Create Moongates already!

Discussion in 'Archived Topics' started by Hurricane, May 1, 2018.

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  1. Hurricane

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    I have, what I didn't do is a time study traveling from one end of the continent to the other. I have a feeling it's longer than a 5 min run however I have been wrong before.
     
  2. Cora Cuz'avich

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    Depends? I think you can get from Aerie to Owl's head on foot (and boat, I suppose, to get to Hidden Vale) in less than five minutes. Maybe not at AL1, though, since movement speed increases from skills are a factor. I'd add a minute or two for any locations that involve an adventure scene.

    I wish the devs would stop trying to "encourage" regional economies. It seems to justify a lot of unfun mechanics for a goal that will probably never happen, short of ditching the overworld map, or reducing overworld moment to a bare crawl. I live in Longfall- if I want to go shopping in NM/NBM, it takes less time to get there than it takes me to go anywhere to shop IRL. I believe the closest we'll ever get to regional economies is town economies. I prefer to shop in my town, but currently, there's only a few vendors that regularly carry things I want to buy. Once I have to go to the overworld, it doesn't matter t one much if I go one town over, or the other end of the continent.
     
  3. Santa Clause

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    I think there's a way to encourage regional economies but still make it easy for people who don't want to be traders to travel the map a bit more efficiently. They just need to restrict movement of goods / things to be sold - not players who maybe just want to follow the story.
     
  4. Bowen Bloodgood

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    Gates on the overland map probably could be better than instances. I think it's a bit of a toss up. Personally, I think it was a mistake to include 8. It used to be 3. As far a permeant gates go.. and I acknowledge most people probably won't care about this one.. is that in Richard's games there has always been a total of 8 fixed locations in the world. If SotA maintains this limit than what are they going to do in future episodes when new lands open up? Novia is 1 land mass in 5 or 6?

    Fast travel doesn't have to be just gates though. It may interest you to know that other forms of travel have been talked about by the devs. However those have always been something to include 'later on'. I don't expect to see anything until EP2-ish.

    Yes and no. 5 minutes is more like an average I think.. but that does include going through at least 1 control point. Those being Tier 5 is a little misleading. Eastreach Gap for example by default has tier 3 mobs even in the central area despite being a T5 zone.. however, there's also a gap in the mountains to the east that technically isn't a control point.. it has a troll encounter but it's a much smaller zone and can sometimes be avoided.. troll isn't always there or can be snuck past. Entering the central area you can go through Hilt which is a T3.

    Technically you can get past.. oh what's the other one I keep forgetting the name.. going up into Dracvald.. anyway if you're willing to risk it you can go through Blood Bay which is just a matter of knowing which boat to take to which dock and then immediately catching the next boat back.. so you're only in the zone a few seconds.

    They did increase the overland movement speed a bit with release but I did remember timing myself from Ardoris to my town on the northern coast, running through east reach.. was about 6 minutes I think.
     
  5. Bowen Bloodgood

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    It's possible to bypass the control area in that zone though by jumping up and over on the rocks.
     
  6. Bowen Bloodgood

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    The biggest obstacle to regional economies is players. If they really want that to work than they need to build a responsive NPC economy which they seem bent on not doing in favor of the "player driven economy".. "player driven" end "regional" are simply not very compatible in my opinion. There are ways to do it but I don't think Portalarium is willing to work on a complex system and they seem happy with their numbers. :p (Not to get too off topic here except it's related to why travel is set up the way it is)
     
  7. Hurricane

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    I have no idea what they have planned for the future so all I can use is what we have now, remember this is the game, it was released so they can't hide behind the Beta anymore.

    I would love to hear from players that run a business on here to jump in but in the mean time
    Lets work an economic scenario between a Hidden Vale Owl's Head shop owner & Longfall Aerie shop owner. How would a "Regional economy" work for these two player.

    getting my thought together for this one...
     
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  8. Cora Cuz'avich

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    @Bowen Bloodgood That is true. Giving it more thought, even if it took an hour or two to get to the next region, that would just increase the profitability of selling say, Longfall goods in Regalis. So you'd still the same goods available everywhere, just maybe fewer vendors doing so, and with higher prices.
     
  9. Hurricane

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    If you have a trade guild with enough members I guess you could each run around and check vendor prices for goods, what they are buying and selling price wise and move goods between the members from region to region.

    Or at the very least keeping detailed vendor activity information would be most important for any group of players getting together for business purposes.

    watch the market, buy low sell high.
     
  10. Bowen Bloodgood

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    I think Portalarium has always hoped that regional markets would be an emergent property of the player economy if they established things like control points and limited teleporting to prevent mass transporting of goods. Which, in theory, could work. Unfortunately, it likely never well. For the simple reason that the world just isn't big enough.

