Don't loot my armor and you might just stimulate the economy!

Would removing armor from the PVP loot equation stimulate the economy?

This isn't the question I hear while I'm out and about adventuring. I'm a solo player and I stay flagged for Open PVP and I spend 100% of my time in multiplayer. I get PK'd from time to time (rarely now, actually) and I join in with groups working CPs and I party with groups in PVP hot spots and join up with up other solo players in quieter scenes.

I'll jump in a party with a mix of PVP and PVE players and travel all over the map. And I do all this without much thought given to being looted because I spend time mitigating the risks. Even being PK'd at an ankh a couple times isn't that bad where loot is concerned - I'd lose practically nothing... but not everyone rolls the way I do.

What I do hear from other players all the time:
"Sorry, can't help - don't want to flag - wearing my good armor"
"Ohhh yeah, if I'd known we were going PKer Hunting I wouldn't have worn my good armor"
"Yeah, I'll flag, just let me roll home real quick and change out of my good armor"
"Sure, I can help - just gotta fix my inventory and change out of my good armor real fast"

My guess is that if armor that is being worn was removed from the PVP equation, more people would flag, more crafted armor would be thrown into the mix, more people would flag for Open PVP, more crafted armor would wear out and need to be upgraded/replaced.

Or just rewrite loot to mean anything you're wearing can't be looted plus a single trophy item (skull, hand, jawbone)... this could work too I think.

 

If PVP loot was changed to be some amount of coin, and handful (8-10) of your consumables (total, of all potions, arrows, reagents, etc), and a trophy, I'd say more would be likely to flag. The prices on crafted gear are horribly high, and only more likely to go up with scarcity of resources. No one is going to risk them.

(Heck, I've had folks who are not even flagged for PVP that will only use add-on or pledge gear, since their max durability doesn't decrease...)

 

I had no problems paying the reasonable ransoms I suffered during this pvp experient. More often than not they were between 200gp & 1200gp which I quickly paid and eagerly jumped back into the fight.

Once, I got a large hit and was looking at a 7500gp ransom for 3500gp worth of resources. That one stopped me in my tracks and took the fun right out of it. Fix this and pvp will be fun.

You could say the big ransom was my fault for foolishly carrying a large stack of resources but I'd suggest separating them all into 300+ 10 stacks would be very time consuming.

edit; meant reagents not resources /bonkself

 

Was gonna say, I run a +9 bow generally.. and the same armor.
It was a whopping 1200g the one time i lost it in the duel.
The only thing that seems to be alot is if it takes a bundle of Obsid chips or something.. ( i agree this should be adjusted.. as its easy to bypass, and more annoying then anything)

All in all, i think Duke Avery, that regardless of changes, anyone giving those kinds of excuses, arnt going to participate in PVP.

You can bypass the ransom system quite easily by splitting and carrying garbage.
Even if you DO get your *GOOD FANCY * armor thrown up, its usually not that much that anyone should be sweating over it.
I think the *in theory* is worse then the actual practice.

Im yet to even bother unstacking my stuff.. nevermind wearing gear.
That being said. if 5K is going to make or break your piggy bank, then i guess you should avoid it?


But im also in a differnt opinion about how hard gear is to get.. and *high end gear being worth* what people in owls head seems to think it is.


( example - My +9 bow , the people in owls head are surprised that its not selling at 13-18k, meanwhile i regularily give my doubles to guildies, or have them on a vendor for 5-6k )
And i also think people like to ignore how an adv level 20 can make 3-5k an hour, and exaggerate things. (excusing new people who dont actually know better, and targeting people with 500 hours in just being lazy )

 

loot dosnt bother me i just have other stuff to do than fight off randoms that seem to always attack on sight

 

stopping looting would enhance the economy in one way.
keeping looting enhances the economy in another way.
c hanging the loot process, like browncoat jayson recommended, would enhance the economy in yet another way.

as a pve player, i refuse to flag pvp because i hate the entire idea of looting.. that isn't the only reason, buit it is one of the bigger ones. - i think the third option i mentioned, would entice people on the fence to join the fray. maybe have a second level of pvp called pk or something like that, that enables you to be looted. that would work like this:

player A is pk
player B is pk
player A wins the fight, player b can get looted directly by player A, in the current setup with ransom etc.
note: reverse A and B, same scenario plays out.

player A is pk
PLayer B is NOT pk.
player A wins the fight, back end does maths and invokes rewards based on maths to player A, instead of taking gear form player B, it uses the master-loot-table at a high tier (closer to +9, than +1)
player B wins the fight, back end does maths and invokes a ransom for player A to continue to partake in loot and ransoming, etc.

in the second scenario, player A continues life as normal, with a simulated ransom/loot system that gives them the incentives to continue partaking in it. - player B continues life as normal, and doesn't ahve to worry about the stress of losing too much. which in and of itself, incentivises player B to continue being pvp.

i don't even see anyone being ostracised because they choose pvp or pve or pk, as NONE of it infringes on anyone else without them opting-in to it.

 

I'm not so sure id like PVP removing loot. Was thinking they needed to add disarm, for disarm thieves.

 

I changed the title... I don't want to remove loot from PVP - just tossing out the idea of removing what's being worn from the equation. Most folks I come across that don't want to flag or don't have time to flag use their armor as the #1 reason every time. Healers in a party... "sorry, can't help - wearing my good armor".

 

@Duke Avery what about adding an item like Obsidian Potion of Protection that can be purchased from an Obsidian Merchant for Gold GOTO... using the Obsidian Potion of Protection will allow you to flag for PvP but will protect or save you from getting looted when killed... (not sure if this is a good or bad idea though... just putting the idea out there... ^_^)

 

Anything that gets people over that initial uneasiness of being flagged and into PVP - I'm good with.

