1. We have a QA initiative where we work with the community more closely than ever to get your bug reports into the hands of the developers. Please use this forum for LIVE Server bug reporting. Do follow the format below, because it will help us out greatly in responding. If you do not, it's possible your bug report will be misinterpreted, or worse, lost!

    Read BEFORE submitting your first bug: Reporting Bugs… QA 101 Document
    • Search for your bug before posting in order to avoid duplicate reports.
    • Only reply to an existing thread if you have additional information for the reported bug. ALL extraneous commentary will be deleted to avoid cluttering the reports.
    • Keep your bug report short and factual.
    • There is no need to submit crash logs. Crash data we require is automatically logged.
    Bug Report Template
    1. Title:
    2. Reproduction Rate:
    3. Blocker?
    4. Details:
    5. Steps to Reproduce:
    6. User Specs:
    To get started, use /bug in-game (/devbug if on QA) to auto-create this template. It will even auto-fill some of the required information and open the browser for you. Then take the information that was just saved to your system's clipboard and paste it into a new QA forum post. Thank you bug hunters!
Dismiss Notice
This Section is READ ONLY - All Posts Are Archived

Please stop with the shared pool stuff for character slots

Discussion in 'Release 64 Feedback' started by Mishikal, Apr 16, 2019.

  1. Mishikal

    Mishikal Avatar

    Messages:
    1,901
    Likes Received:
    2,652
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Brittany Estates
    The original idea that was sold was that people would have the ability to have multiple characters tied to their account, so they could play alts. This is a great idea, and quite common in the MMO world. This allows people to freely try out new things w/o impacting their "main".

    Unfortunately, for some bizarre reason, this concept of separation is getting further and further lost as time goes on. First there was the "shared" alignment. Which sucked, because I was at one point considering having both a "dark" and a "light" character on my account.

    Next was the proposal to share the XP pool between these character alts. For some reason I can't comprehend, this has been jumped on by the development team. I spend a lot of time watching/managing my XP pool, and I really really do not want my other characters to be having any impact on my main's pool. Proper pool management and decision making on how to spend your XP is a crucial and core aspect of Shroud (and something I quite enjoy).

    Now today, there's this crazy idea to pool together the gold across avatars. Again, totally throwing a wrench in the works of proper character management. If people are tired of mailing gold to themselves, then just make it so you can deposit excess gold coins in the bank (again, like most MMOs allow you to do).

    All of this avoids the other problem, which is the shared bank across your avatars. I'm not a fan of this either, and now that rewards are now their own separate "bank", I can't see why they need a shared bank any longer?

    Really, what I'd like is complete separation between characters. Since the game is completely F2P now, why is there this need to bunch your multiple avatars into a giant blob of sameness? It seems to me that things should be going the other direction -- Stop sharing banks, stop sharing mail, stop sharing alignment, and do not in any way move forward on sharing the XP pool or gold pool.

    Please just give us the ability to play separate characters, which was what was the original idea.
     
  2. kaeshiva

    kaeshiva Avatar

    Messages:
    2,420
    Likes Received:
    9,256
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Gender:
    Female
    Have to agree here. While you're at it, stop sharing friends lists and guilds too. The traditional idea of an alt is a completely separate character. The reason why same-account-characters had the shared virtue was, as LB explained it, because your character is meant to be your manifestation in the world, your avatar as such, and it shouldn't be trivial to have a 'do over' with regards to your virtue. At the time, a character slot cost like 10 bucks and a new account costed like 20 bucks and well, it was easy decision what to do if you wanted a clear and distinct alt. Even easier now that game is fully free and that rewards like the free deed are 'account based'.

    The only reason I can think of to have an extra char slot on my main account would be to try and get extra quest reward deco, or troll peoples friends lists by having a name they don't know show up. Its kind of a pointless feature. Which is why I get the requests for shared-everything, because it would actually make a same-account-alt have a benefit: you could powerlevel it with your main. That's really only benefit I can think of. Of course, by having my alt on another account, I can still powerlevel it with my main just in a different way, so its a pretty small thing.
     
    Vladamir Begemot and Mishikal like this.
  3. Weins201

    Weins201 Avatar

    Messages:
    7,130
    Likes Received:
    10,991
    Trophy Points:
    153
    there was never "separate" characters, Originally they would share the same last name and alignment this was how they were presented from the inception. If you really want to dig back in time there was NEVER supposed to be more than one char per account. When it came around it was more just an additional char that shared everything; sir name, banks, gold, rewards, reputation, . . . . So if you ever had an intention of having a char even remotely diff you needed to get another account.

