Stretch Goal Confusion

I'm confused.

Am I to understand that if I don't "purchase" any stretch goals, I have no access to them in-game upon release?

And why are basic features, such as mounted transport, only accessible through the purchase of stretch goals? I thought the whole point of a goal is to apply them for everyone?

Add-on stores, more and more housing/lots, now a stretch goal? This is starting to remind me of the current mobile gaming cash-grab trend. And I'm really starting to dislike it...

 

Greetings. You will have access to any stretch goal we reach in game. The stretch goal won't actually be started until the funds for it are reached though.

 

So in that case, aside from the goal being implimented, what's the incentive to donate in that case? It just seems like some people who can afford to, will pledge for a stretch goal. And those who don't still reap the benefits?

Because this completely contradicts this statement: "These rewards are completely unique and will not be sold in the add-on store, in-game, or given as a pledge reward. "

So in other words, if I don't pledge now for these goals, if they are met, only those who pledged receive them. So I'll have NO access to any of these items, including mounted travel.

So no foals, no riding outfits, saddle mount and no mounts?!

 

I can see where that might be confusing. Once the goal is met everyone gets riding but the items from the stretch goal store are no longer offered. So in that case yes you won't have one of the stretch goal horses, it would be a rare mount. You can still get a mount though.

So we all get riding when the goal is met but you only get the exclusive goods by pledging?

 

Will there be some derivative of the riding outfit and saddle decoration?

I've already pledged several hundred dollars to this game. more than any other game I have ever purchased in 25 years of gaming. I cannot afford to provide anymore. That riding outfit is $20! That is a third the price of a regular full release game! And it's not even a game!

A unique outfit with some sort of colour or emblem that dentoes it's unique, with regular riding outfits for everyone else? Okay, I can handle that. The same way I handle someone who pledges thousands of dollars receives a house no-one else can get. But players can still theoretically gain a house of similar size. Just not THAT one.

 

I'm afraid I could only guess at the saddle decoration but I'm sure there will be no lack of outfits.

 

I do hope at one point they offer a way to get a riding outfit or saddle decoration in game that just isn't the same as the one being offered in the store.

 

Agreed. I don't understand the logic of this exclusivity. Star Citizen doesn't do it and they have a huge amount of funds available. Players can purchase a coulpe of decorative items. But everything will be equally available at release. The only exception is a couple of titles and perks.

A title is earned from subscriptions. It provides no other in-game benefit other than prestige. The ships you can purchase? All available in-game. They just don't come with certain unique skins or free and unlimited insurance. Again, that's the perk for early donations. But as you can see, effectively no exclusivity.

The only exception is one ship, which will be availble in-game in extremely limited and trying conditions. Which match the out of game context also as that ship cost an enormous amount of money!

But this trend starting with Shroud, I'm really beginning to reserve my previous enthusiasm.

 

Stretch goals will unlock for everyone if the feature is unlocked. If you pay nothing now, and the feature is unlocked by others, you will have to obtain a mount (for example) on your own later. But spending $20 on a foal now guarantees you a pet that might turn into a mount if the feature is unlocked, and you're contributing to unlocking it.

 

Others have already explained that if the goals are met, these things will be available to to everyone. but I feel like rambling a bit this morning and want to add my thoughts. Stretch goals are just that. Stretttttttch goals. Goals for adding things to the game that people are wanting, but that can't be added on the current budget.

They can stop trying to raise more money now and go ahead and finish making the game with the money they have currently raised, but it's not going to have some of the things we'd like to see added and have requested. And a small handful of people haven't just "requested" things. They've demanded, nagged, insulted & bashed Portalarium for the lack of some things, with much anger & venom. So Port listens to us, and comes up with a way to give us these things, and then some people, some of the same ones who were so vocally negative, now gripe and complain about it and call them greedy. **shakes head**

Not saying you are one of those people, OP, just saying that they exist on these forums and have been spamming their discontent, and I guess it's just getting a bit wearing. No amount of reason or logic is having any affect on them. Their attitude is "Don't try to confuse me with the facts, my mind is made up."

