Remove useless items from inventory with end of quest

Discussion in 'Feedback' started by ConjurerDragon, Oct 19, 2022.

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  1. ConjurerDragon

    ConjurerDragon Avatar

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    e.g.
    Ardoris
    the quests to find the murderer of the children that uses the black arrows
    "Investigate the Tower"
    "Accuse Rolf"
    "Report to Cugel" (should be "Report to Captain Cugel" for clarity)

    In the locked guard tower you´ll find evidence to incriminate the Guard that has lost his son.

    After accusing the guard and reporting to Captain Cugel the quest is finished and the reward received.
    However I still have these items in my inventory:

    yellow quest item:
    "An official notice of recall" (found in the tower)

    white normal items, all found in the tower:
    "A note about Jenn"
    "A note about Scarlett"
    "A note about Taylor"
    "A note found in Ardoris Guard Tower"

    At the last talk in the quest, reporting to Captain Cugel, he ought to take all those items as evidence from the player, both because it makes sense and to prevent them littering the inventory.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2022
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  2. Paladin Michael

    Paladin Michael Bug Hunter

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    Those items are marked this way so we can't delete quest items (by accident).
    Good idea so far.

    Unfortunately some quest items - also those we get back after solving the quest - won't turn to "normal" items, so we could use them (for decoration purpose) or delete ...

    Would be good to have the ability to delete items in inventory after the quest is done or to use them as decoration ... (also for player made quests).

    For a lot of (quest related) items it still works.


    May be @Sannio can help us with :)
     
  3. Barugon

    Barugon Avatar

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    Right click and select delete.
     
  4. Paladin Michael

    Paladin Michael Bug Hunter

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    I suppose he meant to have an option, that it is done automatically.
     
  5. ConjurerDragon

    ConjurerDragon Avatar

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    Out of character from as technical point of view - sure, no problem.
    If I ingame, as a player are positive that I no longer need the stuff for anything. Being a packrat who keeps everything and is constantly running around over encumbered that would not happen. Especially not for yellowcoloured Questitems. How would a player know that he no longer needs that item that is marked in the colour of "Important, do not give away or destroy"?

    Ingame, incharacter you would destroy the evidence that the guy is the one stalking the kids and killing them with black arrows.
    And the Captain of the guard who would need those papers does neither take nor ask them from you to persecute the guard, it just happens.

    IMO a quest ist done perfectly when in the last talk before the reward is handed out all no more needed items involved in the quest are removed that in the fantasy world would have to be taken away as they would be needed and so that they automatically no longer litter the already crowded inventory.
     
  6. Barugon

    Barugon Avatar

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    I understand that from a story/quest perspective but I also know that you are able to destroy things that can be collected again. If it's a one-off then it's marked as a quest item and you can't destroy it.
     
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  7. ConjurerDragon

    ConjurerDragon Avatar

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    *IF* the player is positively secure that he actually won´t be needing them anyxmore. The doubt that an item might be needed later can be prevented by removing anything useless related to the quest with the last speech in the quest.

    Yellow as a quest item, like the "An official notice of Recall" letter that I mention in the first post, too?
     
  8. Toular

    Toular Avatar

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    I think at one point Sannio said that those quest items had to be remain on the character because removing them would essentially break the quest system for that quest.

    Okay. I can understand that. How about hiding them from the inventory then? Add a flag to quest items that basically says "In Progress" or "Completed". If a quest item was that flag set to "Completed" then don't show it in the inventory.
     
  9. ConjurerDragon

    ConjurerDragon Avatar

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    I did not suggest to remove them before the quest is finished but only in the last talk where you get your reward and the quest is marked as finished.

    Only if those items all have 0 weight. Hidden items with weight should not clutter my inventory.
     
  10. Toular

    Toular Avatar

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    I think items that are considered quest items have 0 weight. There are some items you get during a quest that are not specifically quest items. The notes about the children in Ardoris, for example can safely be deleted or displayed on a wall in your house (I *think* they can be displayed at least).
     
  11. Adam Crow

    Adam Crow Avatar

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    A work around I do is place all such items in a bag in your inventory or the bank. Then you don't have to worry about deleting anything important, and it makes my inventory less cluttered.
     