    This whole second char idea in itself is a complete joke.

    The game is free to play - open another account and play a new char.

    If you create any new chars on your original account you are just wasting your time on that first char.

    the excuse was I soent all this time and have 5 billion exp, and now I want to see how a Pole arms, water wielders does other than my blades fire guy.

    Want to start over start, a new account it is FREEEEEEEE
     
    Elas TheWise likes this.
  4. Barugon

    Barugon Avatar

    Messages:
    11,668
    Likes Received:
    18,590
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Gender:
    Male
    The answer to having a completely separate character is to create another account. It's free whereas another character slot is not.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019
    Elas TheWise and Jaesun like this.
  5. Jaesun

    Jaesun Avatar

    Messages:
    3,162
    Likes Received:
    3,469
    Trophy Points:
    153
    For me, I actually like the idea of these new changes for secondary characters. I would LOVE a shared xp pool! But we will see. That’s just me though. :)
     
  6. golruul

    golruul Avatar

    Messages:
    317
    Likes Received:
    660
    Trophy Points:
    43
    More shared resources between alts please.

    If you want a completely separate character, make another account. It's free.
     
    Elas TheWise and Jaesun like this.
  7. Mishikal

    Mishikal Avatar

    Messages:
    1,901
    Likes Received:
    2,652
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Brittany Estates
    How about just get rid of character slots entirely? They serve no purpose if they're all the same thing.
     
  8. golruul

    golruul Avatar

    Messages:
    317
    Likes Received:
    660
    Trophy Points:
    43
    It's too late to get rid of character slots since they're already in and people have paid for them.

    As for purpose, from what I see they exist to let someone play an alternate version of themselves without having to regrind everything. Seems like a legitimate use from my view.

    When crafting specializations come in they'll have a bigger use: getting around the 1 specialization per character so you can do everything yourself.
     
  9. Mishikal

    Mishikal Avatar

    Messages:
    1,901
    Likes Received:
    2,652
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Brittany Estates
    You do have to regrind everything though, in some fashion or another. I.e., a new character has all low level skills. You can certainly use a high level avatar to fill up your XP pool (once they're shared) and then use that XP on a different avatar, but it's still going to be a grind... just a faster one than usual. I'd say the major difference vs yet another account is the crafting pool. You can power level the adv XP pool for another account by having them stand near you while you kill stuff. Definitely cannot do that for the crafting pool, so I agree, that's definitely a potential advantage once there are shared pools.
     
  10. Bedawyn

    Bedawyn Avatar

    Messages:
    540
    Likes Received:
    614
    Trophy Points:
    63
    In offline mode (all I'm doing right now), this mess of shared things is affecting me horribly and taking up way too much energy trying to figure a way to make it manageable.

    I roleplay. A character that is excellent at everything and can do everything for themselves is not roleplay, unless you're roleplaying a god. Alts allow an ecosystem of characters with different functions and styles. This is even more important in offline mode than online because a PC who is an adventurer and NOT a jack-of-all-trades crafter has to be able to buy crafted goods from other characters.

    In offline mode, the only other characters are your alts -- but because you can't sell things to your alts, that's borked. The only thing you can do is become a jack-of-all-trades (severely limiting your roleplay options) or reduce your alts to slaves who are entirely dependent on your main and get no benefit from the work they do. There's no fun in that and I don't imagine it's a playstyle the devs want to encourage.

    Having shared gold would at least mitigate that, although I'd have to manually keep track of how much of the pool each character really owned. But a far better solution would be to keep gold separate and enable selling.

    Two of my alts are sisters, a carpenter and a blacksmith. The blacksmith will do some low-level adventuring to collect resources for both, so the pool makes sense for them. But it makes no sense at all -- and actively harms my playing experience -- for them to be on the same pool as the main adventurer.

    When I do make it online -- extra character slots is exactly the sort of thing I would have been willing to spend a little money on here and there. But there is no way I would do that currently, because it would be wasted money. Not because I could create separate free accounts, when using the "real" account would be more convenient for me, but because a blobby pooled mess that's really just one character with different masks is NOT something worth paying for.

