Telethon PvP Hour.

Have you listened the PvP hour?

We are in trouble.

@Chris , @RichardGarriott and @DarkStarr are completely lost with PvP.

After nearly three years of development, we got Flag and empty Shardfall and nothing on the horizon.

I am afraid.

Edit: I give money for the telethon and I hope that my money will go into PvP.

 

Dont Worry Son, @Chris is the man for this situation !!!

/Prey God @Chris give some LOVE to PvP

 

Don't get your hopes up. As mentioned in my current thread on pvp there is not one single, simple system that has been made for pvp for the 3 years in development so far, especially compared to the strides being made for pve/rest of the game, so even though there are "talks" about what there is "going to be" for pvp, its already been a minimum 3 years maybe 4 years minimum (before aforementioned ideas are actually in) before anything was ever done for it, so don't look to this game for continued developer support or even interest in pvp.

 

We have seen the same development towards PVP than towards single player mechanics. But not currently working in single player mechanics doesn't mean they're not going to do anything regarding single player.

They just gave an environment to fight against each other, and i acknowledge that's not enough. We want sieges, Reds want to annoy the Blues and Blues wants to undo Reds plans... we need that, and I still have faith. Don't think they'll work in PVP oriented systems until Alpha... but i have faith.

 

I don't know why some of the more positive and constructive PvPers don't actually get together and thrash out amongst themselves (not on the forum) what PvPers would actually like to see. Then present that paper to Portalarium.

Little point of keep creating PvP threads because they get raided by the anti-PvPers and I doubt the Devs read them because of all the trash contained within.

 

Havent done a single thing for pvp so far in the 3 years of development, they wouldnt read them because its about pvp.

 

Serious question, why focus on making a game known to be focused on pve, into a pvp focused game? My concern is more about the state of combat.

I am in some other games and a member of guilds known world wide for PVP. EVE, Star Citizen, Planetside, Crowfall. I try to sell Shroud to them and get laughed at. Shroud is not currently, in the past, or future going to be a PVP game. At best it might be to the level of LOTRO with regards to pvp.

First priority needs to be making combat enjoyable, skillful, responsive, and meaningful.

 

not saying I am content with the current system or the plans for the future, I am NOT.
there have however been countless threads regarding pvp which I know the devs have read and commented and started 1 or 2.
I understand the frustration though, we are moving closer and closer to launch without having seen any improvements on the pvp front.

Despite this I still have full trust of the dev team, this game will make it and it will be a succsess!

 

If you make the combat balanced for PVP, it will inherently be better for PVE. If the combat is focused only on PVE, it will inherently be worse for PVP.

I think the most worrisome comment I heard from the developers in the telethon was that their approach to PVP is something like (I'm interpreting and paraphasing here) "We don't think PVP has to be done now because nothing is dependent on it. It's just 'PVP', so this can be put in anytime and it will just work because PVP is PVP." Maybe that's not what they were trying to say, but that's what I heard.

I found that to be one of the craziest things I'd ever heard. In my opinion the only way PVP will ever work is if you actually design for it. You can't just give the players the ability to do damage to each other until they die and expect it to be a fun and challenging environment that people want to play in.

I only speak for myself, and I don't presume to speak for anyone else that likes or doesn't like pvp. I sometimes here people say "PVP is its own reward" and that's a CRAZY thing to say. I find that very damaging to the development of pvp. PVP is NOT its own reward. It's far from it. All kinds of games that no one is playing in have pvp. If it were its own reward then designing good pvp would be a heck of a lot easier and more games would be able to satisfy this market.

I have no doubt that this will be a GREAT game. I'm convinced at this point. But I have a lot of doubt that it will be a GREAT game that has good pvp. And that's a shame since I've put quite a bit of money on the line expressly so that my giant pvp town would be the centerpiece of that experience.

 

I've thought the same thing. Although I don't know who decides what is "constructive". That's often a loaded word that means "thinks like I do".

I think forming a small council on pvp would be an excellent idea. What would the qualifications be, I wonder?

I also think that some issues would have to be 100% off the table, for example:

- Any mechanics that change the 100% consensual pvp aspects of the game
- Permadeath
- Mechanics that can easily be exploited for griefing

 

We lost valuable time to fine tune combat mechanics and pvp design. That's frustrating, but understandable with the small development team. But as we move forward, what's concerning is that PVP appears to be unplanned for. They've had years to think about it, and it's clear they really haven't. Not like they have the economy and housing, and other core elements of the game. That's disappointing. I feel like PVP deserves more thought and inclusion in the game development.

You're exactly right. There needs to be meaningful opportunity, not just between guilds either. I'm never joining a guild. This is a question that I asked over and over again during the 12 hour telethon and it never got officially asked or answered. How are they planning to balance PVP for solo (read: non-guild affiliated) players? PVP is not supposed to be a 1 vs. many activity. (despite what some of the peanut gallery may claim)

 

I was most sad to hear shardfalls won't feature full loot, really thought that would make it

So let's hope for the ability to set full loot to a pvp town however unlikely it is Christians have this thing about hope thought I'd try it...

 

There was a comment in the hangout that made sense in the fact that there are things that can be done after launch and things that can't. I think anything they did PVP wise would need to be adjusted or changed in some fashion anyway. I personally think that effort needs to be put into Selective Multiplayer Matchmaking to allow PVPer to be matched together and only together so that more organic PVP can happen. I understand the concerns on whether there will be enough players to allow this, but I think this is the only way to fill the gap some PVPers are looking for.

