Your thoughts on item-leveling

I was fortunate to be involved in UO from very early on and see it's transition from day one until many, many years later. I can't help but see some of these impending game systems through the lense my experience in UO. With that in mind I had an idea I wished to share.

I wanted to get some feed back on the notion of individual items leveling and increasing in usefulness to an individual. These items could act as a hedge against always seeking bigger, better, newer items. They could also be seen as a short run progression for newer players or established players who were in-between larger accomplishments.

These items would be use-based of course. Durability could still be a factor, resulting in items that could become trophies at 1/1 remaining durability point. At which point they could be named only once and was unique--and spelled correctly. They could also create a connection for players that was a little more personal, because they used an item for a long stretch of time and became attached to it.

This idea could easily be further developed, but as it is, it seems pretty worthwhile for discussion.

 

Going off of this idea...

Would 'better' weapons (rare ores or master work) level at different rates?
Would different types of weapons have different 'caps' to how much they can level?

Can you reforge damaged weapons at durability 1 to continue leveling them? My only worry is that it would really mess up the economic situation for blacksmiths. You start with a sword you get as a new player and never buy a new weapon, just level that one up forever.

 

There has been much discussion concerning weapons - but I don't have the links - some of the ideas revolve around not having a game centered on rare items; in part due to making a game that is more about skill and maintains player balance.

Weapon progression has been looked at as gaining "proficiency" at disposing a specific type of creature - for example if weapon A has killed 50 goblins, then the weapon may gain a +1 damage bonus against goblins

also - a "rare" may be special because it has a longer lifespan; less time between repairs and/or cost less to make repairs

I've played LOTRO and I must say that I don't like their system (it feels like a shore - not a game - a constant boring grind)

 

I believe the term being used at the time is 'weapon affinity' and if memory serves also acts as a sort of hidden skill whereby the user gains a small bonus the more they use that specific weapon. It's been a long time since it's really come up but I'm pretty sure that's how it works.. but I'm also pretty these aren't meant to be overpowering bonuses.

 

I remember the "weapon affinity" also. But I also remember reading or hearing somewhere that weapons/gear would ultimately degrade. So would the affinity apply to a weapon class or would the weapon degrade and need to maintained to maintain the bonus?

Anyone dialed–in better than I am?

 

Weapon of affinity it is - I don't remember the bonus fading but the quality of the weapon degrading; meaning that it will degrade at an increasing rate, needing increase frequency of repair and increasing cost as well, to a point where it would be wiser to "retire" the weapon. At least this is how i remember the discussion going

 

Those kinds of specifics were never given.. however.. if *I* were doing it.. weapon affinity would

1: Be weapon specific. Not all weapons are identical. They can have many differences despite falling into the same definitions ie: broadswors, longsword etc. Differences such as weight, hilt and blade designs.. width, length... When you're used to a specific weapon and then move to a new one you have to get used to these differences as subtle as they may be. For my part, this process would be the basis of weapon affinity.

2: not be affected by the state of the weapon so long as the weapon is functional. However, the state of the weapon itself could affect its base effectiveness. (Just not the affinity bonus itself).

It's very likely (I suspect) this idea hasn't been designed yet let alone implemented.

 

Those details came for RG in a video in a loose discussion; of course with the standard saying that things can change - it was thrown out there and then people started discussing it - it was really about how we can make weapons unique without falling into the itemization trap of many current mmo's, make them unique but not making them over powered - plus allowing crafters to play a role beyond just crafting - for example part of the crafting process would involve a crafter going to regions and killing specific creatures to enhance their weapons to be sold later on - don't take it from me, look at the threads

 

This topic is very interesting to me, but related mechanics that have been on my mind make me nervous about it. In one hand, I loved games that allowed me to advance my current gear, either through socketing, items like whet stones, the weapons own leveling system, forging it into a stronger version, etc. But I also am nervous about an implementation like this in SotA and worry how it might negatively affect some of the related mechanics that I am very much looking forward to (and hoping for) in this game. Let me explain...

Having items that advance throughout the game gives a better sense of character development and advancement. It makes it exciting when your weapons level up, or you find a better gem to socket, or you gain enough skill to reforge or better sharpen it to make it more effective. This type of advancement brings more advancement opportunities into the game, which is great. One related opportunity I see in this lies with the reduction amount of weapons available in MMO's... Too many are the games that offer stronger weapons at each level, and different variations at that level to customize your build, which in turn creates hundreds of variations of the same darn weapon. The fact that this game is being made with an attempt to get away from "spreadsheet management" makes me comfortable that we will have a more reasonable weapon set selection as well. So, having gear that advances helps reduce the excess waste in stat increasing purchases and grinding we all find ourselves doing regularly.

In the other hand. I have been long missing playing an MMO that offers a detailed and enticing player-driven market. Too few are the games where the items, gear, and tools are best when purchased and used when crafted and traded by players. The fact that this game is attempting to drive toward this is extremely exciting. RG took me back to good old memories when he told stories in dev videos and interviews about how players in UO would spend their characters life in trading, crafting, and the games economy, all without the consistent need of adventure to do so. It has been far too long that a game has introduced these "mechanics" in such detail that allow us to lead this type of character life style with detail. But I fear that if mechanics are added that allow the characters to hold onto their gear for more extended periods of time than they would if their gear did not "advance," then that is just a negative ding on the player economy, given the lessened need for replacing gear.

I know these two points contradict each other, which makes this a tough topic for me. Someone mentioned the "kill 50 goblins, get +1 goblin damage" approach, which I too have heard in dev chat. And although this is a very basic approach to advancing gear, and is not too advanced, I feel that this is as far as they should take it. It gives players a way to advance their gear through adventuring, and limit the amount of gear "resets" they would have to make through loot and purchases, but it also helps support an economy of buying, selling, and trading which could make this game all the more interesting and "immersive."

 

I think weapon leveling is an exciting idea because it would reduce/eliminate the need to constantly upgrade your weapon...On the other hand, I also like the system I have been hearing about the most which is weapons have no stats and it's about your own personal ability...Which is also exciting and accomplishes the same concept as weapon leveling.

In both cases it will not hurt crafters because: You still want those starter items to practice your skills (IE enhancement, experimentation)...so it wouldn't hurt the crafting community.

Grinds are something I would like to see limited to the bare necessities...(harvesting/practicing)

 

This kind of thing was done in DAOC with Artifacts.

The higher the item level the more abilities etc. it gained.

Honestly it was a great system initially as it breathed new life in to the game however it became irrelevant as further expansions came out with new items etc.

Gear progression is a massive issue when people aren't losing it i.e. items on corpse when you die - even in PVE your gear should fall with you.

Gasket.

 

As the weapon degrades, it would "increase the frequency of repair." But why would the cost of the repair increase? As a Blacksmith, repairing the durabilty on a weapon should be the same no matter what the current durability is (ie whether the base durability is at 45 or 10). I can't imagine"repairing" being that complex. Hmmm...unless you're refering to NPC smiths, no idea how they would charge for things.

 

Does the durabilty % lead to a lowering of stats 2 identical weapons a 80% sword against 100% should lead to 20% loss damage being inflicted.

The best item that a Crafter can make when they have mastered their craft should incorporate ore/wood etc from a few lower level tier of ore/wood etc so all the resources retain some value for Players as the game advances.
Your old weapon/item could become part of this recipe and if it works it retains its name, but possibly only about a 75% max chance of it working to make it a tougher decision to make.