Non-consensual PVP Now Possible

While I see the concern, I chimed in to say that this is only the very first iteration of a new mechanic - basically only the UI.

How many times did we see mechanics changed after initial feedback and adjusted during ordinary iterations? Why so many pants are tied in knots already, some actually talking about boredom in a mechanic that's been only announced? How can be boring something you didn't even try? Baffles me, as usual.

As of now, consider guild wars as "shortcut to flag all guildmates at once": for now its only reason to be is to save countless trips to the confirmatory, if you want.

Don't fret already.

 

I'm not saying that I agree with the current design. I don't.

But after reading the quote above I thought differently about it. If you have a huge economic advantage because your guild had 500 crafters and only 10 warriors that will engage in pvp, it seems kind of disingenuous to be able to get the rewards of the economic advantage but then only go to war without the liability.

I still think concerning guild wars you should be able to run them like pick up basketball games. "Here's are best 5 guildmates, we'll take on your best 5 guildmates. To the victor go the spoils." That sort of thing. But there are some questions to be asked about balance overall. There's a certain amount of guild strategic management that should be required here I think.

 

I may be way off base here, but this mechanic does seem very silly. If 2 guilds accept a war between each other, they should be flagged for PvP only to the opposing guild, not everyone in game. The only possible reason I can see for doing this would be that it's much easier to implement from a developers point of view than to put in a real guild warfare mechanic.

As for the guild leader making the decision to go to war for the entire guild, I totally agree. If you don't like the decision, just leave the guild.

 

The way being flagged for PVP currently works, any player that is flagged for pvp is technically open to pvp by anyone in the game regardless of if that person is flagged.

So welcome to how PVP works! It's a stupid system and they never should've implemented that to begin with. But it's funny to hear people say that it's not good for Guild vs. Guild. Some people have a little different opinion about the mechanic when it impacts them directly.

Some of the same people that said "oh yeah this makes total sense that I should be able to opportunistically attack people when I'm not flagged for pvp" are now saying "wait a second, it's not fair that everyone in the game can attack us just because we're flagged pvp. We want to control and know who we're fighting against!" Classic.

Maybe this will be what's needed to change how the pvp flag works...finally.

 

This might be the ideal, but with the way this is designed currently it will just cause guilds to split into a main guild and a subguild. All of the crafters and probies will go into the subguild, and the main guild will be the ones engaging in wars. The crafters stay safe, continue to provide for the main guild, and warfare will remain broken.

 

Interesting topic! While I personally have no problem with my guild leader taking this decision (I have both trust in him and I don't mind being open PvP), I understand that this can be a point of concern. The game has been / is advertised as consensual PvP. And you're being asked to confirm your decision before opting into PvP even if you're trying to enter a scene that 'forces' this play-style on you. So the game should ask you if you want to get involved in warfare as well when guilds are concerned. If you deny, you should be removed from the guild. It is rather strange to simply go flag open PvP in a guild vs guild war as well. I hope this is going to be adjusted in the further iterations of the system.

 

Well said!

 

Exactly. It's a system begging to be gamed. From my point of view the kind of implementation advertised is too forced. Maybe the work has been focused on some kind of ranking that's desired by some, but i find that even for a first iteration of the system, some kind of selective flagging is needed.

 

This brings up a topic to me. If people can stay in the same guild and flag pvp of/on, then will the people that are not flagged in the guild be able to get the guild war rewards? The pvp items?

 

A simple dialog box would fix all of this. Guild leader declares war, guild members get a dialogue box asking if they want in. Once u choose, u cannot change your mind. Dialogue box goes away after x seconds, anyone who hasn't chosen is not involved.

 

Which rewards? I assume the rankings will be by guild, so you'd still get that (unless you split into subguilds for protection). If they are items, then they will be tradeable since the Devs have said all items will be tradeable; I'd expect most guilds will pool them and distribute them via some DKP-type system, otherwise it will be hard to maintain a strong support group.

 

I remember something about pvp vendors or such. Guild vendors maybe? Unique merchandise?

 

Isn't a system where two players (or guilds) fight each other for rewards completely exploitable? I don't think that's the plan. I think they have guild plaques or something. But probably not pvp items. Maybe later guilds can wager what they will bet that they can win. But this would come out of their own pool of resources. I think that's a fair system. It's all still very clinical though. Not a lot of politics or intrigue involved in guild warfare of this level.

 

to bad there is a minimum number of people for one to wage war. As a guild of one you cannot wage or be waged upon.

 

Honestly at this point I have no clue what to expect. Everything seems turned on its head.

 

Obviously the OP has strong feelings about the potential of being flagged PvP without his consent.

I don't see how allowing guildmembers to opt out of the guildwar ought to be all that difficult (obviously repercussions from that choice may be incurred -- depending on your guild! ).
That would allow each person freedom of choice which I thought was important to all of us?
jmo

 

So the guild war system just flags everyone in the guild as open PvP?

 

I think its important as a guild leader to state the intentions before hand when a person wants to join a guild. I also think its important for a person to ask these questions before joining a guild. The problem is that many people (and its not a prblem persay overall) started guilds way before mechanics where covered for these scenarios. This might make some hard decisions going forward. But non the less the setup wont hurt any new guilds forming in the future as these questions can be asked. So its only a problem for existing guilds.

 

Simple solution:
After war has been declared and accepted, issue a 24 hour timer before the war is active. In the meantime send notification to all relevant parties.

Then members can choose to leave before they are flagged for PVP and the war begins.

 

If you have people in a guild opt out of guild war, how will you know exactly what your up against when deciding to war another guild? You would have to have a window showing guild war capable members in the guild your warring. Otherwise you could be warring a guild you see all over the place with 500 members and your guild of 20, and end up havin 20 pvpers lookin for only 2 opted in guild members.