This game is still very much in fund raising mode, thank goodness. I for one would much rather not settle for the game they would have to publish with the current funds when we can have so much more, although I already love the game. Anyone who is content with the currently planned features and have no interest in them adding more, then don't contribute. Kinda of a no-brainer. Other games with a big budget are able to add a bunch of stuff without having to raise more money. That's nice for them. Doesn't work for us at this point in time.

The stretch goals model is a good one, imo. People can vote for the extra features they want by buying the trinkets and fluff that go with that feature, which will have some use if the goal is met. But the trinkets are not the goal. They're not a purchase, per se. They're a "Thank You" for contributing. And the goal itself, if met, will become a feature of the game and available to all players, even those who come later and never heard of all our fund raising efforts but who will still reap the benefits of it. And, I might add, even the detractors who never contribute another dime will reap the benefits. So anyone who doesn't want to, or can't contribute.....no problem.

 

The entire stretch goal contradicts this: "these items will not be available in the add-on store, in-game". So I understand we get mounted travel, but we won't get those riding suits, mount breeds or mount decoration. Not even a derivative of it? The mount breeds can be considered fluff items, but the riding suit? That is a suit we will never have access too! That is exclusivity to the extreme...

And listen to the players? I'm starting to hate how often they listen to us. I liked the new map feature which they came up with on their own, but thanks to a loud playerbase, I won't see it. Now people are calling for more housing and items and other materialistic features, and I'm forced to accept it too? I've become so disenfranchised by this massive cash shop that I almost wish I didn't back this game. It's just far too overwhelming and materialistic :/

 

The exact items won't be available, no. But what's the use of perqs if there's nothing special about them. Where is the incentive to contribute now? But where does it say there will be no riding suits at all? Every game I've ever played has some things that are "special" but are also available with cosmetic differences. Where does it say that Port won't be doing the same?

About the map, yeah I didn't care for them changing it either but the majority evidently didn't like it. Either way, it's not a game breaker for me and I sure wouldn't expect them to go with the minority rather than the majority.

 

It doesn't. That's my point. There is far too much ambiguity and uncertainty regarding this goal.

Majority is logical, but I expect them to make THEIR game. I pledged because I like what Garriott and Long do. I don't want to play other people's games. I want to play their games.

 

It would seem odd to not be able to get a black, "buckskin" or white horse in game if the stretch goal succeeds as these are quite common colours, with black probably being one of the more popular ones, however they're just listed as generic foals at this time and should the stretch goal fail, they then become a standard pet.

I guess they could get around the colour issue by taking the breed route, for example black Thoroughbred or white Thoroughbred vs black/brown Friesan's, and even painted horses. Lots they can still do if the goal succeeds way beyond what the items already in the stretch store.

Variations on the riding outfits can easily be changed if the stretch goal succeeds as can the saddle stand, but the original items will not be available again.

Understand the frustration over player feedback, I didn't mind the previous map, but it really seemed to annoy a bunch of others and we may end up with something much better. Still, player feedback can and has had positive impact on other games, case in point the frame shift drive in Elite Dangerous has really bought an excellent element to that game, vs simply hyperspacing between points (ie space stations, planets etc).

How long will the stretch goal be available before they say fail?

 

I can go back another game on Kickstarter for $20. I have a few I'm looking at that do in fact cost precisely $20. The game I play the most right now is Star Wars: The Old Republic. I gladly pay a subscription fee to support the game because I want new content. But they also sell vanity armor sets, mounts, etc. for $20 all the time. Even worse, they have gamble cartel packs with random items. I've heard stories of some players spending thousands over the course of a year on these random packs. That seems crazy, but some people are willing to pay it, so it will continue to happen.

I really want mounts in the game. Am I willing to spend $20 on a fairly plain pet to contribute to a stretch goal I don't even think will be reached? I'm not sure. But someone has to start buying them to get the ball rolling.

 

That's a good example on my stance.

