose
    • Tiered fighting
    • Queue up from elsewhere
    Basically what everyone else said, just reiterating with my own feels.
     
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  20. Elrond

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    They already said theres still lot to come as rewards for obsidian trials ( crafting components , pvp gear ) ..my guess is theyre just too busy with other stuff right now.... fishing... new store weapons so on....
     
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