 

bleh.
If they implement the potion, then it needs to be 100% chance of something equipped. Not just an equipable.
Its already so easily avoided.. its frustratingly unrewarding to PVP.

Honestly im like 30 -35 PVP deaths .. and ive paid ransom maybe 3 or 4 times.
95% of the time its garbage from my inventory ( enjoy that rusty dagger)
Or the guy GIVES the stuff back, because most pvp'ers are awesome.

Either way..

 

There have been a few times that I wanted to check out a PvP zone while heading to another area, but always decide not to ... with the localized banking you cant just run to a local bank to switch armour, it has to be planned ahead of time before leaving "home-town".

 

This is what people that PVP already know... and sheep like me, this is what we learn after losing our armor a couple times. You, me, people that PK, people that are anti-PK, and other folks that are just dialed into the PVP scene know that with all that extra carry capacity you achieve while skilling up - you can carry a ton of crap equipables - just for the ransom system. I wear pledge/telethon/add-on store armor and use a pledge weapon - and that's a trick I picked up from PKers. After getting beat down and looted a couple times by the same players that are always asking about full loot - I decided to start wearing what they were wearing... "pledge starter armor."

I tried playing it fast and loose - and just rolling my character like he was part of the world - most of the time though, I felt like I was the only one putting anything at risk - me the sheep was the only one taking a risk.

These thieves that complain about loot - they're wearing add-on store armor or rolling naked - and you'll pull nothing but junk if you catch them and beat them down. Atos loves combat! He sure does - and he's just as micromanaging of his inventory as the PKers and pickpockets - when I pk'd Atos you know what I got from him? A jawbone worth 200g - this is the lead dev for PVP and he's taking ZERO chances with his armor. I didn't even keep his busted jawbone - I snapped a screenshot and returned his loot.

Guys do give stuff back - and they're generally not the ones newbs have to worry about - people rolling the PK circuit and here in the forums yelling about full loot all the time - moar loot - these are all the same guys that wear pledge armor - these are the guys that taught me SotA PVP . I just adapted my game and took the high road. What I'd like to see - I want to see people come to PVP and learn and enjoy it - and if that means making their armor off limits - then that's a step in the right direction.

Once SotA is full of awesome people that PVP - maybe then loot can get turned up a bit - but right now, it's a blocker.

 

ah... I see... they don't loose anything then... LOL

LOL... maybe he only loves combat but hates getting looted (like everyone else)... LOL

 

In shadowbane everything on your body, i.e. Armor, Weapons and rings etc. hadnt been lootable, everything else was FULLY lootable. This is a decent compromise. I prefer full loot though. SotA's current looting system sucks IMO.

// Armar

 

No because armor is worth like 200-400 gold only in ransom, no mater the enchants. Skull is 400 gold and whatever else you get. Dude. its nothing.






I dont get your point at all. Its hardly any gold bro

Lets see i have his entire set of armor, estimated worth like hmm 100k. It just doesnt add up. It comes down to the players who are majority are just really shy of pvp.

 

the way loot works in SotA - it freaks people out... here, let me math it out for you bro

serious XP spigot abuse + crazy skill progression + freaky armor decay + crazy time/money/effort to create armor + newb sheep syndrome + turds that rez kill newbs like a boss during pre-launch alpha testing phase + exploits + interest + playerbase = wtf

PVP only works if there are people doing it bro - if full loot would bring more people out for PVP, I'd support it. I PVP with a lot of different people and they most/all hesitate when it comes to whether or not they'll lose their armor.

 

Game Killer ... Thats basicly extra money you must pay for beeing able to participate in PvP. Better just do it like shadowbane, make everything "on the body" unlootable and make EVERYTHING ELSE lootable. Done. Or introduce full loot.

With _full_ loot your pledge armor becomes useless because its lootable?

// Armar

 

I have had the same set of armor for 3 months and its not broken yet. Still dont get it

If nething durability loss needs to be atleast tripled to get people to by new sets of armor. That is how u stimulate crafting and gameplay.

 

I wonder what would happen if Portalarium were to put in place a program where if someone were wearing non-lootable gear, if that non-lootable item were chosen by the random "ransom" generator it be substituted for a set amount of gold to be the ransomed "loot".

So for example , I am wearing full Founders plate, and using a Founder Halberd. Upon death by PVP, one of the random items chosen is my Founders Chest Piece. The Founders Chest cannot be looted or used as random, so the system automatically takes <X> gold from my inventory as a replacement for the Founders item, and sets gold as the replacement item to be ransomed.

I would also include that if the (non-lootable) item is being ransomed (even if it has been substituted for Gold), that item is unusable until the ransom is settled. If the person chooses to give up the ransom, the item is returned to the players bank. This simulates the loss of equipment that everyone else receives. If they pay the ransom, it returns to their inventory, just as if you paid to keep your lootable gear.

And, to avoid the loophole that I thought of, if said player does not have gold on them to be a substitute, it becomes a debt.
The player can then earn enough money before expiration to pay that debt, or earn the gold to pay the ransom.

The player due the ransom or items will get the gold specified at expiration/forfiture, or get the ransom money if it's paid.... But if the player in debt forfeits (or it expires before paid), they will receive no loot and no ransom from PVP until that debt is settled. So if they go out and kill someone, all ransom and/or loot would be forfeited and used to pay the debt, (items at the value it could be sold to an NPC vendor). I would also suggest a "debtor" debuff be placed on them, so all gold earned immediately be put toward the debt. (Loots from Monsters, sales, money traded by friends, PVP ransom/loot)

It doesn't help spawn-killers and such, but it would somewhat even the playing field of item loss so that there is something to lose for everyone, even if it's just gold.