I am subbed to three MMOs right now. Ultima Online I have been on and off since The Second Age. So that's probably in excess of thousands dollars on sub fees! That pays for access to the game. But not everyone in the game is equal. Some players have higher ranks, or more gold or other means to differentiate or define our success. But either way, we have equal access. And might I add that cost isn't necessarily the critical factor. I do think these items are overpriced, but it's not the critical factor.

And then UO comes along, much like TOR, with a cash shop. Suddenly players are instantly receiving items in-game in addition to their sub fee. That takes out the fun. You buy an item and INSTANTLY receive it! You don't even need to earn it in-game. It just appears! Look at boats. Instead of offering some sort of crafting system for carpenters, these pre-purchase boats just appear... how dull and uncreative!

EVE has done the same thing. However all items purchased can be bought with in-game currency. And the items sold are only cosmetic. I can tolerate that. But again, for a game that revolves around crafting, it's disappointing that you circumvent the crafting mechanic.

Why not offer expansion packs or booster packs? For example making the Horse Stretch Goal a "booster pack". If you pay the $50 cost. You receive that pack and access to all those items and the mounted mechanic. If you don't buy it, you never have access. But the chance to buy it is always there. And perhaps if you "pre-order" you receive some sort of perk. Maybe a training bonus for any horse you own or the ability to own a unique horse breed that only you can acquire (but can trade if you choose).

There are better ways than this path of excluding players.

 

All of the game features that are part of the stretch goal store will be implemented into the game in future episodes, regardless if the stretch goals are met. The whole purpose of the stretch goal store, is to get the proposed game feature(s) into episode 1. No one is being forced to contribute to the stretch goal store, you should only contribute to the stretch goal store because you REALLY want to purchase an item available while also providing funding for a specific game feature to be available in episode 1.

Regarding the discussion of mounts, you WILL be able to use mounts in game even if you didn't contribute to the stretch goal store. The items for sale in the stretch goal store are exclusive to it, but there will be other similar items available in game.

 

Where's the dev quote that says that. Because I don't read it that way at all.

This is a direct quote from the Stretch Goal page:

So where's your direct quote stating otherwise?

 

The whole point of the stretch goals is to improve the game for people that will put their money where their mouth is. It's a small team that can't afford to make features that 3/4 of the population won't use or care about.

So your incentive to buy into the stretch goal is that you WANT horse mounts. That's not to say that once mounts are in the game that "dragon mounts" or "spider mounts" or "bear mounts" won't be in the game (probably as another add-on store item). But the only way you're getting a horse mount is if you trade with someone that already has one.

At least, that's how I read the following quote from the stretch goal page.

It seems clear to me.

 

Any stretch goal thus far has been for the entire community, whether you contributed money to the game when that was a stretch goal or not. I understand this is a different in that you can choose a stretch goal and support it now. The specific rewards are exclusive, there is no mention that the stretch goal is exclusive.

"Welcome to the Stretch Goal Store! These are stretch goals with immediate rewards. When you purchase an item, you will receive it as an in-game reward, even if the goal is not met. If a stretch goal is met, all of the items in its respective category will receive additional functionality related to the stretch goal. These rewards are completely unique and will not be sold in the add-on store, in-game, or given as a pledge reward."

The description of the stretch goal reward is "Players will be able to ride non-combat horse mounts in game!" Not just "mounts" but that players will be able to ride non-combat horse mounts in game. So perhaps black, white & buckskin mounts will not be available except through a backer - but they may have Bays, Chestnut, Gray, Salt & pepper, Dun, etc. In horse colours white horses are the rarest and black horses are uncommon so this may fit with the pledge rewards being unique and not available elsewhere. But again the stretch goal is "Players will be able to ride non-combat horse mounts in game!" Not "Players who purchase these rewards will be able to ride non-combat horse mounts in game!"

I think you are taking unique to be more unique than Portalarium has intended. You can have a truly unique house in some stretch goal - but that house might be unique because it is made of black obsidian or pure white marble, or it might be unique in some other way that is less obvious. The characteristic of that house makes it unique, but does not mean nobody else could ever obtain a house without trading with someone.