    As for the shared virtue....argh! It just makes no sense whatsoever. It was never going to be possible for us to "play" our real selves with one avatar -- our real selves pulled into this world would be either gibbering in a corner or desperately trying to get home and worrying about our real responsibilities and loved ones left behind. So of course we're going to be roleplaying. And having characters affected by the consequences of other characters' actions makes it impossible to truly see how your own choices play out. So it's not even serving the supposed purpose.

    Please, please, please STOP with the shared pool stuff. For those who like that, maybe make it possible to have a joint bank account, but that shouldn't be the default.
     
    Widsith [MGT] and Mishikal like this.
  11. golruul

    golruul Avatar

    Messages:
    317
    Likes Received:
    660
    Trophy Points:
    43
    (I'm limiting this comment to online play) I don't understand why people are completely against other people sharing stuff between their alts. If you want a completely separate character, then create another account. It's literally free. It's available today, you get exactly what you want, and it requires absolutely no dev time to make it happen.

    So why are people going out of their way to try to prevent others from sharing between their own alts? There has to be some kind of hidden motive because otherwise this makes no sense.
     
    Sean Silverfoot likes this.
  12. Mishikal

    Mishikal Avatar

    Messages:
    1,901
    Likes Received:
    2,652
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Brittany Estates
    Nothing prevents you from sharing with your alt now, so your question doesn't make any sense. And why should one have to manage multiple different accounts just to have multiple avatars, when there already exists in the game a function to provide that?
     
    Bedawyn likes this.
  13. Jaesun

    Jaesun Avatar

    Messages:
    3,162
    Likes Received:
    3,469
    Trophy Points:
    153
    For me personally, I’ve spent a lot of time with my secondary character. And now getting the benefit of the gold and xp they have accumulated is of worth for the 5$ I spent on that. I am really looking forward to this change. :)

    Do completely understand the people who don’t like this change though. But you always can create a new account for free anytime.
     
    Elas TheWise likes this.
  14. Mishikal

    Mishikal Avatar

    Messages:
    1,901
    Likes Received:
    2,652
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Brittany Estates
    New account won't include my access to episodes 2-5 that came with my pledge, however. I'd have to spend additional money just for the episode 2 early access. So creating a new account is definitely not functionally equivalent at all.
     
  15. Jaesun

    Jaesun Avatar

    Messages:
    3,162
    Likes Received:
    3,469
    Trophy Points:
    153
    That’s another thing that makes the $5 cost of a secondary worth while then. The Chapter 2 access.

    My main account has Chapter 2 access (have the Visionary title).
     
  16. Mishikal

    Mishikal Avatar

    Messages:
    1,901
    Likes Received:
    2,652
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Brittany Estates
    Yeah, I don't mind having additional character slots. What I mind is them being forced into being a homogeneous blob. :(
     
  17. jschoice

    jschoice Avatar

    Messages:
    269
    Likes Received:
    548
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Chicagoland aka the burbs
    I have been a huge supporter of this change. The concept of sharing some aspects across characters such as reputation and not other things like xp and gold seemed disjointed. My main avatar is close to reaching my intended build. I have 2 other characters one who is a pure mage and another that is a paladin/blacksmith. Having a combined xp pool will help me level my other two avatars quicker.

    I also have a second account with two characters and I use this account to role play an evil avatar.
     
    FrostII, Barugon and Jaesun like this.
  18. Barugon

    Barugon Avatar

    Messages:
    11,668
    Likes Received:
    18,590
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Gender:
    Male
    Truly.
     
  19. golruul

    golruul Avatar

    Messages:
    317
    Likes Received:
    660
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Let's be clear with the desires first.

    The first group of players want alts (on the same account) so they can share xp/gold/virtue/etc. Basically everything. Some of these things aren't implemented yet and the players (that want this) want it to be implemented. I want to share xp with my alt, but I cannot yet (if I'm wrong let me know).

    The second group of players don't want anything to be shared between their characters. This, by itself, is fine. Creating another account achieves this -- no need for any development by the devs. Since the game is free to play, there is absolutely no cost in doing this to achieve exactly what is wanted (i.e. no sharing between characters).

    What I don't understand is why people from the second group are trying to prevent people from the first group from getting what they want (i.e. share everything on same account). People in the first group getting what they want has absolutely no effect on the people in the second group -- so why are the second group people trying to prevent this from happening? This is what makes no sense to me and why I assume there's an ulterior motive.
     
  20. FrostII

    FrostII Avatar

    Messages:
    4,498
    Likes Received:
    9,195
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest
    Agree completely.
     
    Sean Silverfoot likes this.