  12. Sannio

    Sannio Lead Quest and Level Designer Moderator SOTA Developer

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    @ConjurerDragon , thanks for the feedback! Here's some thoughts that maybe answer some of your questions and probably give you more info than you wanted. :)

    You're playing through some of our earliest quests. They were created before some of our "best practices" quest techniques were created, and part of the reason why is because some of the tech that supports our best practices didn't exist. (For example, we didn't give you helpful compass markers when we first created quests--finding the quest targets was all up to you.) I wasn't even part of the team at that time, and I've been here a pretty long time.

    Yes, Captain Cugel probably should be taking critical evidence from you, but I wouldn't want to change this now. Much of the items you find in the world, or allowed to keep after a quest is over, are able to be placed as decorations in your home. The expectation with many quests is that you get to keep the "souvenirs" and changing that could disappoint some players who actively look forward to these things in general, or even the items from this quest specifically.

    Here's how many later quests work, and how I try to do quests with objects. When a quest gives you an object you need to complete the quest, I often allow you to delete the object and return to where you got it originally to get a replacement. (Where possible, I'll even have the compass markers update/"revert" to help you backtrack to the source of the object to help you get that replacement.) When the quest is over, you might be able to keep the quest item as a souvenir if the fiction allows it, but usually I take it from you. Many simple quests lead into a repeatable/daily version, so you'll get extra opportunities to get replacement souvenirs if you delete the item then regret it.

    Alternatively, when the quest object is intended to be one-of-a-kind, you won't be able to delete it, and it'll be automatically removed at a stage of the quest. If it's appropriate for you to keep a souvenir version of that object, I'll swap the non-deleteable quest version (yellow named) with a similarly named "plain" version (white named) that you can delete if you want.

    What seems to be best is when you see an item with a yellow name then you know you will be required to have it with you to continue or complete the quest. Such an item should have a yellow name and is either something you can delete and replace or automatically removed if you can't delete it. However, we throw a monkeywrench into the works by having some quests where you need to turn in mundane items, like wood, leather, or books. These white-named items can be found in the world independent of the quest (and can be re-collected by normal adventuring/exploring), but items that exist only for a quest are the yellow-named ones (and require you to be on a certain quest stage in order to be collected).

    Regarding old quests, whenever I need to go back to one that has a quest item, I review if I can make reasonable changes to impose these "best practices" I'm describing above, and I'll do so if it's reasonable. This can include allowing players to delete items and re-collect them at a later date, and ensuring quest items that are rewards have the quest flag removed (yellow names become white) and they can be deleted.

    If anyone knows of specific quests and quest items that should have current best practices imposed on them, please submit a bug with details and I'll add the notes to my to-do list (or explain why changes can't happen as requested, if that's the case).
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2022
  13. ConjurerDragon

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    I just returned to Highvale Outskirts, Marissa to give her the "resource gathering" stuff. All of which were no yellow quest items, but normal items (3 Silver Ore, Nightshade and Citrine).
    And when I got my 250 gold and XP she returned them to me.

    This is not a yellow quest item that noone longer needs, but resources she urgently required for the provisions of the refugees in the monastery. Receiving them back is strange to say the very least.

    11/25/2022 22:01
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    OS: Windows 10 (10.0.0) 64bit
    CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 5600G with Radeon Graphics (12) System RAM: 15742
    GPU: AMD Radeon(TM) Graphics GPU RAM: 4430
    SotA.Win.64.1609.Date.11.23.22
    Area: Novia_R6_Hills04_01
    Area Display Name: Highvale Outskirts
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  14. ConjurerDragon

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    I´m now at Soltown with Sada and had the letter of Wen in inventory.
    However I had no option to give her the letter but only 3 speech options (e.g. 1) Truth - he did not love you.
    And then she hands over the reward without ever having seen the letter:

    12/10/2022 09:50
    Title:
    Reproduction Rate:
    Blocker? no
    Details:
    Steps to Reproduce:
    User Specs:
    OS: Windows 10 (10.0.0) 64bit
    CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 5600G with Radeon Graphics (12) System RAM: 15742
    GPU: AMD Radeon(TM) Graphics GPU RAM: 4430
    SotA.Win.64.1610.Date.12.01.22
    Area: Novia_R1_City_Solania
    Area Display Name: Solania
    Loc: (73.7, 23.8, -42.8)
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