However, I think for launch it is combat and other mechanics that need to be focused on first as those are really some of the things that will negatively affect PVP. After launch updates can address other PVP issues or add additional features.

I don't think the devs are completely lost on the issue. There are just some issues balancing these things amoung the various groups in our community.

 

Kinda like town owners getting together and thrashing out ideas on POTs. The POT section of these community has been reasonably well organized in discussing the issues amongst themselves and getting feedback to the devs (I mean constructive feedback including lists of pros / cons / wants / needs etc).

There was a statement like that. If we are thinking on the same statement, then what they said was that Single Player questing is something that absolutely has to be in the game before launch (take note single players!!!!). However, they said that PVP was not as important as the single player game and it could in theory be pushed until after launch. They didn't say that it would be pushed, just that it had a lower importance / priority.

 

I didn't hear that in the telethon, Lord Hettar. I thought they said that their plan was for resources in the shardfalls to be full loot, which to me is an acceptable compromise. That is a form of full loot.

 

I would've hoped that they would say that PVP is no less important than any other style of play, even in the context of development. If they go to launch and PVP is bad, but single player is good...it may very well be entirely because of the lack of development importance/priority that pvp received. Since the developers control when launch is...that's not an defensible stance in my mind.

 

I understand why they push PVP global mechanics towards the end, but I really hope they put some PVP mechanics before launch... if they don't, lots of potential customers are going to be dissapointed. Some meaningful pvp needs to be in, no matter how green it is, because having or not having PVP mechanics upon release may be seen as a declaration of intentions. You can't release a game with some PVP and bring in lots PVP focused players (which they're appealing to).

That i can't deny... it seems they've been thinking about other stuff and then including PVP in, but PVP does not seem to be in their scope at the moment. But even though i have faith when the time comes, they'll listen to players. The only thing concerned PVP players can do is to keep giving good ideas

 

And that shallow dismissal of pvp and the lack of one single thing done for pvp in the 3 years so far besides the hopefully placating talk of future dreams about it, clearly shows the devs attitude toward it, illustrates perfectly just how insignificant it is to them and how little support and development it is going to get.

Thats all i needed.

Closed beta of Albion Online starts end of October early November, not that it matters of course but don't expect to see me around much longer (Can imagine alot of people breathing a sigh of relief already )

Thanks though, the communitys been awesome and the game definitely has potential elsewhere. (for the pve overlords. Well, so does 98% of the games out on the market, which is why its going to need all the potential it can get to thrive in the longer term, looking at you Wildstar, Swtor, ESO etc etc, but still.)

Have fun playing this as a multiplayer Sims game with monsters, i really hope for Portalariums sake that the novelty of this playstyle doesnt wear off once the novelty of release does. Although, on second thought, i kinda hope it does. See how it feels to be such a low priority

 

Love comments like these, and sorry but they are actually what hurts all your PvP arguments

"Reds" want to annoy "blues" is correct but it is also what hurts all the good stuff that is said about PvP, as "annoying" more likely turns into grieving.

And "Blues" just want to unravel what "reds" do - - well not even close Players, more than no,t really do not care at all about what a "red" does and just work to avoid them.

PvP is simply this Player v Player which give them the ability to fight something other than a AI. That in itself is one of the greatest parts of PvP a GOOD fight.

As for Sieges and stuff like that - YES complex game mechanics that encourage some kind of goal in PvP (Other than Loot, loot is NOT a goal / incentive) would be AWSOME. But more to this would most likely be planned / designed by Player (gust ball)

When all you PvPer get off the Full Loot, and Kill, Kill, Kill mentality and really work on the balance issues in Combat in general you can / will get good fights. Right now there is still such a sad imbalance it is laughable.

Chaos Crossroad has taken HUGE leaps into keeping PvP alive, good work.

 

I'm saying this as a person that wants good pvp in this game. Your reaction isn't helping or hurting this game. If it were as easy as just taking your business elsewhere, then you and I and many other people would already be elsewhere. People didn't (or shouldn't have) come here solely for the PVP.

This game is more than that. And while I totally agree with you that the development time and apparent focus away from PVP is disappointing, stomping off while saying "good day to you sir!" is not going to make it any better. We all have to ask ourselves, are we a part of the solution or are we a part of the problem?

It's my feeling that many of the people that love pvp (and I'm not pointing my finger at you here Whiskiz) are very slowly realizing that we lost the MMO development war sometime after EQ and WOW started to make tons of money.

But instead of thoughtfully crafting our message and working to develop a consensual standard of pvp that did not revolve around griefing or at the very least mechanics that got us into this mess - we (collectively) spend time making pvp threads about "how great UO was" and "full loot permadeath!" etc, etc...

We need to evolve past this. I don't know much about Albion Online, but I do know that if open pvp full loot hardcore that's all that matters mechanics was going to be satisfying to me then I would be playing Darkfall Online or Mortal Online or Life is Feudal, etc. etc... These environments exist, but they have no soul. There's no story, there's no interactions beyond "join us or die", there's no real exploration or social value. In a sense these games are weird mashups resembling an an FPS with an RPG skin.

So of course if you would be more satisfied somewhere else, go and be happy. Or maybe stay and see if you can make a difference.