    Even with control points, those control points must be passable by lower level players. There's simply no other viable option. Then, there's not really enough of them.. and travel time on the overworld from any two points is just too short..

    I live and operate on the northern coast. I mine silver in Elysium.. It's hard to get two places much farther away than that. Even overloaded, I have no trouble getting that raw ore back home from Elysium to North Paladis without teleport. A 5 or 6 minute hike just is not enough to effect market prices.

    Another challenge is the lack of a real standard. Players charge whatever they feel is worth their time.. but there's no official standard to price off of for any one thing. Not really. The variance in prices I would argue, negate any regional differences.

    Now my EP5 will the world be big enough? Questionable.
     
  11. Nog

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    As a newer player who wasn't involved during the long kickstart development process, does the centralization of the market surrounding Brit come down to the fact there is a steep learning curve to shopping in a timely fashion?

    Like I have barely a clue what vendors might be scattered all over the slew of towns that aren't Brittany. And the amount of travel time, choke points, a few loading screens, entering a town that I discover is nearly empty, vendors that do not have a naming convention that makes it clear what they sell, etc. are all factors that make shopping unappealing time-wise.

    I suspect there are a few shopping sages who have a great deal of knowledge in this arena - and I don't want to suggest something as dumbed down as a central auction house type system that hedges all the advantages to buyers and results in annoying sellers uncutting by 1g - but shopping has been noticeably time prohibitive for me thus far. It makes sense to me that players have attempted to mitigate this somewhat with centralized vendor towns.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2018
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  12. Cora Cuz'avich

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    I don't think there's any way around that, which is mostly why the market towns sprang up. I do pretty well in my store in a POT, because the town's location gets a lot of traffic, and we've had a number of people settle there. But I probably get nowhere near the level of sales somebody with a merchant in NBM gets.
     
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  13. Hurricane

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    The big town that have been settled when SOTA went persistent reminds me of Luna in UO.

    When Luna came into play all the vendors owners moved to it.

    that's the problem I see with this Economy, How would I get people to my vendor way over in nowhereville selling the same items people have in the big city where everyone is.

    I would have to undercut the city vendors by a large margin just to entice people to shop at my store.

    with the restricted travel from one region to the next as explained by Nog why would I bother traveling around.
     
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  14. DeadnGone

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    I respectfully disagree with this mentality. Sometimes players want to get from point A to point B and want to do it now and not screw around wasting time. No, it's not unreasonable for people to want to spend their time efficiently. Not everyone has endless time. Add to the fact that after you've done this hundreds of times it gets pretty old... fast. There is no reason whatsoever not to have fast travel in the game. It only servers to annoy most players. Those that want to take slow walks through EVERY bit of content as they wander from point A to point B... hey, more power to them. But just because you play that way DOES NOT mean it is the correct way to play. It does not mean that way should be forced on everyone else. Plenty of threads in these forums where people think their way of playing is the "true" "golden" way to play. I couldn't care less about all that.

    If you want to play that way. Awesome. You do that. But don't restrict everyone else's options. If you don't want to use it... then don't. At least let others do so. We're not talking about a game breaking mechanic here. We're talking about a "quality of life" mechanic that helps keep the game fun and not a monotonous time sink. As far as regional economies... yeah that doesn't appear to be happening. We have dead areas and we have the primary hubs of the community. At least with fast travel around the world the dead areas wouldn't be so dead, yet they still need more reasons to go there (places to explore/adv/dungeon crawl, etc).

    It is a minor portion of the population that believes there shouldn't be all this instant/direct travel. The minority should not hold back the majority. I am not saying everyone should be forced to do it this way or forced to use the moongates, runes, scrolls, whatever... but there should be the option for the players. Then check and see how many are using it and see how the world is affected. People used to think eating anything RED was bad for you too.

    Oh, and btw... it takes far more than 2-3 minutes to travel across the world. Hell, even with coconuts. Don't forget about the zones you gotta go through (passes/control points) or mobs deliberately blocking your way (troll twins for example). But then again, who really wants to wait for 15-60 minutes for a moongate to open to a location that maybe be "somewhere" near you want to go? I hear pretty much everyone arguing for fast travel and ONLY... ONLY... hear about stuff like this from a few people in THESE forums. Otherwise its like a mythical pink unicorn with golden wings. So please don't go by the minority's opinion only. Poll everyone logging in or with emails to old users and offer some incentive to respond and you will see clearer picture. Most people don't even bother with forums nowadays due to trolling or angry responses from critics who disagree with their view. Keep that in mind as well.
     
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